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speakword2004
07-01-2006, 09:40 AM
Targums were Aramaic interpretations of scripture made applicable and relevant to the audience. This is not a translation of Matt 23. Do one on yourself. It shows how much we can only come to Him by grace.

speakword2004
07-01-2006, 09:47 AM
1Then Jesus said to the Every Nation World Conference: "The teachers of the Word and the present-day foundational Apostles sit in Jesus' seat. So you must obey them and do everything they tell you, so long as you choose to submit to them. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They cause Christians to stumble, to question their own sanity. They cause others frustration, anger and despair and yet they will only address these things on their own terms.

5"Everything they do is done for men to see: They make their front row seats " reserved " and the praises for themselves and each other long and glorious; they love the place of honor at church meetings and the most important seats in the church building; they love to be greeted in the New Apostolic marketplace ministries and to have men call them 'Pastor' and Mr Super Hero of the Faith.

8"But you are not to be called 'Pastor,' for you have only one Master and you are all brothers. And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. Stop claiming to be the fathers of this ministry with your Morning Star Founders Club and your secretive Maranatha old school connections. Nor are you to be called 'teacher,' for you have one Teacher, the Christ. The greatest among you will be your babysitter. For whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted.

13"Woe to you, Super Apostles of the Word and Prosperity preachers, you hypocrites! You shut the kingdom of heaven in men's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to.

speakword2004
07-01-2006, 09:51 AM
15"Woe to you, translocal apostles, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea in first class to win a single church to your financial down line, and when they become one of you, you make them twice as much a sons of hell as you are.

16"Woe to you, blind guides! You say, 'If anyone becomes a saved one, it means nothing; but if anyone becomes a discipled covenant member of our church we now have someone useful and obedient.' You blind fools! Which is greater: the salvation of man, disciples of Jesus or the discipleship of church members to tithe and serve in your church? Your priorities are wrong.

23"Woe to you, indoctrinators of the Every Nation Leadership Institute and their leaders, you hypocrites! You pay your royalties, tithes and franchise fees. But you have neglected the more important matters of the Word—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former. 24You blind leading the blinded! You strain out a Bonasso, a Greg Ball but swallow a Nashville hook line and sinker .

25"Woe to you, elders, you hypocrites! You clean up the outside of the church with committees and slick PowerPoint presentations and weeping at Palm Springs, but inside you are still full of greed and self-indulgence. 26Blind Super Apostle! First clean the inside of the church leadership and its whole setup, and then the outside also will be clean.

27"Woe to you, webmasters of the good-looking professional websites, weblogs, you hypocrites! You are like repainted 19 80s BMWs from a second hand dealer, which look beautiful on the outside, but on the inside are full of rusty engine parts and faulty transmissions. 28In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness. People are not going to fall for that con job for much longer.

29"Woe to you, teachers of the word and Apostles, you hypocrites! You build websites, contemporary music sets, conferences for the prophets and hero worship the beautiful , athletic and politically powerful. And you say, 'If we had participated in the days of Maranatha we we would not have taken part with them in their theological mysticism, micro-managing controlling discipleship practices, and authoritarian leadership styles.' You admit to none of it. Your confessions are hollow. So you testify against yourselves that you are the descendants of those who abuse my children. Fill up, then, the measure of the sin of your forefathers!

33"You snakes! You brood of Diamondbacks! How will you escape being sent to judgement? 34Therefore I am sending you prophets and wise men and teachers. Some of them you will ignore; others you will ridicule in your churches and committee meetings and official communiqués. 35And so upon you will come the judgement, which will always begin in my house, the same way it did with Maranatha. I tell you the truth; all this will come upon this generation.

37"O Every Nation, Every Nation, you who kill my messengers, my little apostles. How often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing. 38Look, your church empire is left to you desolate. 39For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, 'Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord."

coppertree
07-01-2006, 05:49 PM
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Wow Speakword, well said and profound ! Thank you !}

dust
07-02-2006, 12:17 AM
Speechless....

speakword2004
07-03-2006, 01:56 PM
I've had one off site repsonse saying this is a bit strong. Others?

another_brick_in_the_wall
07-03-2006, 02:05 PM
i disagree. i think it is right-on. valid righteous anger.

40days40years
07-03-2006, 02:20 PM
Well I kind of get afraid of stuff like this but this is how EN leaders should be reading the bible which leads them to reform. But no reform or barely any reform lots of covering up. I tend to think the reform is coming from factnet and not EN leaders making their own Targums which even the humblest believer seems to be able to do in their mind when they read the bible but not them it seems. EN leaders just need to read the red <font color="ff0000">letters</font> in the bible and say is that me? is that my ministry?? does it line up with the red words of Jesus?

miltietoast
07-03-2006, 02:37 PM
excellent speakword

tamara_may
07-03-2006, 02:48 PM
Please pardon my ignorance, but what does "targum" mean?

tamara_may
07-03-2006, 04:11 PM
oops! just read the first posting on this thread &amp; my question was answered.

philiprosenthal
07-03-2006, 08:19 PM
Thanks Speakword. For myself, I found study and meditation on Matthew 23 was the single most important factor in my recovery process after leaving EveryNation. Previous to my experiences in my last 4 years in EveryNation-His People, I didn't really understand why Jesus was so harsh with the Pharisees. In reality, I just hadn't experienced real life Pharisees - so all Jesus attacks on them went over my head. I must credit the abusive hypocrites within the organisation with helping me to understand a chunk of the Bible I really hadn't done before. My personal Bible study notes on Matthew 23 now number about 100 pages. Some time I will get to writing them up and will publish on the internet. I had previously always just skipped over this section of scripture as something historical but not really for today. But on careful study, I found that this is the central and core passage of the Book of Matthew. It is Jesus attack on religious hypocrisy and abusiveness. As far as I have been able to find, Jesus the issue of 'Consistency' vs 'Hypocrisy' was Jesus second favourite preaching theme (the first being the kingdom of God). It is also the principal cause Jesus chose to take up in an aggressive manner. Interestingly he didn't focus his campaign on fighting pornography, abortion, homosexuality, Foreign Roman dictatorial rule etc - he chose to focus as his primary activist issue that of attacking religious hypocrisy and abuse (eg. also kicking the commercialists out the temple). This campaign against religious hypocrisy and abusiveness was what finally provoked his crucifixion. But how many preachers today focus on this theme? I don't know many.

lc_20
07-03-2006, 08:54 PM
I remember reading these scriptures a few years ago while my eyes were opening and thinking.... Are they studying the scripture to see how to behave like pharisees? It seemed like they were purposefully doing everything in this passage. Clearly, they had to be aware of these scriptures but instead of listening to the warnings they were behaving just as the pharisees of the past. It was a shocking thought. Where was their respect/fear of the warning and anger from Jesus? Could they be studying these scriptures to see how to be pharisees? That was a very scary thought for me a few years ago.

philiprosenthal
07-04-2006, 09:08 AM
EASY STEPS TO BECOME AN ABUSIVE HYPOCRITE / MODERN PHARISEE

LC20. No. The EveryNation pharisees don't need to study Matthew 23 to find how to misbehave. That is because each step downward in bad behaviour follows logically from the previous one. The steps follow logically in the order given by Jesus in Matthew 23:

* Step 1: Decide you are a religious elite better than everyone else. Your organisation is better. Your leader is better and you are better than everyone else.

* Step 2: Surround yourself with religious and material status symbols, like 'apostle, prophet, pastor' titles, different smarter clothing, big car, entourage etc to convince people you are better than them.

* Step 3: Forget about Christs kingdom and instead build your own kingdom, where you are the elite - ruling for Christ. Then shut people out from participating fully in other parts of Christs kingdom. For example, discourage them from any contact with another ministry. Kick anyone you don't want from your little personal kingdom.

* Step 4: Try to make people disciples of yourself rather than disciples of Christ. They belong to you and your little kingdom and must have your obedience. Con yourself and others that your great sacrifices are being made for Christs kingdom while actually they are just being made for your own little cult-kingdom.

* Step 5: Learn double talk and ambiguity so you can deceive people to follow you despite the fact you are not living up to your claims of super-spirituality and elitism. (Since no human being is really that spirtual anyone who pretends to be has to use deception to maintain impressions). Cover up your faults with lies. To maintain your sanity while deceiving yourself and others - become blind to your own faults and those of your organisation.

* Step 6: Since your heart is not right inside - don't worry because people can't really see your heart anyway - just focus on outward worldly appearances and material things. Money has more value than the spiritual - so run after it - you can use it to buy more status symbols to make yourself look more important (step 1). At all costs keep up outward impressions otherwise your elitist control will be undermined.

* Step 7: You must now find reasons to convince yourself and others that you are better than everyone else. Since you aren't really an elite in terms of true biblical tests, therefore you must major on the few minor trivial things that you are really good at. Thus you must throw out the set of priorities in the Bible and replace them with your own. So if you convince everyone that your best qualities are the most important qualities, then you can convince them that you are the best and therefore they must all focus their efforts on trying to be like you instead of being like Christ. So ignore the major issues like justice and mercy and focus on the little things you are doing right like tithing.

philiprosenthal
07-04-2006, 09:09 AM
Step 8: To further keep your little kingdom submissive and in awe of you - focus on your personal and corporate image. Forget about integrity - that could hurt your image if you told people the truth about your faults. You need to keep your kingdom together and under your thumb.

Aside: The good young leader looks at the senior Pharisee in awe at his perfection and power and elitism. He thinks he is going to learn to be part of the elite - actually he doesn't realise he is walking over a grave full of dead mens bones. He may well be contaminated, defiled and infected with his spiritually filthy behaviour - which he is blinded to think is good.

Step 9: To maintain image, associate yourself with the heroes of the past. Pretend you are following in the footsteps of the great leaders like Luther, Wesley, Augustine, the apostle Paul etc. By talking about them, you get to be associated with them. Pretend your new little personal kingdom is a new 'Reformation'. Pretend it is in the footsteps of the 'Apostles'. Tell people this is the 'New Apostolic Reformation'. Then you will borrow credibility from the greats of the past. You can trade on that momemtum and your foolish sheep may swallow it. But don't do what Luther did. Don't speak against unethical fundraising in the church, because that might decrease the money we need for our status symbols and control. Don't preach the priesthood of all believers because that might cause people to dismiss your cultic authoritarianism. Don't earn your own living like the apostle Paul and live a modest life. Rather use the church budget to live in the most expensive house and hotels.

Step 10: When some real true prophet comes along and challenges your hypocritical false and abusive behaviour - then to maintain your power and facade - you must convince everyone that he is an evil troublemaker. You must persecute him. You must abuse him. You must make people afraid to associate with him or ever dare to suggest the same things again. If you don't your kingdom will start to disintegrate - so you must throw him out and blacken his name. You must threaten worse so he doesn't talk after he has left. Just don't let your flock hear the truth - and to keep them from hearing the truth, you must persecute those who speak the truth.

So that is the slippery slope of how good pastors in EveryNation turn step by step into abusive and hypocritical Pharisees.

tamara_may
07-04-2006, 10:18 AM
Strong words Phil, but apparently true.

Someone told me that Paul Daniel actually had a prophetic word which he shared with the entire church congregation. The prophetic word spoke about him &amp; his family crossing a big highway &amp; getting knocked out by a massive 18 wheeler truck. This was about 3 years before his "breakdown". Scary that he didn't heed this warning. Even scarier that this is a picture that God gave him directly &amp; not through another person.

I know people who worked with him &amp; what you've written in the postings above is more or less what went on over there.

philiprosenthal
07-04-2006, 11:03 AM
Tamara

That was not exactly what the 'word' said. Paul used the story of his apparent 'prophetic word' to explain why Pastor Ray McCauley had a divorce and another His People pastor stepped down to try save his marriage. In his 'vision' I think he saw himself getting across safely. In reality the other pastor who stepped down to save his marriage was the one who avoided the truck and saved his family. God bless his example - I wish more pastors would follow his example and put marriage above ministry. But with regard to prophetic words like this one and others also in His People, I am of the view that almost all these so called prophetic words for the past 10 years or so in His People were just fraudulent made up stories by false prophets to seduce the congregation into believing lies and following false leaders.

I was during this time warning the ministry was backsliding, had made a peace treaty with the devil and needed to repent. The leaders got about about 500 pages of correspondence and numerous meetings to this effect. Of course they would never allow me to say so publicly in meetings. Eventually they got tired of me and told me to shut up or get out. Now they threaten me with legal action unless I shut up.

Almost all the others who claimed they had a 'word from the Lord' were just saying how pleased God was with His People/EveryNation and predicting more and more prosperity and success - and why more loyalty for Paul Daniel was needed.

"JER 23:30 "Therefore," declares the LORD, "I am against the prophets who steal from one another words supposedly from me. 31 Yes," declares the LORD, "I am against the prophets who wag their own tongues and yet declare, `The LORD declares.' 32 Indeed, I am against those who prophesy false dreams," declares the LORD. "They tell them and lead my people astray with their reckless lies, yet I did not send or appoint them. They do not benefit these people in the least," declares the LORD."

I will in future give more evidence to prove that almost all the 'prophecy' made in His People church for the last 10 years was a load of invented rubbish. It did not come from God.

tamara_may
07-04-2006, 11:08 AM
What kind of evidence?

philiprosenthal
07-04-2006, 11:13 AM
Compare the prophecy record with what was actually going on in the church and subsequently and the disobedience of many of the 'prophets' to God. But give me some time for that. Lets keep this thread on Matthew 23.

robert_unknown
07-04-2006, 03:08 PM
"But don't do what Luther did. Don't speak against unethical fundraising in the church, because that might decrease the money we need for our status symbols and control. Don't preach the priesthood of all believers because that might cause people to dismiss your cultic authoritarianism. "

but the better way to deceive the church is DO pretend to do what luther did when they watch you, and do your own business when noone sees you. people believe you are ethical, and it takes ages until they discover that you are unethical...

thats what happend here! and if people disover your unethical behaviour say what they want to hear "forgve me - i was wrong" and "i am human and i struggle with this and that"... once they forgive you go on and again do what you want...

hewrote
07-04-2006, 03:11 PM
lc_20 post 621

%The liar Prophet%

Deuteronomy 19:18
"The judges must make a thorough investigation, and if the witness proves to be a liar, giving false testimony against his brother,.."

The Spirit of the Prophet revealed this to you. Not man.

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tamara_may post 9(maybe a vison or dream but a prophetic word today points to the return of Jesus Christ.)
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philiprosenthal post 304

"Almost all the others who claimed they had a 'word from the Lord' were just saying how pleased God was with His People/EveryNation and predicting more and more prosperity and success - and why more loyalty for Paul Daniel was needed."

%The Prophets Tongue%

Proverbs 21:5-7

5 The plans of the diligent lead to profit
as surely as haste leads to poverty.

6 A fortune made by a lying tongue
is a fleeting vapor and a deadly snare.

7 The violence of the wicked will drag them away,
for they refuse to do what is right.

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philiprosenthal post 304

"all the 'prophecy' made"

There can't be none made outside of the strict message of Christ...of The last Prophets' return. A Prophet today must do as the Prophets' of old. Each point to Jesus Christ and His return is flawlessly spoken. No more. No less.

%Fortune telling%

Ecclesiastes 8:6-8
6 "For there is a proper time and procedure for every matter,
though a man's misery weighs heavily upon him.

7 Since no man knows the future,
who can tell him what is to come?

8 No man has power over the wind to contain it;
so no one has power over the day of his death.
As no one is discharged in time of war,
so wickedness will not release those who practice it."

philiprosenthal
07-04-2006, 03:34 PM
My main point with the 10 point backsliding plan above is that you don't need to teach people the specifics of how to be a Pharisee. If you can teach them the first point - how to be a religious elitist, then all the rest follows: pride, personal kingdom building; deceit, majoring on minors, covering up scandal, persecution of the righteous. It is automatic and follows logically. It is a simple step by step downward process. If you didn't think elitism was such a dangerous evil - think again. And spiritual elitism is even more dangerous because it seems so good - better than the best.

lc_20
07-04-2006, 03:58 PM
PhilR,
The scary thing is I saw myself falling down that slippery path while I was in msi/en. I have posted before that I was a better christian prior to joining msi/en then I was 8 years later - especially in the area of giving to the poor. I am clinging to the simplicity of the Gospel for life now.

HEwrote,
I don't really understand your post. But, I get the general feeling you are supportive of our thoughts. Welcome to the board.

philiprosenthal
07-04-2006, 04:50 PM
Anyone can fall down this path. It looks so cool till you get to the last step.

I forgot to mention some other critical links between the steps in the downward path.

* Why does an elitist leader end up in hypocrisy? Because if he is better than everyone else, then he doesn't need to follow the same rules as everyone else. In the extreme, he makes the rules (or interprets the Bible) - so can also modify them or break them at will. No one can question him - so no one can talk common sense into him. He is isolated from everyone but his own 'yes-men'.

* Why does one abusive-elitist leader breed more of the same type even when they are totally opposed to such behaviour? Because when he autocratically abuses people then they get damaged self-esteem and they subconciously look for a way to restore that. The easiest way to restore damaged self esteem is to push other people around - i.e. if you will get too badly hurt asserting yourself against the abusive leader - then rather assert yourself autocratically against the poor soft people under you in the hierachy. So if tolerated, it has a cascading effect until everyone gets corrupted. The only way out of it is to either leave voluntarily or to chose to be the persecuted prophet - who objects to the sin and then takes the brunt of the abusive hypocrites anger. That is what Jesus did and I believe we must follow his example.

coppertree
07-04-2006, 06:42 PM
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Hi All- I would attest to what Lc, and Phil are saying bout the slippery slope. I brought a book " A Pharisees Guide to Total Holiness ". I got it for the head pastor; I thought that he would like it.}

speakword2004
07-05-2006, 08:57 AM
Coppertree

Sounds interesting. Can you tell more?