LEWDASS IS HISTORY

[yogi (yogi)]

Apparently the good "dock-tore" has resigned from his "position" at Greater Grace. Does anyone know the particulars about his "untimely" demise? Maybe he'll start posting on Factnet! I don't imagine he will go to Paul's church since he was part of the "gang" who had dear son ousted from GGWO in the first place. VERY INTERESTING...

[maria_t (maria_t)]

I was told tonight by a close friend of Kathy Lewis's that the story of Dr. Lewis resigning is not true at all. She said that rumor has been circulating a lot lately and there is no truth to it whatsoever. This person spoke directly with Kathy Lewis earlier today and is a woman of integrity and can be trusted and is privy to some things going on behind the scenes. (And, no, they are not an elder's wife either).

The Lewis's want to move back to ME. Dr. Lewis would like to continue travelling for the ministry as he has always done, except his planes will leave from ME and not MD.

So, if anyone "hears" contrary to this, have them post the man's "resignation" letter BECAUSE THERE ISN'T ONE!

Maria_t

Believe me, if anyone would love to see him leave, its me. Darn it!!

[yogi (yogi)]

Thanks Maria!
Of course he would like to continue traveling for the ministry; who wouldn't love: free airfare, accommodations and adulation from the many deceived in countries that are clueless of this CHS personality cult's machinations!

"No Touch Love",

Yogi

Ps. Maybe he's one of the "pastors" that they are having Sunday's "secret meeting" about?

Pss. I am wondering if you received my e-mail?

[yogi (yogi)]

Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 3:09 pm:

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Hey Yogi,

Is there anything to the pic about a Dec 5th "secret" meeting and Lewis resigning this week?

I am intrigued by your up-to-the-minute information.. urr more than the average bear..

[yogi (yogi)]

yogi (yogi)
Junior Member
Username: yogi

Post Number: 33
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 63.27.25.226

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)
Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 10:23 pm:

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Perhaps, but no doubt time will tell whose neck will be in the noose next! Wonder if the wounded Lewdass will post here on FACTNet?

[yogi (yogi)]

jeannie (jeannie)
Member
Username: jeannie

Post Number: 80
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 205.188.117.12

Rating:
Votes: 2 (Vote!)
Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 10:38 pm:

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Ah "perhaps".. love that word.. really, it is my favorite word.. that word holds such promise!

Yes, perhaps..time will tell..

I have now heard from several different people (still on the inside) that Lewis definitely quit. I heard that he had a meeting with CHS and came out of the office and quit.. perhaps we will hear more... perhaps it will be the very thing that will open the eyes of those "that drink the koolaid"... Whatever happens, I pray for anyone and everyone to leave, including the elders...

A quote from a Christian leader observing GGWO currently:

"You have to wonder whether the people leaving at this stage are rats getting off the sinking ship or are those with a shred of integrity left who can't take it anymore. Whatever the reason you have to wonder how far it will go. Bottom line the few left in leadership when CHS is gone will be those with the least integrity".

[yogi (yogi)]

yogi (yogi)
Junior Member
Username: yogi

Post Number: 34
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 63.27.25.226

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)
Posted on Friday, December 03, 2004 - 12:16 am:

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Indeed jeannie! I often wonder why others will not heed the clear warnings offered here on FACTNet? Surely the truth hurts; however, subtle spiritual abuse continues to be very real and very damaging within Greater Grace. I am curious if others on this forum would agree that the short term pain of leaving far outweighs the offer of long term damage to one's soul for staying? Please keep us apprised of any breaking news regarding the good Dr.'s departure and/or the "secret meeting" of December 5th!

Good night,


Yogi

[yogi (yogi)]

I'm wondering if CHS offered Lewdass free travel in exchange for leaving "quietly"? The above posts are offered for FACTNet reader discretion.

Yogi

[yogi (yogi)]

PLEASE: Jackie, Dede, Ed Lutz and anyone else who HAS worked or works for CHS... SPEAK UP and GO ON RECORD with the truth about this cult!!!
You will NOT be touching God's anointed! True, in 1 Thes were are told to honor and pray for our pastors BUT I Thes. 5:14 also exhorts we believers to WARN others who are idle [sitting quietly by believing in this abusive system GG] and to encourage the feeble-minded and support the weak, so for God's sake speak up about the duplicity of this man and organization!!! Obviously, you were not offered a nice "package" such as Lewis', no matter, for the sake of those wounded and those continuing to BE wounded speak up and make your years of deception into something right!

Yogi

[boss_martian (boss_martian)]

Amen, Yogi!

The cracks are forming and the truth needs to continue to make sure this nest of lies crumbles and falls. My prayer is that the UNDENIABLE TRUTH is revealed about this cult. Truth that is IMPOSSIBLE to distort, truth that prevents this cult from running away and starting again under a new name.

I also pray for those that are afraid to speak out to take courage and comfort from God so that their voices are heard.

[anova (anova)]

If the abusive structure of GG would dissolve away I would rejoice with all of you. Also, any man, like Dan Lewis, who would stay by CHS's side for all these years has to be corrupt. I just don't think calling him Lewdass adds much to the discourse. Know what I mean?

[maria_t (maria_t)]

Dear Yogi
I did email you back last night around 11:30 P.M. (approx). I hope you did get it. If not let me know and I'll re-send it.

Thanks.
Maria

[maria_t (maria_t)]

I posted this on the "GG Pastors" thread but its also very appropriate for this thread also.

Posted on Friday, December 03, 2004 - 10:02 pm:

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Dear Aurora,
This post is in no way a "stab" at you personally so don't take it as such, ok? I just want to enlighten you about some things about good old Daniel Lewis. I didn't get much sleep last night mulling all these things over and over in my head, trying to figure out what was truth, and what wasn't.

And then, A dear friend called early on this morning after reading factnet, and they shared Jeannie's post of today with me in response to mine. The GGWO format of "damage control" done for the last 35 years was explained to me in detail, and this sick feeling in my stomach came over me, which I then didn't want to deal with one bit. The witness in my heart was even stronger. I didn't want to see certain things, so I left my house with my roommate and we went shopping and out to lunch. This certainly wasn't "my day"...I ended up getting quite sick from something I had eaten out, and then had to cancel the bible study at my home tonight because of it which greatly disappointed me.

While I was resting the latter part of the afternoon today, I had one other very long conversation with someone else who had been a witness over the years of the same damage control attempts that Jeannie brought out in her post, and it also confirmed what my early a.m. phone caller had also shared, and, these two don't know each other enough to have talked to one another today.

Let me share some things with you about your statement of having Daniel Lewis teach at the night school at South Berwick. I don't know if that is where you are from, I wasn't into checking IP numbers today.

NOBODY will want him to teach there, or anywhere after he leaves Baltimore and the scuttlebutt starts like it has after all the others who have left. It comes from the leadership too. I don't just mean its limited to "Factnet" either. He will be marked just like Ed Lutz and everyone else who has had the "nerve" to leave. Dr. Lewis and his history of all the things he has "done" in the sight of the Lord Jesus Christ behind the scenes here at GGWO Baltimore, GGWO affiliated ministries and the overseas ministries too will be out in the open. People who couldn't "talk" about the things he did for years will come out of the woodwork FINALLY and share the years of abuse they suffered at the hands of this man. The truth over and over will be shown of how he "screwed" the body of Christ WILLINGLY AND KNOWINGLY for close to 35 years now. Should I be more Christlike or kind and instead say how he continously would "lie to the body"..."manipulate people in the body"..."deceive people"..."make abusive remarks to people that he looked down upon"..."show favortism to those with money" like Pastor Teddy -- whom everyone knew he couldn't stomach the sight of him, but for the sake of the "MONEY" oops I mean "god" (CHS) he had no other choice to take him under his wing along with Pastor Scibelli...and his open distain was so stinking obvious to everybody, except poor Pastor Teddy who was clueless at the time. It used to break my heart seeing how they treated him just for a portion of his millions.

There wasn't one of us students (if we were truly going to be honest and say we witnessed this over the years) that went to MBC&S "AWESOME" (choke...puke...excuse me) after-raps with Dr. Lewis who didn't know how he felt about Teddy because whenever he was around, he would show his distain for him openly. Like he did to me too. I had nothing they wanted. Teddy did. Money. Lots of money. I always wondered how much they actually got out of him before he stopped coming out.

Ahh, don't forget the little trail of "Daniel worshippers" following after him too...his "do-gooders" in the music ministry whose noses were so far up his rear that it was hard to tell which instruments they were playing. Believe me, it was rather nauseating to watch...the primary 3 were Annette Bednez, and my roommate's sister and her husband...yes, Kathy Brown and good old Pastor Bob Brown...those two in particular learned well at the hands of good old "Dean" that the way up the GGWO promotional ladder includes treating your family members like "S-H-I-T," lets see if I can phrase it better...ahh, yes...the Dan Lewis style of "Finished Work" teaching by example of course, where you "appropriate" the Finished Work message only to those "worthy" of it or "deserving" it. (You know, the butt-kissers, loyalists, those with money wanting favortism, etc). Kathy Brown and her husband, Pastor Bob Brown sabotaged the first 10 years of my being in this ministry and being roommates with her sister talking about us behind our backs, maliciously maligning our characters...not just to the body here in Baltimore, but also to the leadership, particularily Pastor Stevens, Dr. Lewis, and Pastor Robinson. Sad to say, it also continued all the way back home in ME to their parents, siblings, family members including Nancy's now deceased grandmother -- anyone whose ear would hear. Foreign students who had been in our home that the Browns took to ME with them -- they picked the wrong one once and when Kathy began her annual tirade in regards to Nancy and I, this one foreign student was so upset with what was being said (LIES and character defamation) she was sick to her stomach the entire trip there, and finally got the courage to stand up to Kathy Brown rebuking her for what she had done. None of us could ever understand why Pastor Bob Brown did NOTHING either to silence the mouth of his wife. Little did she know it was her grandmother who used to tell her sister and I what she said about us. Word for word verbatim. (Thank you so much Kathy for your always extending Dr. Lewis's kind of Finished Work message to your sister and I).

It wasn't just maligning of our characters, (mostly mine) it was all either the two of them, or Dr. Lewis himself thinking and saying the most disgusting and degrading things about us ...it was the fact that its been kept up ALL these years, known by Pastor, and the leadership in this ministry, it even fed Pastor Well's gossip ministry right up till the time he left. Dr. Lewis clearly made it known to me how he felt that "I" was the "one who came between blood" regarding Kathy's lack of a decent relationship with her sister Nancy. Which of course was sheer bull****!! and I certainly let them know it too.

The point is, NOBODY DID A DARN THING ABOUT IT. Oh yeah, once in awhile Pastor would make mention of it, joke with us about it too because he found it amusing, which it wasn't and isn't to this day. We later came to know that me and my roommate were the laughingstock of majority of the GGWO staff behind the scenes, and the ugly rumors said about us, were just continuously fed year after year. Daniel Lewis himself stopping either one of us from being used in the church ministries, bible college, or whereever.

To have it implied all these years that you were gay by the Pastor you loved with all of your heart, some of his elders, and your own roommates family members, to be laughed at, ridiculed and mocked behind the scenes when the real truth was and is that neither of us were ever gay, we are not living in a "gay" type of relationship now, and never will. The more appropriate "doctrine" word for it is "soul-power lesbianism" -- one hell of a nice label to stick on someone isn't it. And nobody ever stopped it. Not Pastor, not Dr. Lewis, not Pastor Robinson, and not the Browns.

This, Aurora, is Daniel Lewis's type of Finished Work facade that he has lived with for the last 35 years. How he can live with himself with the things HE KNOWS he has done to hurt body members for all these years and not give one damn about it either amazes me. How he can stand in the pulpit preaching those BORING AS ALL GET OUT messages is no surprise to me whatsoever, because when you have NO LIFE IN THE SPIRIT, AND NO RELATIONSHIP WITH THE LORD, your messages are as dull and as boring as his have been the last 12 years I parked my butt listening to them!!
And the deceived clap on and on.......and its so "awesome"...when truly it isn't. Its the saddest state to ever be in before the Lord.
Its one thing to "know" Him. Its another pretending to do it all these years.

It is my hope that this departure of his is a major wake up call to him, period and that he gets on his face before the Lord Jesus Christ and truly repents of the things that he has done "in the name of God" when in fact, ALL THESE YEARS THINGS that were done instead in the name of his "god" Pastor Carl Stevens!!!!!!!!

Why on earth would anyone want him to be their teacher in their night school????? Those of you on staff reading this I pray you get on your knees because every single one of you that mocked and made fun of body members, wagging your tongues and spreading lies about them are going to have to face God one day if you don't repent of your wicked ways now.

Maria_t

P.S. For those of you wondering if I'm angry, YES I AM ANGRY. Angry, disappointed and hurt that the "church of my dreams" and the Pastor and leaders that I loved deeply would stoop so low to do the things they did, and then they send Pastor Robinson out to do damage control 2 years ago...when he promises "Diane and I will take you and Nancy out to dinner"...and "we will talk about all of this"...well, Pastor Robinson its 18 months now since your damage control phone call that you made at the direction of Pastor Stevens...should I thank you in advance that we were so worth your following through with your fake promises as usual?????? Don't think we don't already know how we've been marked too. Spare me the tirade. As of today, getting this wake up call was the best thing that ever happened to me. I definately know that it was the Holy Spirit that removed me from this evil sick wicked group of Christians that have played church and played with people's hearts and emotions all these years. Even as angry as I am right now, I still can't even wish the whole lot of you would spend your eternity damned to hell for what you've done to people "in the name of the Lord."

Perhaps some of you will now learn how to have a right relationship with the Lord and the Holy Spirit. Perhaps now you truly will get on your faces before the Lord and surrender your lives to Him. Not for my sake. God will continue to heal my wounds but I am turning my face like flint solely to Him and I'm going on with my life in the Lord. Thank God none of you were truly able to inflict that much emotional pain in my life to cause me to walk away from Him. He's the center of my life and that truly is all that matters anyhow. I pray God's mercy for all of you, not his wrath.

[dr_r (dr_r)]

It IS official !!!

Dr Lewis IS LEAVING GGWO !!!

He has made the statement clear to many, including those in his classes at MBC&S

He will be going to the Rome, NY Church !!!


we just don't know when...probably at the end of the school year...


Looks like the RATS are abandoning the sinking ship !!!!

Wonder if the head rat will go down with the ship.......?????

[yogi (yogi)]

So Rome NY Church is NOT going to take a stand; instead they are going to permit this ratfink to scurry into their camp, hide and continue to take money while things explode at GGWO! What pieces of **** for consciences these "men" have!! Sinners repent! I could throw up just thinking about this!

[isabella (isabella)]

Yogi,
Calm down..don't throw up over this. The more they act the way they do, the more they show everyone who they really are. Throwing up aside, I love your visuals..'ratfinks scurrying', I'm laughing out loud!
GB & GN, Isabella

[yogi (yogi)]

It's cool Izzy...I took a dramamine! Sometimes, this whole mess can be VERY frustrating to say the least! However, I'm glad my descriptive language gave you a giggle!

Good night,

Yogi

[boss_martian (boss_martian)]

I firmly agree that they're rats and I %99.9 agree with Yogi's posts. However, please don't denigrate the good name of the beloved Ratfink by associating him with this bunch of villains! (lol!)

RIP Ed "Big Daddy" Roth

http://www.ratfink.org/

[yogi (yogi)]

Hey "b_mart", thanks for the statistical vote of confidence! May all posting at the FACTNet Greater Grace board be considered "reliable" and "valid" as we march forward with a victory for truth and justice!http://www.factnet.org/discus/clipart/proud.gif

[yogi (yogi)]

Ps. Didn't mean to "dis" the Fink!

[maria_t (maria_t)]

Yogi you are just too funny!!

Maria

[maria_t (maria_t)]

Today I also heard from someone who used to go to GGWO and they used to be part of the "inner circle" there. They confirmed mostly ALL of the facts/situations that Jeannie has been posting from the start of Factnet.

Now, especially in regards to Dr. Lewis leaving and the posts I wrote above about damage control and all, it is the truth that Pastor Schaller hates him, and he (Dr. Lewis) can't "take it" anymore. Driving by his house it is for sale. He really is going!

This person all said that Pastor Schaller most certainly is going to be the next Pastor of GGWO Baltimore and that 2/3 of the elders are behind him 100 percent. Those that aren't I guess we will be seeing their departure as well, tainted of course with damage control again. Well, next time, I"m not falling for it anymore.

Now this puts me in a very uncomfortable position now. These 3 people I know very well (and all of them have been known to tell me the truth before), yet now, unfortunately one of them is clearly lying, and, now I believe has been subtly lying to me all along. I am waiting before the Lord for confirmation of this, but I have one thing to say, God help that son-of-a-bitch if I find out they've played me for a sucker all along.

So, in the meantime, good riddance Dr. Lewis. Still with you going I still wouldn't EVER go back to GGWO. I hope you plan to get your Lewdass in the pulpit and repent for once in your life before you sail into your new church. Why don't you make a true CLEAN break, Dan???

Especially after Pastor Hogarth's visit. Or will the details of that meeting be publically denied and Dave Drago made out to look like a fool?

Somehow I don't think God is going to allow the bullcrap to go on much longer. Pastor Hadley's repentence Sunday morning was a good start if it was truly from his heart and not a show put up by CHS at home on the phone. Did all you elders mean it getting on your knees Sunday morning?
Well then, if so, sounds to me like you have some issues to come clean on before the body thats left there, not to mention those of us here that you all have marked and slandered.

Much prayer has gone forth for this. God will not be mocked by all of you anymore. Your days are numbered.

Maria T

[roseanna (roseanna)]

All right, someone please tell me what happened Sunday morning with Pastor Hadley's repentence and with the elders getting on their knees. I have loved ones still there and I am very concerned. will someone please post the details?

The information I received from a former inner circle person and ex MBCS instructor is that Lewis is gone, left the ministry. Is there a chance he is just saying he's going to Rome in order to get out quietly, with no flack? This person also told me that Lewis is on the "Black List" now.

Also I would really appreciate it if someone would post specifically what the spin is that is being given regarding the Hogarth and Lewis recent developments.

I haven't been coming to FactNet for some time now because it is literally making me sick. I really need to know these things and would be grateful if someone could reiterate them for me.

[yogi (yogi)]

Boss M...I gots a widdle pwesent fo woo!http://www.factnet.org/discus/clipart/biggrin.gif

Yogi

http://cockatrice-eggs.blogspot.com/

[yogi (yogi)]

Is it true 'dock-tore L.' drives an $86,000.00 Land Rover? Someone told me they saw him driving one in the church parking lot recently. If so, I'm wondering if his "rich" uncle recently died or perhaps the "ox has been unmuzzled" so to speak! hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?

[boss_martian (boss_martian)]

Yogi,

I laughed so hard, coffee came out of my nose! And I wasn't even drinking coffee! Perfect!

Fight the (evil) power!

Boss Martian

[rjfernalld (rjfernalld)]

bump

[roseanna (roseanna)]

Hey, it feels lousy to be ignored! I posted some questions yesterday - just a couple of posts up. Could somebody please take a minute to answer? Please? Anybody?

[rjfernalld (rjfernalld)]

Roseanna

Would you repost the questions here? I will do my best to answer if I can.

Roberta

[hodeuon (hodeuon)]

Roseanna,

Check out Veritas's first post on the thread "Steve's 'Whosoever' Club". It should answer your questions.

Steve Stevens mentioned Mr. Hadley's prayer on The Grace Hour this week. He had a somewhat similar perspective to Veritas on Mr. Hadley's prayer.

Hodeuon

[roseanna (roseanna)]

Thank you very much, Hodeuon.

[yogi (yogi)]

Any news on Lewdass' condition? Apparently, he was taken to the hospital with chest pains and shortness of breath! Que lastima, guess the stress and pressure of being booted caved the old boy in!

Well, according to my sources there were TWO TRAITORS to be disposed of...who do you suppose numero dos is? Could it be scibelli since he was gone or perhaps Crybaby Steve since his name wasn't found signed on the roster of fools endorsing "today's "apology?"

Yogi

[terra_cognita (terra_cognita)]

The last I heard, Steve Stevens wasn't an elder so his name wouldn't be on it.

[yogi (yogi)]

How about CHS; is he still the "HEAD OF ELDERS"?

[yogi (yogi)]

Quote:<font size="-2">"Yesterday, DANIEL LEWIS of Greater Grace in Baltimore reiterated the organization's claims that the allegations are untrue.
"There were 16 lies in that court case," he said. "The Supreme Court had so many different cases on their agenda that year, that's the only reason we didn't get it overturned."

</font>Hey Dan, do you still adhere to this statement found in the New Standard? Ohhhh, that's too bad that you are FINALLY reaping the seeds of your YEARS of deception and manipulation! Don't worry, your "friends" at GGWO will have their day too!

For those interested in the full story here's the link:

http://www.s-t.com/daily/09-99/09-02-99/a01lo002.htm


Yogi

[maria_t (maria_t)]

So typical of the lies and the coverups isn't it.

[joni_fortin (joni_fortin)]

Yogi,

That statement that you quoted by Dan Lewis... "The Supreme Court had so many different cases on their agenda that year, that's the only reason we didn't get it overturned." has always made my blood boil.

Perhaps he missed the course on Constitutional Law 101..how the court works. There is a lengthy process when applying to the Supreme Court, first being the 'writ of certiorari' (informing the court). The process then begins. The last part of the process is the vote. "whatever the reason for denial.. the effect is to allow the decisions of the lower court to stand".

To make a blanket statement 'that the court had too many cases...THATS THE ONLY REASON WE DIDNT GET IT OVERTURNED' is a mockery and highly insulting to the court.

[yogi (yogi)]

Thanks for the info joni and you're right maria_t, this "reason" is a crock of crap!

Yogi

[isabella (isabella)]

Yogi,
I Love You!

[dr_r (dr_r)]

It's funny... (not funny Ha Ha but funny strange)
Everyone calls him "doctor", yet his is an Honorary Doctorate from pastah stevens himself...

pastah's is the same thing...only given to HIMSELF...

Talk about SELF SERVING...

The only person that has an ACTUAL PhD from an ACTUAL ACREDITED SCHOOL is Dr Wright!

Check it out kids....I did...

Look at the diplomas on the walls....

When we give credit or applause to people who clearly have not earned it...who does that serve??? God or man???

Just a thought...

[kirk (kirk)]

NOT TRUE!
Wright's ws bestowed upon him during his coronation at 2001 graduation, just like everyone else that has one there.

I know I was there....

Also when you graduate from law school you have a "juris doctor" not a Phd Mike Marr...
They are all self serving *******s...
p.s. Schaller's was honorary as well.

[free_to_be_off (free_to_be_off)]

Is it true many of the affiliate pastors are now attending accredited semanaries to "legitimize" GGWO?

FTBO

[maria_t (maria_t)]

Ron,
As far as I know Michael Marr has a "JD" as a law school graduate. I don't recall him ever saying he had a PhD.

I know that he was ordained at the end of his MBC&amp;S education because he had already completed bible college somewhere else plus had served as a pastor in another area church in Baltimore. His degrees are not phony, the ones I saw in his office were from legitimate accredited schools with the exception of MBC&amp;S of course.

He wasn't a TBS/Stevens School of the Bible student ever, nor did he get any diploma's from that phony place Lewis and CHS got theirs.

Maria

[maria_t (maria_t)]

I went to marrlaw.com which is Michael Marr's website and obtained the info stated above. When I attended MBC&amp;S, they called him "Doctor" but he never encouraged it among the students.

Actually a "JD" in law is a higher "doctorate" than a PhD according to my sources. It sounded like there was a little bitterness there, Ron?

Maria

(Message edited by Maria_t on December 29, 2004)

[kirk (kirk)]

No Bitterness Maria, and i'm not questioning his JD or BA. I was simply noting that he liked to be called "Doctor" and he doesn't have a doctorate. A Juris Doctor is not a doctorate or Phd. That's all.
i have no personal beef with Marr just with the fact that he is with, and defends that corrupt place and leaders.

[rjfernalld (rjfernalld)]

Marr is gulity by association and affiliation while knowing the corruption that exists.

[anon_brief (anon_brief)]

It is highly doubtful that Marr has only turned a blind eye to wrong-doing.

[rjfernalld (rjfernalld)]

Yup...too true.

[isabella (isabella)]

Folks,
I thought I explained this a while back on one of these threads.

FIRST: You're a sap. Most likely they came upon you at a vulnerable time in your life. Maybe you just lost your Mother or Grandmother, maybe you were struggling with debt, sickness or an impending divorce.

SECOND: They reel you in. Your heart is open and you are seeking the loving God.

THIRD: You are a sap-sucker...or you leave.

Amen,
Isabella

[maria_t (maria_t)]

Izzy,
The Lord led me to GGWO even though today He has since led me out. I hadn't lost my mother or grandmother, I wasn't struggling then with sickness, debt, or an impending divorce.

I was one of the few they didn't "reel" in. Some of them tried to get me to leave!! LOL!! My heart was open, I was desperately seeking the Lord. My battles were with people, and initially not with the leaders, (except Daniel) though eventually the others got involved. Seemed like the more I tried, the worse it got. It was ME that didn't listen to the Lord years ago when He told me to leave. For that, yes, I deserve to be called "a sap."

Thirdly. I didn't want to leave at first. Then I began to see things that grieved my spirit after I began posting here. Then I knew within me that the Holy Spirit was calling me out. And, I got out.

There are a lot of deceived people still going there, some with no vertical with the Lord so how else would they know to leave? It will have to be via a move of the Holy Spirit. Most there have a vertical with Carl, and not the Lord and it is so sad, it breaks my heart.

However, this week, I was able to help a friend leave. Praise God.

Gotta scoot...lots to do..
love ya Izzy...
Maria

Maria

(Message edited by Maria_t on December 29, 2004)

[arguendo (arguendo)]

A JD is squat. Any idiot can get one. It's an intermediate degree, while a PhD is an exhaustive degree. Anyone with a JD calling themselves "doctor" is deluded and insecure. Normally, if you're callling yourself "doctor" with a JD people think you didn't pass the bar.

Master of Laws (LLM)is the exhaustive degree for lawyer types. Leave it to lawyers to get the whole system bass ackwards.

[free_to_be_off (free_to_be_off)]

<font size="-2">There are a lot of deceived people still going there, some with no vertical with the Lord so how else would they know to leave? It will have to be via a move of the Holy Spirit. Most there have a vertical with Carl, and not the Lord and it is so sad, it breaks my heart.</font>

So true Maria so true. I believe the crux of the problem is the "fine" teaching they have received from the "pulpit" "not to receive an evil report." I have a friend who has many advanced degrees and when I gently presented this problem to her she exclaimed, "I don't know and I don't want to know." PERIOD, END OF DISCUSSION.

As long as these folks are being fed the crock of crapola doctrine and/or have issues which keep them from telling themselves the truth, this "church" and these types of abusive systems will flourish. However, NOTHING is impossible with our God and He is not surprised nor in the dark about ALL that has and WILL transpire at GGWO.

FTBO

[dr_r (dr_r)]

Kirk

I know that Wright had his "bestowed" on him by MBC&amp;S, I was there as well. However, I think if you do a little research, as I have, you will find he also has a PhD from a legitimate accredited school. That was the only point I was making. If my sources are truly wrong, forgive me.

For the record, my BA, Masters and PhD are all from legitimate accredited schools...no where near MBC&amp;S...

***Let us all keep in prayer, those who have died or lost loved ones in the areas hard hit by the Tsunami in the Indian Ocean. God will be Glorified through this. HIS will be done!

God Bless
Dr R

[maria_t (maria_t)]

Arguendo you know Michael Marr is a friend of mine and I am not going to go round and round with you over legal degress because its not relevant to me one stinking bit.

It wasn't him calling himself "Dr. Marr" it was Stevens who started it. I remember years ago him (Michael Marr) telling me he didn't like that title one single bit. He also did not encourage the students to use it.

Why can't you just drop the stupid stuff on here and find something more edifying to discuss or is it that trivial details which won't matter a hoot in heaven are more important to "argue" over. Does it really matter where Dr. Wright or Michael Marr got their degrees? It sure doesn't to me!!!

What matters most and what should matter most is what is pleasing to the Lord, and somehow I highly doubt this nitpicking about someone's education is pleasing to Him.

Phil 4:8

God Bless
Maria

[maria_t (maria_t)]

FTBO...
so true what you posted...gives us something to really keep praying about, doesn't it.

GGWO however is due some harsh discipline from the Lord, from CHS to his elders and then it will filter thru the body to those who know to leave and won't...preferring a man over the Lord.

God was mocked the day of the Elder's declaration and He is not taking that lightly either. Its this heavy grieving in my spirit that I feel every time I think about it so I have just purposed to go to God for these people that are either ignorant, or like I said, have their vertical with Carl and not the Lord.

Love in Christ
Maria

[rjfernalld (rjfernalld)]

Maria...shame on you!

It matters about how these people represent themselves! If they lie about degrees, as Carl always has, it speaks volumes about their lack of integrity...and that lie is important when they pretend to be something they are not.

STOP hyperspiritualizing, and get real. These practical issues ARE important. The devil is in the details remember.

Standing back being hyperspiritual..." God will not be mocked"...well he won't be mocked by you overlooking the truths about this place either.

One of the reasons these men get away with whatever they want to is because NO ONE holds their feet to the fire over such details.

IT DOES MATTER...for in the details lie the truths about liars who presume to represent the truths about God.

Please...get realistic and practical about this, instead of living in this holy denial. Remember the phone call with our friend in Mass? The same thing applies here.

Who these men SAY they are or SAY each other is makes a difference about how much integrity they have. IT DIES MAKE A DIFFERENCE ON SOME LEVEL.

(Message edited by Rjfernalld on December 29, 2004)

[ski (ski)]

So is it true, that as soon as DS found out about TS to become the "next boss", DS ran out to stay behind the scenes of a plot against TS with the final goal to take over what will remain from non-Baltimore GGWO?

[ericlaw (ericlaw)]

http://www.factnet.org/discus/clipart/blush.gif

[ski (ski)]

It's just a question.
I see that Lewis not just left, he stays around "the business" talking to overseas ministries. I simply can't see any reason for him to do that, but for the power sake. Can't believe for other reasons.

Sergei

[ralphwells (ralphwells)]

Sergei - he IS an enigma! No one has the straight story on him but him and God. He ain't tellin'http://www.factnet.org/discus/clipart/angry.gif, and God won't tell.http://www.factnet.org/discus/clipart/blush.gif

God bless you Sergei, if I ever get to Russia I want to meet you.

Blessings,

Ralph
1Cor 15:10