Truly A FALLING AWAY

[truechristian (truechristian)]

It is quite remarkable that so many people who once had the truth then broke into splinter groups could believe the nonsense and changing of doctrine by there so called pastors to serve their own purposes. what god do you really worship? the god of this world or the true God in heaven? after doing much research and "proving all things", i was amazed to see how church groups such as United and Living have gone "Pentecostal" and worldwide has gone so paganistic (even giving creedance to a wacko like David Icke who actually tells stories of "lizard people" living amongst us. Satan is most certainly broadcasting loud through the splinters. How could so many people lose the truth of God. The whole world is deceived. Many of the splinters are also deviating from saturday sabbath keeping as well as the true holy days.
After weeding out all the lies and false doctrines, I could find only one group that still holds fast and I could not poke any holes in and I believe is GOD'S true church is one called The Restored Church of God. I would suggest than anyone that would like to get back on track should read a book called " Annoint Your Eyes " and then decide who is correct in doctrine and who is teaching false truth's.

[just_curious (just_curious)]

Shouldn't this go under the Herbert W. Armstrong thread?

<font color="0000ff">I believe is GOD'S true church is one called The Restored Church of God</font>

That in itself is false doctrine! God's true church is made up of every believer past, present and future. No particular group on earth can claim that title. In fact, the claim to exclusivity on the truth is one of the hallmarks of cults.

[godchild (godchild)]

truechristian, If you are a christian, by definition you are a follower of Christ. If you would allow the holy spirit to help you understand that Christ's sacrifice for us alone is our salvation, not by following old testament rituals such as which day to worship. If you want to live by the Old Testament alone, perhaps you should also sacrifice animals on an alter, as that was a required ritual just as which day to worship. Did not Christ speak to that? Yes, he did. He healed the sick, which was considered against Old Testament rules, on the sabbath. Read what he said to the Pharisees. Begin to understand what he is telling you. Do you perhaps recall when he told the people they were concerned too much about the times: times to worship, etc. Do you believe that your body is a temple? A tabernacle? What do you think that means. Does the Holy Spirit reside in us, or in a building?

[godchild (godchild)]

I wish someone would show one place in the New Testament where it says the apostles or Christ went to a building specifically used as a church.
People need to forget that notion. It is not scriptural. Read what the New Testament says about Christ preaching, healing or doing miracles and where he did them. Everytime the New Testament talks about the times Christ went into a tabernacle, he was angry. Why? Look into it. Read. He taught in people's homes, on hilltops, NOT IN A BUILDING CALLED A CHURCH. A church is any area where believers gather, which could be anywhere, ANYWHERE! Not in buildings built for that purpose.

[bee (bee)]

TrueChristian,
Perhaps you would be able to read James 1:27. It is quite a eye opener to what is pure in faultless in God the Father's eyes for religion. It is quite simple. Also thank God Jesus stood in the gap so it could become simple.
God Bless You.

[bee (bee)]

Godchild,
You have been in my thoughts &amp; prayers. I hope all is ok for you. God be with You.

[godchild (godchild)]

bee, it was very touching to see your kind message. I am forging ahead and renewed by God's mercy to me. I have a friend who inspires me. She is a blind young woman who never once has made a complaint about her life and we always find something to laugh about. She is a joy to be around. She has had an interesting life. Her courage astounds me. She was in the military and contracted meningitis which caused her to lose her sight. We went for a walk the other day. I was describing the colors of the flowering trees which look and smell so lovely to me. She surprised me by saying she lost her sense of smell also. When I was alone I spent time apologising to God for my own selfishness. God has placed her in my life for a good purpose, and I really want to be Christlike in my dealings with her. My second daughter (I have three) is having many difficulties in her life. Not of her own doing. She is a babe in Christ and her growth is astounding but Satan throws barriers in her path almost daily. I know he has a great plan for her because she clings to him no matter what. There are many inspiring people in my life. I am truly blessed. I add you as a friend in Christ. God bless you always and forever.
Does it surprise you that there are so many different denominations listed on these threads as cults? I had no idea there were so many denominations and it seems so sad (we should all ask God for forgiveness) because we have what is the most glorious hope in the Lord, and so many of us seem to be caught in the traps of men through Satan's work. I really wish we could have a universal day of prayer that Christians would think only of God and Christ. Wouldn't that be something. Not of ourselves. Just him. True unity. Can you imagine the Spirit moving at a time like that? What an example that would be for people to see. Is it a foolish impossible dream before he comes again?
I have not wanted to share this before. It is something that I have feared that if I did share it, it would seem to be a hypocracy, or confusing, which I would never want. But, if there is anyone who it will help, it is worth sharing.
My disability is a severe anxiety disorder. I have been on medication since 1994 and though I have tried to wean myself off the medication, my doctors say I need to accept that meds will be necessary for the rest of my life. Now, people might say, why does she say she is christian if God hasn't healed her, as my condition includes unexplainable fears. Through therapy I have learned mine is a chemical imbalance and I have had it since childhood. I can honestly say I now have no attacks since I began to fully put my mind on the Lord and the knowledge he is always with me and those I love and it is not all because of the meds. I thank God daily. He has given me this burden so that I can rely more fully on him. I have cut my meds in half and wouldn't take them at all except once they are completely out of my body, the attacks may return, and it takes a week for them to work once I start back on them.

[bee (bee)]

Dear Godschild,
I myself am not up on a lot of this disorder but I feel if you have surrendered you're life to Christ as it sounds you have, asked for anything generational as in curses to be broken off of you're family &amp; are still expierencing what you say then it may well be a chemical imbalance. If so, I do not feel medicine evil as some do, rather the Word says that as long as we receive everything with thanksgiving there is nothing wrong with it. God also created medicine &amp; gave doctors the knowledge to help us in our fallen state, so I say Praise the Lord.

Anyone who would say "why does she say she is a Christian if God hasn't healed her" IMHO is a babe in the Lord &amp; does not understand the faith yet. We are never promised great health in this life, rather without the Lord birthing us again we may run from the faith. It more so teaches us that we "will" have many trials but with the help of the Lord Jesus we will be able to bear them. He will never leave us, isn't that comforting to know!

As for fear, when this happens I call out to the Lord in prayer for strength to get through it. Satan is clever at getting us to fear but fear is not of the Lord &amp; as believers we need to remember this when he attacks this way.

I will remember you to prayer where this is concerned &amp; if you would like to keep in touch on a personal level I would love to fellowship with you via email. These boards are so impersonal. My email is fitnessbee@hotmail.com
Bless You Godschild!

[yaakov (yaakov)]

godchild

I have a sincere question about your post on Thursday, March 24, 2005 - 12:11 am. You were talking about a young, female friend of yours that is blind and said <font color="0000ff">She is a babe in Christ and her growth is astounding but Satan throws barriers in her path almost daily.</font>

Later on, while talking about your own medical difficulties, you said <font color="0000ff"> I thank God daily. He has given me this burden (i.e. chemical imbalance) so that I can rely more fully on him.</font>

How do you distinguish if a medical condition is a barrier from Satan versus a burden from God?

[godchild (godchild)]

You confused the female friend with the other female I was speaking about.
One is my neighbor. She is blind and I admire her positive attitude. The other is my daughter, who, being a babe in Christ, has barriers thrown at her constantly.
Now I will try to answer your question. My condition COULD be a barrier (satan trying to make it one) if I did not have the spirit of God in me, who though allows me to have this condition, gives me the strength to deal with it and live a highly functional life.
I think I will relate this to 'feelings'. I hope it doesn't confuse the point I am trying to make. I spent a great deal of my life as a functioning alcoholic. I had drank for so long I believed my confidence (in dealing with people and life in general) was through the alcohol in me. Alcohol is evil. It becomes the greatest love of your life. Over God, your family, your home, your job, etc. My condition became so bad (because alcoholism is a lie that doesn't work) I was depressed, nonfunctional, and suicidal, because I thought there was no 'help' for me. God had been there all along. He was allowing me to go to the bottom, in order to reach out his hand, lift me out of the pit, and make me "completely and fully aware", that what I had always known deep down was true. I let alcohol cloud that. That was satan. When I attempted suicide, I was alone as far as humans around to help. God was not going to allow it. I survived. It was then, though I didn't tell my family, they knew something was wrong and came to help. They all surrounded me in love, which is God. God cannot go back on his word. He gave us freedom to choose. He had to allow me to go wherever I wanted with my life, but when I cried out to him, he immediately began to heal my troubled heart. I stopped drinking completely one day later. I had been drinking (literally) 24-7's. That has been 2 years and 5 months ago. I have no desire for alcohol at all.
This leads me back to what I was saying about feelings. God gave us feelings. All feelings are good. I learned in group therapy (which was a great help in understanding my addiction) it is what we do with them that makes the difference. We have to take action. It is whether we take a positive or negative action that decides; for God or satan.
Now, about my daughter. I believe God has a great work through her he will accomplish. She is trying to do everything right, number one, having faith. I always tell her, her faith is much stronger than mine. She trusts people I would not trust and is not afraid of any place or situation. It is her faith. When I talked about satan's barriers, things constantly happen to her that are not of her doing. Negative things. I believe that is satan. He does not want God to have her. God does have her so satan loses, but she has to be constantly aware of this. She could throw her hands up and say, "to heck with this. I give up. I'm going to live for myself." Satan would win. But she doesn't. Her faith is strong. No matter what happens to her, God always provides a way for her to solve the problem. An example is, the was feeling down about something. At that moment, a pastor called her 'out of the blue' and she was able to cope and thank God.
I believe satan puts up the barriers (such as disease, medical condition, loss of limb, whatever), and God will allow us to carry the burden only as long as we are able, in other words, no more than we can bear. He does this to strengthen us for greater challenges that may be ahead. If we are willing, he allows.
I apologise for being longwinded. If I have only confused you further, I deeply apologise.

[yaakov (yaakov)]

So, you are saying that satan is the cause of all negative events in life such as vehicular accidents, sickness, loss of limb, etc. But God enables a person to overcome all the negative events. And that God lets satan do bad things to people because God wants to strengthen us for greater challenges that may be ahead. In essence, God wants to make people stronger so he relies on satan to do bad things because God can’t.

Did I sum up your post correctly?

[infoman (infoman)]

Yaakov,

All evil originated from satan and the fall of man.

Satan comes not but for to steal, kill and destroy.

God ALLOWS what we allow Yaakov.

Even in the times of the prophets the Jew had a way to be healed.
Example: Looking upon the serpent upon the pole.
Going through the rituals with the priest. etc.
The Blessings in Deut 28 show those who follow God and observe live in health.
Prayer in faith and standing in faith for the manifestation. Daniel Chapter 9 and 10. Each time his prayers were answered instantly. One time he had to stand twenty-one days for the manifestation because of satanic hindrances to Gabriel and Michael the archangel.

God Himself came as a man (Jesus) gave Himself as the attoning sacrifice for all, was crucified on passover, and ressurected from the dead after having defeated Satan and made a way for mankind to have relationship with him and authority over all the power of the evil one.

The "name of Jesus is above every name that is named." including all sickness.

Satan is a spirit and puts thoughts in people with his goal of influencing people to do evil.

God does not use trials to strengthen people. Trials are set up from our own doing or satan to steal from, kill and destroy you.

God sent His word to make you strong.
Trials don't make you stronger only being a doer of God's word, knowing who you are "in Christ" and knowing your authority "in Jesus name does"

READ: Matthew 7

"Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it."

Was the house made stronger from the TRIAL, the evil, " the flood, winds and storm beating"?

NO!
"great was the fall of it."

[yaakov (yaakov)]

Infoman, I'm seeking Godchild's opinions.

[godchild (godchild)]

yaakov, Your interpretation of what I said was fairly accurate until your last sentence in the paragraph. I'm not sure I have the answer for you but I will expound on the idea of why we suffer and who it comes from.
I do not know God's mind. I don't think anyone knows why hundreds of thousands are allowed to die in a tsunami. I don't know why a child suffers injury or is born with a mental disability. I don't have the answers for that.
This is what I do know. God feels sorrow when a person dies. I will find the verse for you if you like. I have read it. God let people do it 'their way' over and over. We always fail. We are human and imperfect. Some of us will have an accident because of OUR choice to drive too fast or drunk or in a car that is poorly maintained. We have the accident. We suffer pain. Satan doesn't give a darn. God helps us through the pain. Say we break a leg. The leg mends. If we hadn't felt pain the first time, we might turn right around and drive another car too fast, or drunk, or that is poorly maintained. Pain is helpful. Lepers lose limbs because they do not suffer pain. God uses that pain to draw us closer to him, to perfection, to light, to be able to suffer all things. To teach us. A parent wants their children to walk but we know they will fall down many times in their quest. Just as we as parents are so thrilled when our baby takes his/her first step to us, so god is also pleased when we come to him in our pain. Falling down hurts. It is a child's desire to be mobile that makes them get up and fall over and over again. Does that make sense. As parents we have to let them fall. If we love our children we cannot protect them, or put them in a protective bubble. That would not be the best life for them. He wants the best life for us. He sent his son to suffer all our pain. When Christ was on the cross, God turned his back on his son in his agony because God cannot look on sin and his son became sin for us. Jesus said, "Father, why have thou forsaken me." Jesus became completely man, he suffered every pain a man can suffer. As God, he could have spared himself, just as he spared Isaac, the son of Abraham. God is never changing, and so he cannot go back on his word. The crux of all this is we need to live with our eye on eternity, not on this short life. We don't know what we will have to suffer but he does and he tries in every way to warn and to protect us. Many things that happen to us that cause our pain are because we wanted to do it our way, which satan loves, instead of God's way. Even death will have no sting if we are believers because a perfect eternity awaits us.
God does not sit back and say, "on your mark, satan, go get um." And it is prophecied what will happen to the end of the world. We have many warnings, such as "don't build your house upon the sand, build it on a rock." Honor your father and mother. (If you don't listen to them, you can get yourself if big trouble. You can hurt yourself or others. You can suffer pain.)
He warns of the lies satan will tell us such as we can do it all alone. That will most definitely cause us pain.
The pain isn't the most important part of a situation we may find ourselves in. It is the knowledge that all we have to do is call out to the Lord, and he promises to be there. If we believe satan we might become embittered and give up, or turn to artificial means of relief that never last, or are worse.
That is what I meant about admiring the way my friend handles her blindness. It is her acceptance and moving on that is the most admirable, and her cheerful spirit. She is not sitting around as satan would wish saying, woe is me.
I believe what one person suffers may be a lesson for us. So that we will start appreciating the we live, period.
I don't have the answer as to why God allows certain things to happen to certain people. I believe he knows the number of hairs on my head, and he has more love for me than I have myself. He is not temporary in any way.
yaakov, you are giving me more incentive to learn more so that I understand more. And if I can share that with someone else, then God is glorified.
God created me. He took a piece of clay and formed a man for his pleasure. I don't know if God was lonely. It was when God BREATHED Adam's soul into him that he gave us our first great gift. I would rather let him make the decisions for me. He has proved to be much better in every way than I have when I have tried to do anything on my own without him.

[godchild (godchild)]

yaakov, I forgot to say thank you for the opportunity. I can recommend a good book, only one of many. The title is 'Getting Through the Tough Stuff' by Charles Swindoll. I just happen to be reading it at this time. I don't call that coincidence. I didn't know you would ask these qustions, but I believe God did. I just hope I haven't confused you as I do not have all the answers.

[godchild (godchild)]

If you are unable to find an organized church (organized christian religion) there is a man who wrote a book about leaving a church without leaving God. His name is Martin Zender. His book is helpful to the many of us who are questioning our organized religions. You can find more about him and his work at www.martinzender.com (http://www.martinzender.com). I am one of those diciples who wants fellowship with likeminded people without all the false or twisted doctrine and requirements placed on us by men, and not God through his Holy Word. I placed my name in a search in my area for people who want to gather in our homes to study the bible and praise God. Yesterday, Mr. Zender sent me a list of people in my area who are searching for the same things. This is offered at no charge.

[yaakov (yaakov)]

Godchild, thanks for answering about your beliefs.

[godchild (godchild)]

yaakov, the pleasure was mine.