Touching the Lordbs Anointed

[wilma (wilma)]

This is an excerpt from the book Healing Spiritual Abuse regarding “touching the Lord’s anointed” :

“Any appeal to authority based on position, title, degree or office is false. The only authority God recognizes and to which we should submit is the TRUTH.

Men (and sometimes women) who take for themselves “seats of authority” often feel the need to embellish their offices, positions or titles with additional “special claims.” They may point to their “unique calling, “ their “singular abilities,” their “great experience” or their “prophetic revelation” to back up their office or their position. None of these special claims necessarily has anything to do with true spiritual authority.

Another trick used to keep leaders firmly perched on Moses’ chair and above accountability is to refer to them as “the Lord’s anointed”. This supposedly means that they have been especially chosen and gifted by God and so should be treated with special reverence. The Old Testament command “Touch not the Lord’s anointed” is employed to protect these leaders from examination or criticism. This phrase, which comes from 1 Chronicles 16:22 and Psalm 105:15, is taken out of context and twisted to meet the need. When David uttered these words he was warning his men not to kill King Saul, whom the Lord himself had anointed with oil and the Holy Spirit.

David’s warning not to kill the king has nothing whatever to do with our treatment of church leaders today. Ancient Israel’s class system, with its hierarchy of kings, prophets, and priests, is abolished in the New Testament. We have one King, and the rest of us are priests who are all exhorted to prophesy. The exclusive spiritual anointing that came upon the kings, prophets and priests in the OT is now lavishly poured out on all God’s people. To speak of anyone as especially anointed like the OT leaders encourages an exaggerated awe of that person. It also implies a class system in the kingdom of God, where no such system exists.

If by appealing to position, unique claims or special anointings, leaders succeed in creating a hierarchy in the church, they can more easily control those beneath them. They can also defend themselves against any who might challenge them. “

As anyone who was a member of the Alamo Fnd can testify, Tony used this (touch not the Lord’s anointed) to try to scare people from questioning, challenging, or criticizing him.

Susie G

[wilma (wilma)]

I want to relay how this fear of "touching the Lord's anointed" affected my life for quite some time after I left the Foundation.

After leaving the Fnd in '96 we moved to Ft Lauderdale in '97 and visited with Ina occasionally. One day she mentioned that she was thinking of having a big BBQ and inviting Pete and I and also inviting Rebecca and Julie. I didn't say anything at the time because I didn't want to offend Ina. But I went home and thought more about it and then called Ina and told her that I would have to decline her invitation to get together for dinner with Rebecca and Julie. You see, Julie had done an interview for "A Current Affair" and she was seen as an "enemy" of the Alamo Foundation and as "touching the Lord's anointed". Of course, Julie had not spoken anything that was not true on that show...that didn't matter. It only mattered that she had spoken against Tony Alamo. Even though I had left the Foundation a year earlier and knew that Tony was guilty of many crimes and spiritual abuse, I still was in fear because of the years of mental manipulation. I was afraid to go sit and have dinner with Julie because of this....afraid that God would somehow be mad.

I thank God that in time He delivered me from these unfounded fears. And I thank God for those people who spoke out the truth about Tony his lies, while I was yet in the Foundation.
P.S. Julie and I have since talked and I think she's a greal gal! Rebecca and I are great friends and speak often.
Susie G

[jules11468 (jules11468)]

Susie G, you know the funny thing about the "A Current Affair" show was that most of all the interview that I did was cut out because Danny Hoffman started a big scene outside the WildChild restaurant, calling us whores, etc. and that was much more interesting than what we had to say about TA, so I guess I really would have been a bigger "weasel" had the whole thing ever been aired, ha ha.

By the way, you can come over for a BBQ anytime!
Julie

[windycity (windycity)]

hey, u all will be in a "big bbq" soon enough... can you feel the flames

[wilma (wilma)]

Thanks Jules,
As you know, just by being on Current Affair was all it took. In our delusion we thought you were an enemy of God. Not true! Tony is the enemy of God!! Yes, I'll take you up on the BBQ invite. Thanks.

Another person I wouldn't associate with was Jim Griffin because he had appeared on the news talking about Tony having Carissa beaten when she had an epileptic seizure. It took years for me to realize that Jim speaking out was the RIGHT thing to do. We're supposed to expose the evil works of the devil; not cover, ignore, and deny them. Well, since then, Pete and I have had some great times with Jim and Ann at the beach and in Nashville.

I just hope that other people who may have been out of the Foundation for many years but who are still having their thought life unconsciously controlled by Tony Alamo will realize that they don't have to be in fear of speaking the truth.

Tony Alamo is for sure NOT the Lord's anointed. From the evidence I've read, it's doubtful that he ever was a Christian.

Susie G

[wilma (wilma)]

I think Windy City just passed gas!! Sure wish he'd go somewhere else and do that.

[windycity (windycity)]

Wilma, you are not of the Lord. that is for sure. you are nothing but a flake. always have been and always will be.

[jules11468 (jules11468)]

Windy, is that all you can come up with? Calling people names? how childish. Surely you can get better lines from TA, I dont know you and I am sure you dont know me, but you sure sound full of hot air to me. The truth is sometimes painfull to take, I know.

[windycity (windycity)]

there you go again too...lying. I don't get my lines or anything from Tony. Thank you for proving me right..by confirming that you are a bunch of liars

[jules11468 (jules11468)]

You crack me up, Windy!

[rezleok (rezleok)]

Hey Wind

You're the flake! You're not even man enough to say who you are. No one is respecting you here. Just like your god Toni alamo, you are shrouded in cowardice, secrecy, lies and deceit.

Your speech bewrayeth you. Your tongue is like an adder. It spews forth poison and death.

Like your idol, toni alamo, all you can do is name call. You don't even address the issues presented to you. That's because there is no counsel against the truth. You can only respond in childish name calling. Your intelligence is limited, obviously, to somewhere in your lower anatomy.

Why don't you go pass your putrid gas somewhere else? Better yet, just go away.

[smitty (smitty)]

Windy: you called Tommy Richards a good brother in the Lord. Do you agree with his principles on Polygamy, Slavery and Statutory Rape?

[fooled_no_more (fooled_no_more)]

Windycity..

Hello. I have never addressed anything you have said before, but I find it time that I do.

I was wondering: Are these flaming remarks of yours, the best you have to offer? Is this your testimony before the Lord?

Say I were a babe in Christ or someone who desires to know Christ, looking for information and I stumbled upon this board in search of some answers.

There are folks out there, who do not believe and they use examples such as yourself, as their reasons. "Where's the love and compassion Christians are supposed to have?" "If this is how a Christian treats others, then I am better off doing (whatever). At least I am keeping it honest."

Those are just a few of the reasons I have heard non-Christians give as their reasons not to serve God.

Look at the poor examples, you being one of which, I am sad to say, needs to spend some time on their knees, in prayer, and less time, on this board, being an instigator and just all-around vexing spirit.

Are the words that flow from your heart with such venom, glorifying God, or edifying anyone?

Or do you think that the 'net is invisible to God, and therefore, not being recorded?

You don't have to agree with anyone here. You have a right to think as you choose; to serve whomever or whatever (ie: TA) you like.

But if you truly, sincerely love the Lord with all your soul, all your might, then do you think the majority of the things you have posted on this site, are pleasing Him?

What you spout off may please Tony....he loves it when folks jump to his defense.

But alas, serving Tony and serving God, are not one and the same.

How I pray you one day wake up and realize that.

[iasmann (iasmann)]

Windy,

There you go again calling people liars for something they didn't say. Jules said she was sure that you could get better lines from Tony. She didn't say you were getting them from him now. You need to get a better grasp of the English language. Sounds like you were educated at the "Holy Alamo World Pastor's" foundation school.

(Message edited by iasmann on December 03, 2005)

[windycity (windycity)]

ian, do you have anything better to do than to play word games? just wondering. I know Satan is good at twisting things too so is that where u got your education? Instead of being on this board and playing your little games, perhaps you should be concerned with young Scott...troups are dying by the dozen over there defending ol'Bush's oil.

[iasmann (iasmann)]

Unfortunately,

I did get some of my education from Satan's servant the self proclaimed "Holy Alamo World Pastor." So I know more about lying and twisting things than the average person. I have seen it done by the best and most blatant.

I can't remember how many times Tony would dictate something to go into a tract. I would write it down word for word and many times even tape it. But when the tract came out he would deny ever saying it and call me a liar to my face. I confess with shame that I never stood up to him. I was like you Windy City. I had more fear of Tony than I did fear of God.

One of the first things I did after leaving the foundation was to repent. I went to a church in Arlington TX. The same one where the Lord later told me that Tony was just another Judas. They didn't even have an altar call that night but I told my wife I'm was going down to the altar to repent for all the things I did do and shouldn't have and didn't do and should have while I was at the foundation.

I went to the Pastor and he prayed a prayer of repentance and rededication with me. The Lord heard and forgave me. Praise the Lord, I know I'm saved not just by the spirit he has given me but because I keep his commandments.

Rape, lying, adultery, fornication, kidnapping, stealing and homosexuality are all against God's commandments. Witnesses have testified that Tony is guilty of all these things. That's how we know he isn't saved even though he writes long dissertations in the letter and not in the spirit of God's word. How could he? He denies the Holy Ghost.

[saved_21570 (saved_21570)]

People... MEN like scott are defending FREEDOM!
With out which you would not be able to post your garbage!
So say thanks!

abby

[pobox398 (pobox398)]

For you windy http://www.factnet.org/discus/clipart/blush.gif
(To the tune of “Peter, Peter, Pumpkin-eater")

WindyCity,
WindyCity,
t.a.’s wonder-posting dity!
posting lies he shouldn't tell.
Has no shame, poor WindyCity.
And you know what’s more the pity?
He may well
wind up in hell…

(Message edited by pobox398 on December 03, 2005)

[windycity (windycity)]

Freedom??? Are you really that stupid? I guess you believe everything you hear. It is not about freedom at all.

[theguests (theguests)]

Be sure it's true when you say, "I love you." It's a sin to tell a lie. Many hearts have been broken just because these words have been spoken.

[smitty (smitty)]

Windy: There is another point here that either you are missing or choose to ignore.The one thing that we all have in common is that we were former members.If one took a poll they would find that we probably differ on politics, theology,ect. The reason we all agree on Tony is because we either have experience first hand or have seen evidence that would support those that witness such things. In addition, your defence of Tony also squares with what we have experienced while under his influence.

In your case, everybody who follows Tony HAS to agree as to teaching and doctrine, or else their out. SO once more, Tommy Richards has gone on record that Polygamy, Slavery and Statutory Rape are godly doctrines taught by Tony. IS THAT TRUE? You can either answer this or just come back with the usual personal slander and ranting. (I can guess which one.)Go ahead, give it a shot

[pobox398 (pobox398)]

Melanie & Danny Bottoms aka theguests
are you whacked?!

[saved_21570 (saved_21570)]

Ian, I really liked your post. We are saved by the blood of the lamb and the word of our testimony.

Your post should give a lot of people hope, who feel that they have destroyed their lives by listening to, or obeying Tony. You found a place where you could see The Savior, and all the curses fell off. Just like the serpents in the wilderness.

By the way, I liked the exposition on the Holy Ghost, also. I didn't even know about that heresy.

Your bro Tom

[safenowinspite (safenowinspite)]

Hi all, just popped in to say hi. Have been very busy but I wanted to give hugs to all. Hi ya Windy. How are you today?
Just listening to that beautiful song on the radio "You raise me up to more then I can be"....That song is awesome isnt it?
Its amazing, I struggled with so much for so long, even while in the foundation and just more recently because I was desperately seeking Jesus to hear from Him , He gave me the most awesome breakthrough. But I know that I know Hes still not done yet. From glory to glory. Peace all.
Carol Fryer

[windycity (windycity)]

hey Mrs Fryer

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

JEANETTE PLEASE CALL ME! GET MY NUMBER FROM JOEY! HE CAN GET IT FROM RICKY!

[wilma (wilma)]

Hi everyone,
Here's another good resource for info on various cults.....most cults have similarities to the Alamo Foundation in practice, of how they recruit and keep members (not necessarily doctrine).

http://www.csj.org/

The International Cultic Studies Association (ICSA) is an interdisciplinary network of academicians, professionals, former group members, and families who study and educate the public about* social-psychological influence and control, authoritarianism, and zealotry in cultic groups, alternative movements, and other environments. Founded in 1979 as AFF (American Family Foundation), ICSA took on its current name in late 2004 to better reflect the organization's focus and increasingly international and scholarly dimensions.

ICSA, the leading professional organization concerned about cultic groups and psychological manipulation, is known for its professionalism and capacity to respond effectively to families, former and current group members, helping professionals, and scholars.

Information on cults, cultic groups, psychological manipulation, psychological abuse, spiritual abuse, brainwashing, mind control, thought reform, abusive churches, extremism, totalistic groups, new religious movements, alternative and mainstream religions, group dynamics, exit counseling, recovery, and practical suggestions for those affected by or interested in these subjects.

ICSA also has an annual conference. In 2006 it's in June in Denver.

Susie G

[jewels81475 (jewels81475)]

Windy-

***It is God that sets the standard and passes the judgment. We simply pass on the information..Judge not-lest ye be judged, do you not see how un-Christian like you are being judging people, telling them their going to burn in Hell, those are words i've only heard come straight from the mouth of Tony Alamo (and a few other fire and brimstone preachers, but not so threatening as out of the mouth of Tony). I agree if I were seeking the Lord, which I am grateful to already know him, but if I were a seeker of a church to join and raise my family in you would definetley be a sure turn off for the Tony church! (whatever he's calling it these days).

[double_j (double_j)]

It been a while since I have really vented in a post, so I feel today t s time to do so.... so here comes another rant.......

First off let me start by saying I don't think I'll be able to do much posting any longer on this forum after today. The moderators for some reason have decided to ban my IP address, and its a pain in the •••• to try to get around it. (Thanks Alamo supporters or who ever complained to the moderators, you have won this battle but not the war.......Is your pig of a life that lame you had to contact the moderators? If you cant stand the heat, stay out the kitchen or in your case get back to making jackets or bangin' your old wrinkly perverted, cunning lying, stealing, pig of a husband Tony Asslamo.) Heres a fact that will NEVER CHANGE... I have stated this before and I will state it again..... back in the mid to late 80's Tony Alamo had children BEATEN BLOODY and I will NEVER stop letting people know the truth about that despicable abusive pig. He is (as I stated in some of my very firsts posts on this web site back in march of 2005) Tony Alamo is a GREAT CON ARTSITS.... problem is he like to abuse children, and for that I have a moral obligation, as should all you people to expose his BS.

Im sorry to rant, but something else thats is starting to really bother me here, SO MANY PEOPLE on this web site are now trying to be over the top lovey dovey its starting to become sickening.....Some of you people are as fake as I remember you being in Arkansas. Its sad. Cut the crap. If you were a p*rick to some of the kids that are now grown, don't sit on here and try to act like you never were a jerk or just a mean person (with the exception of Mike Borak cuzz I really honor a guy that can admit his role in something he took part of that was so horrible and then have the guts to apologize for the horrible things that happened to so many young innocent kids on the Georgia Ridge in Arkansas). I m sure alot of you are not going to like this post...TOO BAD.


Get back to exposing this •••••••• TONY ASSLAMO for what he has done to you,and if he has never done anything to you, then more importantly for what he has done to so many Innocent children. How can people who hear allegations of child abuse still defend some one with out ever questioning, wait .... could it be true? You Alamo supporters make me sick, weather your a big mouthed 16 year old seabag or a 85 year old dirty hag that never did anything with there life so they have nothing to retire on and have to depend on Asslamo. Your pieces of garbage and your sh*t stinks.

Don't know when Ill be back, cuzz Im sure someone will complain to the moderators about me being back on the site, spouting out the truth again. At least I know me and my family are safe, I hope yours is too, and for Christ sake, cut the phony crap out. Its obnoxious. Not all of you are doing it, but there are quite a few who are, so if you find yourself getting mad at this post, well then your probably one the ones I am talking about. Deal with it. Hey there Chris, Kimmy, Rattlesnake, Skeptik, Mom, Eric, Tammi, Jody, Holly, Simon and who ever else I didn't mention who (like myself) KEEPS IT REAL in this forum..... and doesn't do the kiss ••• thing on all their posts....seriously if your doing that, its very transparent and very obnoxious.

doublej4q97@yahoo.com

[summer4ever (summer4ever)]

This lengthy post can be taken the wrong way.
So let me clearly state that I am not condoning and/or condemning the behaviors below. I am just simply stating what these two churches have in common: Catholic Church and the Alamo Foundation.

Despite Tony's disdain for the Catholic Church, some of his views do coincide with their teachings. Maybe they could combine and call themselves the Catholamic Church? Wait, Tony would probably want his name first. So, how about the Alamolic Church? The name kind of has a ring to it, eh?

Both condemn abortion, birth control, and homosexuality.
Tony condemns birth control which he refers to as "killing children" (Tony’s tract, "Holy Matrimony"). One of the many items that changes in the church going from it being okay to it is a sin, murder.

Issue of celibacy:
The Catholic Church preaches for their priests to remain celibate.
From what I remember, women were always outnumbered by the brothers. So by Tony taking many wives, he is really leaving the brothers no choice but to be celibate (if they want to serve the Lord).

They both excommunicate members.

They both disagree with divorce.
Something has to be said about this one...
God must have made a HUGE exception for Tony regarding divorce. How many times was he married before joining the foundation? I believe the number is 3. How many times was he married since then? I believe the number is 5 (Susie, Birgitta, Elizabeth, Diana, and Sharon). That would make eight! And then since he started his polygamy spree, how many more times has he "married" and "divorced." Hmmm... Such double-standards... He is a walking marriage/divorce machine! But yet has the nerve to tell his followers that they cannot obtain divorces and stay in his church.

Priests molest children / Tony "marries" children.
At least the Catholic Church acknowledges this behavior is wrong. Tony justifies his perversion by calling it a "marriage." This demoralizes the very idea of marriage by calling his multiple forced unions to these children "marriages."

Members from both confess their sins to someone other than God (priest or Tony).
The foundation members even confess each other's sins to Tony by turning in silly reports on each other.
I remember all about it. I can even hear it now: She said this! He said that! She didn't go to prayer hour Tony! He chuckled while listening to one of your messages, Tony!
Only Tony knows what the correct punishment for this unacceptable and abominable behavior so we must tell Tony...
Heck, the foundation sounded more like an adult daycare at times than a church.

The Catholics request "mediators" to pray for them to Jesus.
The foundation members ask their mediator, Tony, for answers from Jesus for their questions.

When their leaders (pope or Tony) say something, it is considered to be directly from God.
Speaking of which, this reminds me of something... Tony told me that God commanded him to put out a tract every month.

=====

Hey Tony,

It appears that you are falling behind from what I can see on your website.
Or has God's Word changed to fit whatever suits your personal interests today? How God's Word has become so predictably unpredictable from your mouth!

Without your tracts and your messages, I don't think the world would survive. I mean, we know that people must pronounce the word "Hallelujah" correctly to enter the Kingdom of Heaven! A quote from your enlightening tract regarding this matter, "Let's Sing It Right," "This mockery to God's praise satisfies Satan because the Christian praises to God become null and void, having no effect, by the use of the word 'alleluia.'"
In all honesty, do you really believe God cares what accent/pronunciation a person has/uses when they praise Him? Hmm..

=====

This "world pastor" Tony abuses woman and children and commands others to do the same all in the name of God, but has the nerve to say that others are mocking God's praise because of their mispronunciation of words.

There probably are a lot more similarities between Tony and Catholicism, but I am not Catholic so I do not know. Just used things that were common knowledge.

And before the Alamoites go off and tell me how badly I have blasphemed the word of Tony, just remember this: I have already blasphemed Tony when I testified against him. And since blaspheming the name of Tony (telling the truth about him) is such an unforgivable sin, why not do it again? I have nothing to lose or gain by it. It is actually kind of fun this time around!

Jody

(Message edited by summer4ever on December 29, 2005)

[safenowinspite (safenowinspite)]

Another similarity....the Catholic church annulls marriages they dont feel are right....or they pay for an annullment. Tony just throws them away...lol

[jules11468 (jules11468)]

I am not defending any church here, as I do not attend any. But when I first left the cult, I went to a Catholic church mostly just to see what all the "hoopla" was about. I was expecting to see statues, foreign languages and mumbo jumbo, but what I saw was quite different. It was nice actually. There are alot of good people living normal lives.

[safenowinspite (safenowinspite)]

Jules, from what I hear , their services have changed alot...they actually talk about Jesus now. When I was growing up it was not in any english at all. You answered the greek the preist was reciting with a small sentence in a prayer book, never anything from your heart. There were also lots of statues. You also couldnt eat meat on Friday. You also had to pay to get your loved ones out of pergatory. you also paid for an annulment of a marriage you didnt feel was fair. I know because my first husband got one and I had a son and was pregnant with our second and he was abusive. amazing huh. But appearances have changed alot....dont know about the basic doctrine though....but I do know lots of catholics I feel really love God alot. So who am I to close the doors of Heaven on them...I couldnt if I wanted to. I always felt God judged the heart first . How do we respond to His mercy and compassion of sending His Son and drawing us to Him. Do we listen to Him and how do we treat others. Im learning more and more that I cant judge individual people by the church they attend.

[wilma (wilma)]

Jody,
I loved your post about the the similarities between the doctrines of the Catholic Church and the Alamo cult. So true! I can remember when I first had that realization and said Tony was like a protestant pope.

Julie, That is not to say that there are not some very God seeking and Christian people inside the Catholic church. I remember one day an ex-member said to me, "well, at least in the Catholic church, they let you go home". I have to agree......We could never take a "day off" or go on a vacation or vist our families. In the Alamo Foundation we were much more in bondage to Tony's every whim than people are to the Pope. Even the Pope doesn't control every facet of his followers daily lives. He doesn't tell them where to work or make them turn in ALL their money. He doesn't make them turn in "Ask the Pope" questions about who they can marry, or if they can buy some shoes.

About the birth control thing.....for years people were frowned upon if you had more than one child and told not to get pregnant. Susan Alamo made all the women go get IUD's to prevent pregnancy. Many of the women were sent with Tony and Sue's approval to get their tubes tied. Then in 1993, all of a sudden Tony starts preaching that women should get pregnant every year and that doing anything to prevent pregnancy was an abomination to God. The guy is a psycho and can't make up his mind.

Susie G

[safenowinspite (safenowinspite)]

lol Susie,
Thats so true. He changes his mind more then I can change socks. It usually has to do with what his body wants at the time.

[marty_s (marty_s)]

i think the reason tony changes his mind so much is because he is on some kind of prescription drugs. plus the fact that he is a paranoid schizo.lol

[electricguy (electricguy)]

Tony changes his mind because of the spirit that is driving him. And you know who I mean. I believe the man is possesed, and that is partly because of the deceiving power he has. The reason they said to prevent pregnacies was because of the cost of having babies. It was Susie that said it was costing too much for all the babies. They told us that if we had more babies it was putting a financial hardship on the rest of the members. When Elaine got pregnant with Emily she was put down for getting pregnant and harrased because of it. Much of what they changed their minds about was due to money. They were just greedy, that's all.
John

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

ya i believe i was concieved shortly after the iuds were banned....... anyways tony alamo is possessed with the devil lets not sugar coat it!lol he is an old pervert that would rather be with a man but is only capable at this point in his life to abuse little girls or woman who know no different........what a pathetic loser......i'd like to se how he would get a real woman/man in the real world! i know that he had homosexual tendencies at one point.........proving he is a perv.but only a jerk would beat another human being that couldn't physicaly fight back!

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

ya i believe i was concieved shortly after the iuds were banned....... anyways tony alamo is possessed with the devil lets not sugar coat it!lol he is an old pervert that would rather be with a man but is only capable at this point in his life to abuse little girls or woman who know no different........what a pathetic loser......i'd like to se how he would get a real woman/man in the real world! i know that he had homosexual tendencies at one point.........proving he is a perv.but only a jerk would beat another human being that couldn't physicaly fight back!

[false_prophet_detecter (false_prophet_detecter)]

HEY HOLDOL R U 27 OR WHAT?http://www.factnet.org/discus/clipart/blush.gif

[windycity (windycity)]

WHAT!!!!????? HOMOSEXUAL TENDENCIES???? YOU SAID THAT YOU KNOW THIS? YOU ARE FOR SURE A LYING, WITCH HOLLY. HOW WOULD YOU KNOW? YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW TONY!!!! THE LAKE OF FIRE AWAITS YOU.

[jules11468 (jules11468)]

Geeze, touch a nerve Windy?

[windycity (windycity)]

No, Tony is not a homosexual!! period the end!!!

[jules11468 (jules11468)]

Tony is a child abuser, rapist, poligamist! period the end!!!

[windycity (windycity)]

where are your facts? you have none. you go by hearsay. i have heard some stuff about you too. does that make it a fact? according to your twisted doctrine it would...but i don't go by your heresy. Tony has been going strong for 40 years now and many have risen up to attempt taking him down...well after 40 years you would think people like yourself would just mind your own business and let God do what He is going to do.

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

yes i'm 27........and i won't say how i know anything but my sources are reliable..........windy u love your master don't u? just like the hunchback loved his abuser.......just too dumb and scared huh?

[jules11468 (jules11468)]

I could care less what "stuff" you have heard about me! You dont know me! I don't proclaim to be a World Pastor, now do I? You are funny "people like yourself" Oh you mean people who expose the sick, perverted, child abuser, rapist, poligamist that TA is? You mean those kind of people???? I know, aren't they terrible???

[wilma (wilma)]

Windy,
How can you honestly, in good conscience before the living God that you proclaim to follow, defend a man like Tony Alamo?
You have heard from so many people that have either been victims of or witnessed child abuse perpetrated by Tony Alamo.
You MUST know about his many women and children he claims as his "wives" (sex partners, concubines, secretaries or whatever he's referring to them as these days).
Like I've oft repeated I was witness to Tony telling me that his current wives were Sharon Kroopf, Lydia Willis, Jody Fryer, Isabel, Mishael Jones Williams, Tami Hunt Sprinkle, Angel Streit, Elizabeth Guiterrez, and Jeannette Orlando. He also groomed many others to become his "wife" before and while he was still in prison...Shelah Decker, Eliza Vincent, Katrina Francowitz, Cindy Jo Francowitz (to name a few who had the good fortune to get out of there). Then there are those who joined his household since his prison release....Amy Eddy, Pebbles Rodriguez, Alys Ondrisek, Desiree Kolbeck, Jamie Rodriguez, etc. etc etc. (and the multitudes of little girls doing "school" at papa Tony's house)
How can you continue to ignore these facts and defend this man?? Whether or not he's a homosexual has little to do with these atrocities. But it seems like that is the ONLY thing you can defend about him.. So do we take that to mean YOU AGREE with his other crimes??
Please respond..... By ignoring my question we will understand that you DO agree with Tony's abuse of women and children. Do you honestly think that God is like that??
Susie G

[summer4ever (summer4ever)]

I do know for a fact that Tony is a child abuser, rapist, and polygamist. It is not hearsay. I lived it. I know it to be true.

As far as Tony being homosexual, I have only heard rumors, indeed just hearsay. I did not see homosexual behavior living with him for about a year, but I will not say he didn't partake in it when he was in prison.

I think it is quite absurd that someone would get so upset over Tony being accused of being a homosexual, but not a child abuser, rapist, or polygamist.
Being a homosexual (not a pedophile) is not a crime and involves two consenting adults. It does not inflict pain and leaves no victim. I am not saying it is Biblically justifiable by any means, just weighing the differences between these things.

Being a child abuser and rapist is a horrid crime inflicting great pain and leaving damaged and confused victims. It is attacking the physically weaker vessels that a man is supposed to protect.

By the way, Tony hasn't been going strong for 40 years. Remember even Tony sued Coie over his extreme decline in popularity:

"Alamo has filed a defamation suit against Coie seeking $3.5 million in damages-the losses to church businesses that Alamo attributes to her highly publicized allegations that he is a "grave robber." In his deposition this year, he also counted lost souls among the damages.
"We used to win a hundred, two, three, four, five hundred, up to a thousand souls a day," he said. "Now . . . if we get three or four or five souls a day, that's something."

Newspaper: Los Angeles Times
Article: Mystery Over Missing Body Stalks Alamo Lawsuit: His stepdaughter accuses the religious figure of spiriting off the remains of his fourth wife. His countersuit claims he has been slandered.
Date: March 30, 1992

Jody

[windycity (windycity)]

Is it my fault that you are such a damn busybody and you think you have all the "latest" if someone came and smacked you with the truth you still would not get it. I know that you are full of lies and heresy so you are the last person I would listen to. God is definitely not like you!!

[summer4ever (summer4ever)]

Windy,

What? I am not a busybody, nor do I claim to know the "latest." Why would you even think that? I speak from experiences that I have been through.

I do have to say living with Tony for about a year did "smack" me with the truth about him.

Jody

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

windy got mad about the homo comment because windy takes it personal seeing he is tony! few people have witnessed this homo side of tony but it has been witnessed! u see tony justifies having many wives through the Bible but how could he possibly justify his lust for men. lol bring it <font color="ff0000">•</font><font color="ff0000">•</font><font color="ff0000">•</font><font color="ff0000">•</font><font color="ff0000">•</font>!

[christophr19 (christophr19)]

You know.....Maybe the reason why phony a-lame-O gobbles up soo many little girls, is that he is trying to convince himself that what he did in prison did not make him gay??? He has to prove to himself that he is a ladies man and not really a mans' man. Lets face it! phony is sexually unsatisfied by a woman so he tries to get the closest thing he can to boys, which are sexually underdeveloped little girls. You see, he can't find a way to justify his being with a man, so he tries to convince himself that what he really wants are lots of girls.
Go ahead whiny, rail and scream at me. I really am not bothered by it, it kinda of makes me laugh.

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

tony liked men long before he went to prison.........believe me.

[false_prophet_detecter (false_prophet_detecter)]

actually tony is really a succubus (female demon)
that wasn't doing his job completely. some of the stronger demons werent getting satisfied. so satan
punishing him sent him to earth as a man. and the only way to get his female demon form back and his high ranking job he has to suck all of the energy from all the women around him. very soon now i think his true self will be shown to all and he'll be able to go back to hell where he came from. unless we can get him put back in prison.
who cares what windy thinks theres no hope for a fool cause they all ways fool themself without knowing it.
and of course tony is a homo but im sure he has a scripture (if not a million) to back up what he does. what a sad,strange,silly,little man

[helives (helives)]

Windy
Here is fact for you regarding Tony Alamo. He has given the command repeatedly to have children beaten bloody on Georgia Ridge. This is a fact! I saw it with my own eyes, and my children were victims of Tony's child abusing, beating bloody ways
sue B

PS: why don't you say who you are? I don't think you were in the foundation when Tony started beating the children and talking the little under age girls to be his wives.

[helives (helives)]

Windy
Here is facts for you. Tony Alamo took underage little 15 year old girls to be his wives, or concubines or whatever he calls them. He took them and had sex with them. Tony Alamo's own lips told me about his wives, and I ate dinner with them at the Peabody Hotel in Memphis Tn, and pictures of them all kissing him just before Tony, Jeanette,Lizzy,and Angel all loaded up in the horse drawn carriage to have a ride around downtown Memphis.

This is not hearsay- but fact, told to me by tony alamo and seen with my own eyes. Stop defending Tony Alamo. Yes he is going strong, but after who or what???

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

windy,ivy,alamosupporter,..........are tony!!!!!!!

[helives (helives)]

Hey Windy
do you want some more facts???

Tony Alamo had Harvey Crochran's Id stolen from a nursing home in Arizona, When Tony was arrested in Florida he had Harvey's missing ID. This is not hearsay, but FACT - also a matter of pubic record, tony alamo's arrest record!

Do you want some more facts????

What about Tony Alamo being sued by Matell, because he didn't have the permission to use the Barbie designs on Tee-shirts!!! This is not hearsay, but a matter of public record!

The Mattel Toy company has sued religious cult leader Tony Alamo and
two of his companies for having damaged the image of Mattel and
Barbie by marketing an unapproved T-shirt with a "religious symbol."
Alamo has been evading arrest for felony child abuse. Alamo Desigsn obtained
two licenses in 1989 to make and sell denim jackets with Barbie
images. Los Angeles Times, 6/25/90.


You want more facts regarding Tony Alamo???

[electricguy (electricguy)]

Hi Sue;
I need to talk to you, I'll call you later if that is OK.
John

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

hey windy since you won't answer any of the "accusations" about child abuse,rape,beatings, maybe you might feel so inclined to give your opinion about this.......what about tony keeping susan alaoms dead body in the spec house for months in hopes that she would raise from the dead? did u know her body actually began to decay and smell? what about it assmunch?????oh by the way she never came back to life did she? despite all of tony's prayers........too bad huh she would beat the crap out him for what hes doing now adays!

[helives (helives)]

Windy
Here is more fact-

Phoney almighty is a real piece of work. He is a liar, thief, child abuser, rapist, pedophile, polygamy practicing pervert, also a self proclaimed world pastor, who pretends to be so righteous and used of God. However we are here to shine the light on Tony's lying perversions!


Here is an article about Tony using the name "Harvey Cochran." He was able to live a pretty open life, pretending to be other people.

Newspaper: Los Angeles Times
Article: Alamo's Life as a Fugitive Was Spent Out in the Open Religion: Untraceable cellular phones and taped radio shows helped the fundamentalist minister hold the reins of his church and businesses while federal agents tried to track him down.
Date: July 22, 1991

"Although hunted across the nation by federal agents, religious cult leader Tony Alamo lived an open, if not completely public, life before his capture this month in Florida...

"But it was Alamo's high-profile lifestyle and reliance on his followers that ultimately led to his capture and may result in the end of his Holy Alamo Christian Church. A task force of federal agents monitored the gathering in Tampa of Alamo followers from across the country and then ultimately followed them to him.

"At the end of his run, the flamboyant preacher seemed surprised. Handcuffed and sitting on the driveway outside his waterfront home, he looked up at the federal agents who had just arrested him and said: "How'd you guys find me?"

"Divine guidance," he was told.

"Controversy has followed Alamo since the early '70s when he and his wife, Susan, began taking busloads of young dropouts, drug addicts and drunks from the streets of Hollywood to a compound in Saugus, where they were treated to fire-and-brimstone admonitions that included Alamo's anti-government and anti-Catholic beliefs...

"But the growth was accompanied by allegations that children were abused in the communes, that Alamo's followers were brainwashed and forced to work for little pay, and that he lived luxuriously off the profits. Alamo received widespread attention when his wife died in 1982 and he predicted that she would be resurrected. He reportedly placed her embalmed body on display in an Arkansas commune for six months.

"In 1985, Alamo's church was stripped of its tax-exempt status after the Internal Revenue Service determined that it was a profit-making enterprise. Three years later, the preacher with a penchant for Western-style clothing disappeared as Los Angeles County authorities investigated the beating of an 11-year-old boy alleged to have occurred at the Saugus commune. Authorities said Alamo directed the beating via telephone from another location.

"Now, in the wake of his capture, federal authorities are trying to document the holdings of Alamo and his church, collect more than $7 million in back taxes, and retrace Alamo's trail as a fugitive.

"Fuchs, part of a 10-agent task force that tracked and captured Alamo, said investigators believe that Alamo settled in the Tampa Bay area almost immediately after fleeing California.

"Authorities said Alamo had a core group of followers that helped him elude capture. Prosecutors have described these followers as bodyguards-"Christian soldiers" ready to protect their pastor with weapons, if needed.

"They assisted him; they protected him," FBI Agent Donald Geisler testified this month in a Tampa courtroom where Alamo was seeking bail. Geisler said former followers of Alamo have told investigators that the group has access to automatic weapons and that "Mr. Alamo and his bodyguards should be considered armed and dangerous."

"The contention that Alamo's group is armed or violent angers church followers. They point out that numerous searches have never turned up weapons on church property.

Albert Krantz, 40, a gaunt, soft-spoken former drug addict who credits Alamo with saving him spiritually two decades ago, came to Tampa last year to work with Alamo on clothing designs. FBI agents identified him as an Alamo bodyguard.

"It is completely and utterly ridiculous," he said of the idea that a phalanx of Alamo soldiers is ready to commit violence to protect Alamo. "I don't think anyone would consider me a bodyguard."

"Ray Arauz, a Los Angeles follower of Alamo who the FBI said is also an Alamo bodyguard, scoffed at such a contention.

"I am nobody's bodyguard," said Arauz, 41. "I have my own family to watch out for. This just shows the government harassment that is going on here. The whole thing is very unfair."

"Aside from the dispute over bodyguards and weapons, it is apparent that Alamo-nearly blind from glaucoma and unable to drive-was routinely in the company of several followers while he was a fugitive.

"Alamo has remarried and has a 9-year-old stepdaughter. Federal agents said they believe that the family moved often from house to house in the Tampa area. They say they have documented that he moved from a house in Madeira Beach, near Tampa, earlier this year when a neighbor complained to police about the large number of people who stayed at the home and the late-night comings and goings of the entourage.

"Billy Johnson operates a private postal box store next to the Big Time Discount hardware store that authorities said Alamo-using the name Harvey Cochran-opened in Pinellas Park, across Old Tampa Bay from Alamo's rented house. Johnson said Alamo made several visits to the hardware store each week, always arriving in a van with four or five other men. Alamo always carried a cellular phone, Johnson said.

"They did no advertising; some days they didn't even open," said Johnson, who became suspicious of his neighbor. "It was like they were in business but they didn't care if they got any business."

"The store has been closed since the arrest, and church followers have begun removing its inventory.

"Investigators said Alamo's frequent moves of his household and his use of cellular phones-which are untraceable-mail drops and numerous aliases were the chief impediments to his capture.

"The FBI said Alamo made calls from Tampa using cellular phones registered in New Jersey. This allowed him to frequently call newspapers and a Nashville radio talk show hosted by his brother, Dan Hoffman, without fear of giving away his whereabouts.

"As an example of how he tried to prevent his mail from being traced, investigators said Alamo sent tapes to be broadcast on radio station WRFA-AM in nearby Largo to a post office box in New York. A follower would pick up the tapes, then remail them so that they arrived at the Florida radio station with New York postmarks.

"Investigators said they know of at least seven aliases used by Alamo while he was a fugitive.

"Known as Harvey Cochran at the hardware store, his name was G. Elmo Justine at the waterfront home he rented in Tampa. After Alamo was arrested, agents found a business card in his wallet from a restaurant called Wild Child's in Temple Terrace, northeast of Tampa. The card belonged to H. Colling, general manager of the restaurant.

"Federal agents went to the restaurant and learned that H. Colling was Alamo, who had orchestrated the opening of the restaurant two weeks earlier, making all the decisions right down to the design of the restaurant's logo and menus. The agents also learned that several of the restaurant's employees were followers of Alamo's church who had moved to the area in recent months to be near their pastor.

"One employee is Jennifer Colbeck, a 17-year-old waitress who was born in Saugus and lived in Alamo church communes until she moved to Tampa this year. She said she came with her husband, John, also an Alamo follower and a dishwasher at Wild Child's. Like other followers who would talk to the media in Tampa, she recited, seemingly by rote, a denunciation of the pursuit and capture of the preacher she called "Papa Tony" while growing up.

"Tony's been my pastor all of my life," she said. "He is the only preacher I know of. He preaches the gospel and some people don't like that. They know he is telling the truth and they just want to shut him up. It's unfair. He's done nothing wrong."

"Investigators believe that profits from the businesses started by Alamo and operated by his followers helped the fugitive preacher finance new ventures as well as avoid capture.

"Johnson, owner of the shop next to the hardware store, said Alamo had expressed interest in buying his postal box business but was arrested before serious negotiations began.

"Harvey-that's what I knew him as-told me he was looking for businesses to buy because he had a lot of people to put to work," Johnson said.

"Alamo's high-profile activities were unusual for a federal fugitive, authorities said. They concede that had he divorced himself from his church and its followers, he might still be free.

"He thumbed his nose at federal authorities," Assistant U. S. Atty. David Jennings said. "Not until the task force was put together did he see that he couldn't keep doing that."

"The federal task force was formed in May after authorities received information that numerous Alamo followers were flocking to Tampa, said Mike Blevins, chief deputy marshal in Fort Smith, Ark.

"We thought that the probability was good that these people were going there because he was using Tampa as a hiding place," Blevins said.

"The migration of followers to Tampa had in part been spurred by the seizures of numerous church properties in Arkansas and Tennessee to satisfy IRS tax liens. A lien has been placed against the property in Saugus, which has been boarded up and unused for several months.

"Other properties were seized to pay a $1.8-million court judgment won against Alamo by a family of former followers who claimed that the preacher had abused children, alienated family members and violated labor laws. That case prompted more criminal charges against Alamo when he called up a Fort Smith newspaper and allegedly threatened the life of the judge who heard the suit.

"But some followers of Alamo said their arrival in Tampa was coincidental to Alamo being there.

"Rick Tiner, an Alamo follower for 20 years, said he moved there without knowing that Alamo was nearby. "Other brothers of the church said it was a good area to get a new start," Tiner said. "And I had never been to Florida before. I didn't know Tony was here until after I got here."

"Federal authorities have dismissed such claims, derisively referring to the gathering of followers in Tampa as "miraculous." Prosecutor Jennings said the followers came because they are part of Alamo's "nationwide support group, . . . people who would abandon their lives to come to Tampa to harbor him."

"Blevins said task force agents located many of Alamo's known followers by checking applications for Florida driver's licenses.

"That started nearly two months of surveillance of the followers as the agents waited to be led to Alamo. The plan paid off July 3 when agents followed a church member from the Big Time Discount hardware store to the Tampa neighborhood of Palma Ceia where comfortable houses line a network of man-made canals.

"The man they followed pulled into a driveway on San Rafael Street, where behind a sweeping front lawn stood a ranch house with a red brick facade.

"When the man left, the agents stayed. They secretly watched the house for two more days until the morning of July 5, when an overweight man with an unkempt gray beard and thick, dark glasses stepped out the front door and picked the morning newspaper up off the driveway.

"That's our subject," one of the deputy marshals whispered into his radio, a low-key report that signaled the end of Tony Alamo's run.

"A few hours later, the task force moved in."

[holdol27 (holdol27)]

windy knows all this because he is tony.........tony thinks hes smart by assuming different personalities on this board......such as ivy,alamosupporter and windy.........blah blah blah hello everybody!

[helives (helives)]

Windy
Do you still want more facts??? There are lots more to tell about

[beccasue1975 (beccasue1975)]

Windy City,

I have a question (or two...) for you...
WHY do you feel the need to protect, justify, and defend Tony Alamo? WHY do you care what anyone says about him? WHY does it upset you so much for people on this board to say what they believe to be true about Tony? Do you believe everyone on here just comes on here to lie about a man of God? After seriously sitting down and reading God's Word, have you ever lined up "Pastor Alamo" and his "prophesies, rules, beliefs, and dogma" with the Word of God? If you have ever sat down and read the Bible and if you, personally have a relationship with the Almighty then you must be able to somewhat accurately judge (at least in your own mind) the man you believe to be "of God".

Windy, who ever you are... I believe that the reason you come on here and so vehemently try to defend and protect Tony is because you are really a good person, at heart. I think you want to do what is right before God. I believe your heart is in the right place, but you are making a mistake. First and foremost, GOD is fully capable of defending and protecting His anointed. What I pray for you, is that your understanding will be opened as you read God's Word. I pray that as you read you will get a crystal clear picture of God and of Tony Alamo. You don't have to speak out against him. You don't have to admit to anyone what God shows you, but I beg you, ask the Spirit of Truth to give you supernatural revelation. Ask for a gift of discernment. The gifts of the Spirit are free and wonderful. The truth wont hurt you but believing a lie can hurt you.

In your quest to defend Tony, the man you believe to be God's anointed, you are hurting people in whom God's hand rests mightily upon. You don't know what the ramifications are, for what you are doing.

Please just consider what I am saying. You don't have to respond and tell any of us what you discover. I am only interested in your own personal growth and discovery.

Windy, I pray that in this new year you will know God in a more personal, more intimate way than you ever have before... I pray that this will be a year of break out blessings on your family and your finances and your spiritual growth. I pray that the Spirit of Truth will guide you and lead you and speak to you in your waking hours and in your dreams!

God bless you,

Warmly,
Rebecca