| Author | Message | ||
     devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) New member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 11 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.9.74 |
Ah ha...right...and this has what to do with Satanism? You must have us confused with Christians or something...could you please explain why you felt this sermon was relevant to Satanism? I'm still trying to figure out how it has anything to do with the Left Hand Path. | ||
| lord_sinbad (lord_sinbad) New member Username: lord_sinbad Post Number: 1 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 216.139.181.138 |
holla @ all u niggas, this da graet white eagle talking to ya. i just want alll ya niggas to know that its great to be a mafian and also great to be brutal and fearless. but first and foremost we must all learn not to forget about our studies. this is to all my family the great mafians. we are supreme and most powerful unopposed and very strong we dont look for trouble but dont look for ours or elseeeeeeeeeeee nigeria go jagajag kposakposa four gunshot in the air. | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 109 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.98.179 |
Sinningbad... Shame on you, do you kiss your Mother with that mouth. You say it is great to be a muffin? Are you raisin muffin or a grape nut muffin. I am betting on the nut one. YOu say you are brutal and fearless, well of couse you are,you are the great white beagle. We never thought for a minute you were a weinie dog, why we all know how fearless the great white beagle is, but you must take your own advise and not forget your lessons. You should really take another look at the spelling book. It is rude to threaten people with poor grammer. I do not mean that people with poor grammer should be afraid of you, that would be silly. Who would be afraid of a beagle that thought he was a muffin. Watch that gun shot in the air, people are often shot with their own bullets when they shoot in the air, and how would all the other muffins get along without you. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) New member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 13 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Sharon, you seem too smart to reply to this - who's the grape colored beagle? Lord sindbad? Sharon, did you notice that the purple beagles message was posted at 530 am? Might be because he's from Nigeria? It is about the only thing spelled correct on the post. Do you know Doug, was he in the twelve tribes? Satanism huh? What sermon is Mr. 666 speaking of? Where could I go to see a satanic sermon? Left handed path huh? I'm left handed ...... J. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 66 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.0.169 |
Greetings Jeffrey. The Left Hand Path is a term used to describe the collective of the following beliefs: Satanism, (both Modern/atheistic and Traditional/theistic), Luciferian, (both Modern/symbolic and Traditional/theistic), and such related beliefs. The reason it is called "Left Hand" is that it emphasises the exact opposite view point of most religions of what we call, the Right Hand Path, religions that demonize the flesh as evil, and tell man to reject or supress their more animalistic natures, rather than embrace them and learn to live with them. All faiths of the Left Hand Path have a core belief that the material world is not evil, and our natures are not something to be transended, hence, the idea of being forgiven of something like original sin is an alien concept to us, but, embraced. In sermon, I was refering to an earlier post that has since been deleted by the moderators. It was basically an ad for the author of this thread's cult, and he was using Bible quotes to back his arguement, and trying to entice people to join. I was curious as to how that has any appeal, let alone meaning to Satanists or any other members of the Left Hand Path. The guy never responded. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) New member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 15 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Thank-you Devils advocate 666, Interesting, your answer has been the most straight forward answer I've gotten since I decided to post information on this sight, thank you .. - The predominant stance of opinion I've had with most people here (mostly God fearing/loving sorts) has been intensely flavored with fear of their own animal instincts. They bow before guilt that has been branded into them by massively translated books/bibles, and judge and hurt those who live true to their inherent, intrinsic nature, like myself - I've no arguments with what I've read from you - it's just that the terms Devils advocate, and 666 are negative terms and have been for quite some time in the eye's of my generation - have you ever thought of changing the name of your organization in order to lesson fear of it? - it reminds me of Wicca, would that be OK to say? These Jesus/God/ judgmental people claim to ride a wave of love, but here I am young, and obviously studying and searching for people to discuss fractions of life with, and all they can express is judgment towards me, and what I speak of, while you just simply answer my questions in a polite manner, no bull-shit - I feel not an ounce of freedom eminating from these God/Fearing bible translators, they just seem to fear, and fear, and fear, and fear - I can hear them now after they read this " your being tricked Jeffrey, the Devil is trying to recruit you" ha ha, oh my! I'd love to hear more about following your natural instincts - and how you came about this - My love goes out to you, Jeffrey Costa | ||
| franklin (franklin) Intermediate Member Username: franklin Post Number: 402 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 205.188.117.72 |
The above post is dripping and oozing with unfavorable judgements towards Christians. Look in a mirror pal! | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) New member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 17 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Christians is such a broad term - and again - "Look in a mirror pal"? Was I speaking to you? Ok then, you must be a Christian, right? Why wouldn't you try'n show me light - why just slap a post saying "look in the mirror pal"? Once again you prove my point, all you do is throw defensive comments - and warn of hell - what else could I think, when your messages say the words God/Christians/Jesus/ along with no positive guiding influence, just, maybe a couple of quotes out of a massively translated book. You seem mean, not positive - try and give some positive logical insight, please - You "christians" are the most negative people on this sight so far as i've seen - and that's not a judgment, it's just what I've seen and felt - " look in a mirror " ????? Ok, I just did - I saw one of Gods children, and? I want to hear your opinion Franklin, not "slap-me" comments - What do you think about this issue - ? All the best, Jeffrey Costa | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) New member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 18 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Christians is such a broad term - and again - "Look in a mirror pal"? Was I speaking to you? Ok then, you must be a Christian, right? Why wouldn't you try'n show me light - why just slap a post saying "look in the mirror pal"? Once again you prove my point, all you do is throw defensive comments - and warn of hell - what else could I think, when your messages say the words God/Christians/Jesus/ along with no positive guiding influence, just, maybe a couple of quotes out of a massively translated book. You seem mean, not positive - try and give some positive logical insight, please - You "christians" are the most negative people on this sight so far as i've seen - and that's not a judgment, it's just what I've seen and felt - " look in a mirror " ????? Ok, I just did - I saw one of Gods children, and? I want to hear your opinion Franklin, not "slap-me" comments - What do you think about this issue - ? All the best, Jeffrey Costa | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 116 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.92.181 |
jeffrey_costa ... Well hello there, actually as you can see I am not to smart to answer you. Who is the grape beagle, not snoopy . I see you chatting with da. Well you seem to hold your own just fine. You must remember that a lot of the people on this site are not just Christians but Christians who have been hurt by the churches or ministers. They are not as trusting of others now, and have lost their sense of humor about the devil. Me, well I still have my laughs at the devil, as would you if you had ever seen him dance. I know it is not nice to laugh at others but then as a Christian I am not perfect. You may think it dangerous to laugh at the devil but it is that fear thing, it is hard to fear him after you have seen him disco. Just kidding even the devil doesn’t disco. He has two left hooves and has a hard time finding shoes. You think Christians have fear, you are wrong there, I fear nothing but God. There is nothing in this or any other world that I fear. If you think that this is not true then read my message to the satanic pope. Mind you I have not seen him dance but he sure has a way with words. Dances around the truth a lot. As you can see by what the satanist say they do not really worship satan, who according to them does not exist. He for them is more of a figure head, like Hitler was for the nazis. I must say that you sound to intelligent to fall for such foolishness but there is the danger that some will not be so clear sighted. Where I live right now they are trying to track down a sixteen year old girl who has been apparently emailing satanist and visiting satanist sites. She emptied her bank account and gone. Heartbreak for the parents who had no idea that this was going on.. What do you suggest for a new name for the satanist? Something positive and upbeat I hope, I like satans minions myself but that’s just me. Probably should drop the name satan altogether holds bad memories for us Christians, you know the whole hate the human race thing, wanting to destroy us all . That was pretty cold, ran and told his father on us, said we were not worthy. Whinny baby, it was he who was not worthy. I wish my Father had not cast him down here with us, we have enough stuff to worry about without having to deal with that whiner. . You should get right on that and find a new image for them, no pitchforks or pointed tongues. They hate that stuff, and what ever you do ,do not mention the kiss. Nothing burns up a satanist quicker than that, that’s when you will see the fur fly. Just kidding, they do not have fur, I was just being catty. So after you have given them a new name and image you shall have to keep an eye on them for they are still the same under the skin, they belong to him who hates you. Do not forget that, they do not hate you but their father does and he while a very poor dancer is very good at temptation. He also does not go after what he already owns. Just a little warning for you, but I am sure you know what satanist are, right. Wicca on the other hand, they are not against the human race, nor are they a fifth column. I leave them alone. Do not let the satanist talk religion to you as they were against man before man had a church, long before Christ came here they wanted to destroy mankind. Left handed, they are not the opposite of religion they are the opposite of mankind. Good luck on the making of satanist into a gentler more noble bunch. Who knows you may convert a few, we can only hope. God Bless. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 53 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Hi Sharon, Really, I was just listening to what devilsadvocate had to say in his posts - I tracked most of them down and formed an opinion of off what I read - he seems to disbelieve that we are all sinners (me too) and studies how to live with, and deal with, the human desires, in a way that entertains them, and controls them - he does not express the hate for mankind - they don't believe in Satan (me neither) I can't follow, other than information you've gained on your own, what is wrong with this guy or girl, devils advocate - he seems to live symbolically through a belief - weather its called Satanism or not, there seems to be no problem with him - I've read many books and articles on the subject, and I find allot to be wrong with the satanism I know of, but what devils advocate is saying is interesting and further more, not harming towards anyone - he doesn't cast judgment, or say sarcastic things like -"good luck on making of satanist into a gentler more noble bunch, who knows, maybe you can convert a few, we can only hope" Why the sarcasm? You were sarcastic in your last writing to me as well? I only tried to express that judgment is the cause of war - You see, I believe you enable the devil (which is just negative energy) by entertaining the idea on a daily basis - the devil ( = negative energy) doesn't exist in me, because I don't plant the seed, therefor it does not grow - I keep a strict routine of positive meditations, and positive mental reinforcement by certain mantras I do, and certain meditations I do - I wake up with all positive influence - I don't create the duality of god and the devil - All the people I've met on this site who entertain the idea of duality have been spiteful at my theories - they seem to have a certain amount, give or take, of fear of failure - failure of life - Studying God and the bible is great, and I love hearing all your comments on it, it's fascinating - but, you're so stubborn in the way that you insist your religion is right - end of story - it's niether - it's a theory. And I don't like that you (warn) instill into children that they'll go to hell, because you plant the seed of negativity in those poor kids, and also those people who may be weak at the time, looking for answers - you create fear in those who listen to you and believe you, and then you water the seed of that theory till it grows into a strong plant made up of fire, hate, evil, ect - I just wish you'd stop enabling the Devil (Devil = another way to say negative energy that has been branded into the mind by repetition) in the minds of those who have the natural birth-right to live with-out fear of life or god, or the devil - you say the only thing or person you fear is god - ok, well allot of us don't, we just love God (God = another way to say universal energy) Stop telling folks to fear God - and that they're going to hell - and that gays are sinful - and that we are all sinners - Your methods of stubborn religious practices, are and have been counter-productive as a whole for the world - wars are in direct result of religion being stubborn, and forceful - Accept everyone, and help everyone - not by using your theories they may not agree with, by lending an accepting hand out to them - if you've planted hell in your mind, fine! But keep it there! Don't spread that shit around! Just be nice, and help - On another matter - if there is a devil on this site - it's the Prophet lo .... something Tate - Man that guy is annoying - Ok, Sharon - Big hug for you, I'll send nice energy your way, All the best Jeffrey Costa | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 119 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.109.16 |
Hello there, well you say you find all this fascinating, so here goes. You are thinking of me as a Christian and I guess that means hell and stuff for you. You seem to think that I think everyone is going to go to hell. Where do you get these ideas? Boy you do not know me at all,but that is ok. You say that I am stubborn and insist my religion is right. What religion is that? For I go to which ever church is closest. Which one is right? I would guess you have never met the devil in person. Seems a shame for you could really get an understanding of him if you could know him personally. You want to spread the happy word and converse with satanist, that is fine. But really think about what you are saying. You find it odd that a satanist is not rambling on about evil and curses. Who would listen then. Who is listening now, I mean besides you? He did not try to frighten Christ with scary tales and silly rantings. He offered him power in a reasonable fashion. Of course he offered him something that he did not own but he is the devil for heavens sake. When did you ever hear of the devil being anything less than clever. He does not fool people with parlor tricks, but with reason and logic, his reason and logic . You think I care what you feel about the devil, well of course I do. What kind of person would I be if I didn’t . But I think you are his friend and that is why you defend him. For you sing the same song. Tell me of the children that I have told are going to hell. For I have told my own children they are going to go to heaven. Where are these children you speak of? You say that you think God should not be feared. Did you not fear your Dad, when you did wrong did you not have to suffer the consequences of your actions. Or were you perfect. To fear your Father is wise advise, for he tells you such. I do not fear him unless I am about to do wrong and know that I am doing so, that is as a child would be. If you did not ever fear your Dad I guess you will never understand your heavenly Father. There you are saying that you do not believe Satanist believe in Satan. Think about this, that is the same thing as a Christian saying they do not believe in Christ. You do not think that a satanist may have mislead you do you. You see I find it hard to believe that anyone would believe that, so you are either a satanist masquerading or a person who actually believes that satanist have nothing to do with satan. Since neither is a good choice , I shall chose the last. You see you want it to be a thing about thoughts but I say to you , the devil is more than thoughts. Good or evil are not made manifest by thoughts. Never were, never will be. You are a greater danger than the satanist. You tell people not to fear God. You say you love God , where is this love I hear of, I do not hear it in your words, the swearing was especially unchristian, and not very loving. So if you are going to preach to Christians try and not to curse, and do not be so judgmental . Especially on things about which you know so little. You judged me and you have no idea who I am, yet you defend the satanist. The question is not who am I but who are you? No Christian would not know who satan is, nor be unaware of his desire to destroy mankind through his own ignorance and folly. Do you desire that the pope of the satanic church would come here to a board where those suffering from the rejection and deceitful behavior of their former churches are regaining there faith and trust and say what ever he wishes and no one should say a thing to him. That he should not be rebuked. That satanist can use this place as a playground, and no one say anything negative to them. What is it you want. May God Bless you . Hope you still find this fascinating. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 94 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
As I said, the Satanists with whom I talked were not interested in evil or hangin' with any devils or demons. They aren't devil worshippers. This is your quote: This is all I was saying pertaining to what I have read from these people with the "out of place name - satanists" I went back and read what Mr. advocate (Mr. advocate? ha ha) and nothing he said gave any inkling of evil - I just can't bring myself to judge him on his title. He thinks differently of the word "satanist" - when I hear the word "satan - or satanist - or god-fearing - or 666 - anything like that, I think immaturity - I was basing my opinion of what Devil .... Mr. Devil had to say - all I got from that was his immpression of animalistic human nature, and how he believes that sin is a farce, and desire is a blessing, and so forth - You said you've seen the satanic doctrine and one of the most important commandmants is for them to deny the existence of the devil - but that could be taken in more than one way - If I was to eliminate the harsh cacophonous words like anything pertaining to Satanism, the idea that this guy presents is fine - that's why I asked if they would ever change their name, because if what he say's is true (never said I thought it was, never!) then great! Free yourself from guilt, don't fear God - whatever - Now, The devil is not anything more than a series of programed thoughts- this is where we disagree - before I go on - I'd like to ask you a few questions: Do you think of the devil as a being? What is he, it, they, to you - Do you think of God as a literal person, he, she, it, they, - ect - Do you think some people will go to a place called hell? And what does hell, to you, look like? What does heaven mean? Who, in your definition, goes to hell, and who doesn't? Now, sorry if my post seemed directed at you Sharon, you're right - I don't know you, I meant "you" as the partly christians that I've seen ans read on this site - and I based you off your sarcasm, for the second time towards me. No need for it, leave it in the mind - What do you think of the TT's? - this question also would be fascinating answerd by Mr. Advocate Do your children entertain the concept of hell as well as heaven? - if so, this is what I mean. You say that satanists (meaning Mr. Advocate) can use this place as a playground - so can everyone? It's mostly, Christians on this site that inform people of the many "man-holes" of hell they may fall in - oh yeah! That's the message where you again spewed forth sarcasm in my direction - no problem, just try and keep your opinions on the board not ("you can let people party their way into hell if you want to) sarcasm - As you believe in hell, it will manifest in you, as you believe in God, it will manifest in you. If you plant the seed of Hell (negative energy) in your mind, or anyone elses, you are enabling the potential of growth - just plant good positive energy, that's all I'm saying. And yes, I still find this fascinating. And no, and yes, """ I am wishing that the pope of the satanic church can come here and post whatever he likes, regardless of former church rejected people who are gonna here it - and no, I don't think he should not be rebuked, but this site is for debate and opinions - I never said you shouldn't say anything negative to him, say what you want, that's why we're here - I was simply stating an opinion of what I've read from him, based off only what he wrote, based off what he wrote only ..... ect ....... You never told children that they were going to hell, but I'm sure you informed them that their is a hell. I consider that to enable hell in the fertile minds of children. Wait, wait! I just read back, and you said: About the devil "I think you are his friend?" Meaning me! Whoa! ha ha ha, he's like frosty the snowman to me Sharon. he's a fictional character that is as popular to the Christians, as santa is popular to the children: and you couldn't convince either one that they're just a series of thoughts transcended into stubborn reality, until they both have grown and matured. And no Sharon, I didn't fear my Dad, he's an intelligent guy who never used force to disapline, he used logic and love. . also, out of that prior large post I typed, you picked out the word "shit" ha ha ha -- WOW! I won't use that word again, I didn't intend it to have an impact Sharon is my mother's name - just thought of it - all the best May God bless you too, And may Satan be cast by the light of God back to hell in the name of the lord!!! I command you Satan, be gone!!!! My Breathren, we are in battle with evil ............ Just Kidding! ha ha ha Jeffrey costa | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 226 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Good post. Content great, that is. (could do with just a bit more spacing/paragraphs) Liked what you had to say... | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 67 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.189.108 |
Jeffery Costa, Here are some links that I think would be helpful for you on understanding Satanism a little more. I also recommend reading the Satanic Bible, by Anton LaVey, at least the first two books. This link is to a basic over view of Satanism, both theistic and atheistic sects: http://free.freespeech.org/Ascendancy/websites/ascendancy/newmain/main.html Religious Tolerance.org: http://www.religioustolerance.org/satanism.htm Church of Satan home: http://www.churchofsatan.com/home.html For more links: http://www.beliefnet.com/boards/message_list.asp?boardID=28161&discussionID=42601 Happy hunting. Who knows, folks like Sharon might have the courage to look through these links too….. (Message edited by DevilsAdvocate666 on March 19, 2005) | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 68 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.189.108 |
Jeffery, Oh yes, I don't plan to change my alias any time soon, mostly because I'm too lazy and unimaginative to come up with a new one. Oh, and Sharon is still under the impression that a Satanist worships the devil, even though I've tried to tell her that its a symbolic based belief system. But what am I to expect, she is naturally applying a Christian understanding to a non-Christian religion, and her own kind of Christian understanding. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 98 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Mr. Advocate, Thank-you for the links, I'm sure I'll receive allot of flack for engaging in a brief study of them. But I'll take it for what it says, not what I think it says through the veil of another religion - I do realize that I have to put my prior childish, american beliefs on this subject aside - I am programed from youth, to cringe at the nature of words like satanism, 666, ect, ect, ect, This is completely understandable in light of what majority thinks of issues as a whole, and what one may free-think on their own: Funny, I was brought up as a raw-foodist, never attending school, having tv, or studying in the fasion that other kids did - and allot of what you are saying about your beliefs, are what we believed as well - we ride logic, and don't find it nessesary to plunder in guilt, or need forgiveness just for being born. Mother always taught us to think for our selves and study what others think, combine the two, and Presto!!!! You have a theory. But when I finally engaged in orthadox schools, and went to church to see what that was all about, I couldn't fathom the amount of brainwashing I saw - people, with-out any logical validation, were angrily speaking of talking snakes, and Adam and Eve, and all sorts of insane dogma - I then figured that the literal interpretation of these many many bibles, was false. That the information is metephoric and meant as, ............ almost like a poem, damb long poem though huh? Anyway, during my short visit so far, of postings on this site, God-fearing, God-loving, literal translating bible folk, have been trying to joust me of my theoretical horse. I tell them I don't think they should create the seed of hate in the minds of children, and others seeking a religious guidline, by creating this vision in their heads of a devil, and that we are all sinners, and that you could burn forever, and so on, and so on. Kids are fertile playing grounds for these ideas - when I was younger, a few friends down the street would tell me I was going to hell, because I put a frog in a rocket-launcher and blasted him to space (at least I "thought" the frog was an astronout) I was 9!!!!! They were 9!!!! and because of their elders, they entertained the vision, and feeling of hell - it's sad, and it causes judgment and fear, and that is in direct resullt to war. I'll read those sites and get back to you, Thanks! (Message edited by jeffrey_costa on March 20, 2005) | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 228 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
I understand about others having religious beliefs that prohibit and specifically exclude certain other things. I really do. But, in my book, the real religious people are the ones who don't scream and rave at those who they consider are on an opposite path. 'Less, of course, they actually want to alienate people away from Christianity....always a possibility. I thought for years that the only Satanism was theistic Satanism. I was raised in a strict religious home, friends were Christian (some still are)- whole thing flat out gave me the willies. But, due to my (now former) involvement in the Church of Scientology, I learned about indoctrination. Cults do it, yes, but so do other religions. Part of indoctrination is to leave part of the data out. (like about Satanists not all being theistic.) Indoctrination is not a substitute for true knowledge. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 101 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Mr. Fluff (Mr. Fluff? he he) I'll try'n space the sentences in my posts out / your right, I've a hard time reading closely nit sentences as well, Thanks for the advise - PS - I completely agree friend - If I were looking for a religion, I would stay clear of the Christianity I've witnessed on this site - they make religion a joke by acting out of malice, and then claiming the name Jesus and God - Odd. J. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 69 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.9.158 |
Jeffrey, Surprisingly, I come from a Christian family, Roman Catholic to be exact. Also, most of them are from the old world, so they have a very formalized and traditional belief system, much of it extremely conservative. I noticed though, the more Americanized the family was, the more liberal they tended to be in belief systems. As a second generation American, I grew up with the traditional upbringing, but, in an atmosphere that allowed me to research and explore for myself. And, my family, for the most part, knows of my Satanism, and either tolerates or accepts it. It took some time to over come some of the former views I had when I was a Christian, but with time and understanding, I was able to get past the uneasiness of terms like 666, Satan, etc. I found the best way to do this was actually research what these terms REALLY meant, and their historical content. I find that most of the fear regarding those terms stems from a lack of understanding of them, mixed with blind belief in what people say about them. Ball of Fluff is a Mrs. Oh, and don't get to bent outta shape about the "Christians" on this site. Some of them assume that because they call themselves Christian, they are immediately the authority in all things associated with sprituality and faith, and that they had the right to attack any infidels...not saying all Christians do this, you know, actual Christians strive to live like their founder,(which I can respect), but most of the Christians I've found here seem to be more stuck on living like Paul, and only when it comes to harassing non-beleivers like myself. That kind of behavior, using your proclaimed faith as a badge of superiority and liscense to harass others, yet claim repression when challenged, is beyond childish, its pathetic. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 231 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
Yes, I'm a girl ball of fluff.Another monicker I've used on various 'net activities is Fluffygirl. I just found, on the Wicca is Sicka thread, some more slander of yrs truly. Claims I'm anti Christian, then proceeds to list, paraphrased, quotes from me wherein I indicate respect of Christianity. Doesn't make a whole lotta sense, now does it. (Naturally, this was from Sharon) Then claims I'm "pervert(ing) the word" (the latter from Franklin) So, they're liars. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Intermediate Member Username: franklin Post Number: 407 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
Call me what you wish. I can forgive you for that. But don't slander my God. You did that when you implied he is a killer. My God is the creator of the entire universe, which includes you. Don't confuse my God with satan. He is the killer. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 108 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Oh yikes! One statement I would like a valid explanation - now this valid explanation can not use the overly, translated bible,(which I read and find brilliant) as an apparatus - "my God created the universe, which includes you" Could you please, pretty please, validate that? I'm not being sarcastic, or insulting, I just want to hear what "you" think - not what you read, but rather what you think. It sort of reminds me of when I was younger and friends would say " I bet you my Dad, can beat-up your Dad!" ------------------- Mrs. Fluff, You seem to be a pinata for the Christian members on some of the other posts - sorry. I don't think they mean what they say - **Jesus** "forgive them, they know not what they do" Ironic They're kinda putting you up on the cross so to speak - You'd think they would offer a kind hand, to those they feel are off the path to enlightenment, but it's completely opposite - Ironic. ------------------ Mr. Advocate First, thanks for the informative links you gave above - I printed and read everything in those - fascinating ........ Some of the prime principles have been what I've followed the duration of mt life - seems to have goten a terrible rap by other religions - It's interesting how people don't hear or see what's infront of them - You = "I don't believe in the devil or satan" Them = " satan is the evil one, he's a killer you = " guys! I don't believe in the devil, we use symbolic means to worship, I just told you that?" them = "down with satan!!! Down with satan!!!" Sort of annoying huh? Advocate, Could you tell me about your thoughts on the freemasons? Why people would deem them as evil - what were some of their ties to satanism, if any - and any other question pertaining to that? Thanks buddy, Happy spring! ***My Brethren, cast satan down!!!! cast him back to hell!!! He walks among us people, there's evil in the air!!! EVIL I TELL YOU!!!! EVIL >>>>>>>>>> EVIL <<<<<<<< UUhhhmmm, give it a rest Jeffrey (Message edited by jeffrey_costa on March 23, 2005) | ||
| happyperson (happyperson) Junior Member Username: happyperson Post Number: 33 Registered: 2-2005 Posted From: 217.15.96.18 |
Hi devilsadvocate666, First of all I'm a Roman Catholic and I want to remain like that always coz I feel that it helps me to become a better person. But that's me!!! So, no worries!!! I'm not going to change your opinion!! I wanted to ask you (coz I read an article)that satanism are the opposite of Christians. Now, Christian worship God. So satanist people are supposed to worship satan too. I mean on the other post u said that it is symbolic. So, what do you do? Is it true that once in your lifetime you have to kill a person (coz I heard that you have to do the opposite of all the 10 commandments). Sorry if I seem that I'm judging. But I want you to know that I'm not. I just want to make sure that if these statements are wrong. Thank you Your sister in Christ  | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 235 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
See other post. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 236 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
Hi, Jeffrey-- Yeah, I know. I posted on a Harry Potter, a Wicca and this topic and each time I had a select few (of which Sharon and Franklin are prominent) demanding to know my personal beliefs and affiliation which I refused to give them. Then they lied about my stance re Christianity. Which they kept doing. Lately, they're all pissy about a sarcastic post I wrote in response to an allegation that God saved some people's lives and I asked what about the ones who didn't make it- did Jesus want them for sunbeams (a reference/play on words to a very very old very well known hymn)? So now, looking for more ammunition (that's SO Christian, huh!) against me, Frankie is claiming that I am accusing his God of killing. Lame | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 113 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Well, like I said, I really believe they don't realize how defensive they become: But, I'm sure believing that your a sinner from birth weighs heavy on the spirit - Striving to be forgiven for ........... who knows what, must be tough - and believing you figured out the universe and its origin on your own, via scrambled bible ....... well, that just says it all huh? Uh oh mrs. Fluff, I'm gonna get it for that ..... ha ha ha Funny though, I never mean any offence, I just find peoples beliefs fascinating - my only qualm with stubborn religion - 1) projecting the idea hell, burning, satan, the anti-christ (my favorite) and such, because kids and folks who are searching with-out experience adapt these harmful, guild ridden theories, and this causes a long chain of hate, judgment, and war. 2) The "ONLY" way you can ...... because our way is the "ONLY"......... You "MUST" be saved through Christ .......... "MY" God created the universe ............. ect ect ect ........... I'm learning allot though - all in good fun: Doug is awesome Your a pleasure Wyoming is commical, and interesting, happypersons on the right track, and fuunny advocate is polite, and brilliant ex_yathed is hysterical Franklin seems a little angry, he'll get over it sharons fixated on the devil - poor thing hmmmmmm ........ You know, I'm having a feeling I'm gonna get some negative responses to this - Moving on .......... J. And the prophet - well, ..............? | ||
| franklin (franklin) Intermediate Member Username: franklin Post Number: 408 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
"my personal beliefs and affiliation which I refused to give them." You gave them. "I am a scientologist". Your words. If you are going to be sarcastic then say so. Or accept criticism. I, myself have been sarcastic, on this thread included, and da and others got real pissy. If you want to feel really persecuted, try being a Christian and post your beliefs on factnet. Then feel the ferocious wrath of the non-Christians. Hell hath no fury like which comes from a non-Christian. By the way, I don't believe I was a sinner at birth. I was pure, straight from God. But oh, how we learned of sin thereafter. I don't strive to be forgiven. I am. But I also ask for it and receive it daily. My forgiveness for you is real. Same as the forgiveness I receive from my God. Try it, you'll like it. Your view of the Bible may be scrambled, but mine isn't. It is the truth. Read it for yourself. Your misunderstanding of Christianity is warped. Because your knowledge of it comes from man, not God. Until you are truly born again, you will never understand. You will never experience the hope and joy only God can give you. I tried non God. I was not happy. I used to say and think the same things you do. I felt hollow. Then I tried God. Now I am happy. I feel fulfilled. It is not delusional happiness. It is real. I see real miracles everyday. You've tried non-God. Are you happy? | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 115 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.150 |
Hmmmm - non-God ....... interesting, so yes, my family and I have not held Jesus, or God as a figure head in our lives for generations, - we have a massive library, filled with a-z religious books, that we've read, and studied ........., used the information how we wished, and moved on. and yes, I'm very happy - Again though = " you will never experience the hope and joy "only" God can give you " Only - and never? Those two words strike me as false conclusions - this is by no way meant offensive towards you - but really friend, how do you validate that I will never experience the hope and joy only God can give me. You cannot validate that - You see, I use a different medium to achieve my own happiness - my medium is through very strict diet of only organic, raw vegetables and some fruits, keeping my PH level at a predominately alkline state - severe exercise, and meditation. I love my family, and my girlfriend of 10 years - I love my friends, I love playing music for a living, I love my life, and myself. everyday - but I would never tell anyone, that they cannot experience the joy and hope I feel until they believe as I do. I can't validate it, and it's not true! Period! How could I assume such? I guess if I were trying to prove something to myself by projecting that onto others. The bible has been massively translated - this is fact. - it requires blind faith, another word for belief with-out validation - And that's fine, but you must see where I'm coming from when I state that it is wrong to say, "you will never experience the hope and joy only God can give you" ???? You tied non-God, it didn't work, so ....... cool ....... worship whatever, but don't compare it, or hold it verbally over the heads of others - that's the type of attitude that causes problems among men. Franklin, where do you live? I mean, what state do you live in? Enjoy the night, Jeffrey 8 inches of snow tonight here - **sigh** | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 237 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
No, Franklin, those are not my words. Anone came on here and said something on that and my response was that I am ex Church of Scn and really don't have most of the beliefs I'd had. So, no. I haven't "tried non God" You don't, in fact, know what my beliefs are. You never have, you never will.You've nagged and nagged and demanded and demanded but I have never discussed my beliefs here and I never will. Years ago, on some forums, I did, and you can feel free to root through the internet for some old posts, but I no longer have the same views as when I wrote those posts. And since my views aren't the same as they were, it will do you no good. | ||
| happyperson (happyperson) Junior Member Username: happyperson Post Number: 38 Registered: 2-2005 Posted From: 217.15.96.18 |
Hi ball_of_fluff (cute nickname - I like it). In the posts you absolutely don't have to to mention your beliefs. I don't agree with Franklin when he said 'If you want to feel really persecuted, try being a Christian and post your beliefs on factnet.' To be a GOOD christian, you have to stop bothering people and judging them. Plus to be a good Christian you do not need to show off. I mean it will do no harm if you say I'm a Catholic or Christian but talking like I'm the only better person in this world is wrong. You show that you are a good person by the little things that you do or say like helping people, cheering up people, smiling, praying, and other good stuff that at the end of the day makes you feel a good person. Franklin you have to keep in in mind that some people are very open and some are not. And for the rest of you, I'm sure that Franklin is an amazing person and he seems to be sure about his religion which is a good thing!!!! your sisiter in Christ | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 238 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Hi, HappyPerson, It started when I was posting on a Harry Potter topic then on a Wicca topic. Later, on this one. In each case, I identified myself as NOT being Wiccan, Satanist or, for that matter, Harry Potter. That's really all anyone would need to know to engage in discussion with me- all the background info they'd need. My posts say what they say. The only reason a finger pointer like Franklin or Sharon would want to know my beliefs is to - point fingers. As Franklin has demonstrated for all of us yesterday. | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 121 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.103.189 |
Franklin... I know just what you mean, the pope of the satanic church came here to factnet where christians come to seek advise and help and posted his new years message and when I wrote to him I was attacked by non christians on that board. Not by satanists but by Fluffy and her friend. Said I was not nice enough. I have also been accused of being mean to the nazis, again not nice enough. Mr Jeffery calls me poor thing, fixated by satan, guess he missed the nazis. But I am glad he is happy. Nice he has a wonderful life. I wish I could just forget that satanist and nazis are here recuiting. Tell me Franklin do you think the young man who killed all those people the other day came to this site, I would guess so because if you type in satan or nazi this site comes up. To bad someone did not see this coming, oh wait we did. That was part of my message, about young people coming here and reading garbage. They are still searching for the young girl who was spending her time on satanist web sites, you can almost guess she was here, wonder what she saw. Bet her mother wishs someone had done something. But what is the harm, nazis and satanist are really nice people just misunderstood. As long as it is not your child who is missing. As long as the kid with the gun from the nazi board doesn t shoot your kid. Sure we can all be happy then. That is what it is all about , being happy and not rocking the boat.They think it is all a game, where is the harm. Really are they able to believe that satanist really do not believe in satan, he never existed they say. They really do believe that someone who is a follower of the Father of lies is telling them the truth. That is sad. But then their childen are home safe in their beds so why should they care what is true and what is not. Fluffy all about herself, defending the satanic pope like he was her best friend, no thought to anyone there but herself. Maybe her children will never read that message but other peoples children will. And there she will be defending the pope of the church of SATAN. I do not care that she defends witches or harry potter, saw all of the movies and read the books, I enjoyed them all. But defending satan, thats a little to liberal for me. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 239 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
I have never attacked Sharon. I have talked about some of the things she said and taken issue with them,but no "attacks" on Sharon. However, I cannot say I've been treated the same. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 70 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.3.184 |
Greetings Happy Person! First things first, I will not make any attempt to preach to ya about Satanism, as aggressive badgering of someone to change their religious beliefs is against my beliefs. So no worries. Hum, to address your question about us, Satanism breaks into two groups, Modern and Traditional. Modern Satanists, most notably those of the Church Of Satan, are pretty much atheists and agnostics who view Satan as a symbol or a force of nature, as opposed to a being or deity. I am a Modern Satanist. I would say that I'm not against Christians or Christianity. Its any ideology, (as defined as a system of beliefs/dogma/rhetoric used by one group to justify its actions and position of power over another), that vilifies humanity for being human, and discourages freedom of beliefs, thought and questioning. Yes, I'll be the first to admit, many Satanists, regardless of their sect, are anti-Christian, but this is because they often fail to make the distinction between religion and ideology. I do make such a distinction. Traditional Satanists are the ones who do worship or venerate Satan or Lucifer, but they tend to be polytheistic and follow a different cosmology than most Christians. And even then, there are many in that camp who have no problems with Christians what so ever. Still, I think the reason so many Satanists are defensive when approached with Christianity is that for many people, not just Satanists, Christianity has come to symbolize for them, oppression and authoritarianism. This is often due to three things: lack of experience with tolerant or accepting Christians on the part of the individual professing the anti-Christian beliefs, the history of abuses by individuals in power claiming to be "Christian", such as the Crusades or the Spanish Inquisition, or a lack of understanding of the beliefs of Christianity and the multiple sects within it, and the phenomena of extremely aggressive fundamentalism. As I grew up in a Roman Catholic family, I do have at least a moderate understanding of the faith and the beliefs in it, and as I have had many good experiences with Christians, and understand when its ideology as opposed to a person's faith being used for justification, I bare Christians, as a whole, no ill will. I just disagree in terms of philosophy, but not to the point I throw attacks at just anyone who I differ with. Oh, for me personally, I just try to pursue a life of self-improvement, and I don't harm anyone unless they really deserve it, i.e., they are either attacking me, or someone I care about, or something of the like. I don't bother with praying, (as I venerate no deity), nor do I do any of the rituals or cast spells, (though I know of a few spells, quite effective when properly employed), or the like. Traditional Satanists do have their own respective religious rituals, but I've yet to meet a real Satanist who lives up to the idea of the animal/person sacrificing nut case of popular culture. To harm an animal or a child like that is amongst the closest things you get to anathema in Satanism, as animals and children are deemed closer to accepting themselves as they are then most adults, and hence, should be protected and nurtured. It is true that as a Satanist, I have no problem indulging in what could be considered "sinful" behavior, but by no means are we to break the Ten Commandments just to do it. To a Satanist, you care free to do as you like, as long as no one innocent gets hurt. So, if you'd want to commit the sin of gluttony, then go to a buffet and pig out, no one is gonna stop ya. As for sex ethics, as long as it’s between consenting adults, I really fail to see the problem. Still, if indulgence in such sins is what we consider ourselves free to do, we also have to exercise proper responsibility, as we alone are responsible for our actions, and only have ourselves to blame if they turn out to be bad choices. As for me personally, I'd say I am really too lazy to go out of my way to "sin", as I don't believe in the concept of "sin". I do believe in the concept of doing something I really should be, but as a spiritual standard, I prefer to set my own. So, if anything, we are really individualists to the core, so one practice you may hear about from one Satanist may not be practiced by another. If you have any other questions, feel free to ask. Oh, and Sharon, I went to the Satanic Pope's site, and he was actually anti-Church of Satan. Very, very, anti-CoS. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 71 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.3.184 |
Jeffrey, Hum, I know only a little about the Freemasons, but I know they are not a Satanist organization. They are actually deists, they believe in a higher power, just not organized religion in general, and are open to all theists. They probably have a connection to Satanism as a throw back from their ancestry from the Knight Templars, Gnostic Christians who were wiped out by the medieval Catholic Church as they were deemed as heretics. They were charged with blasphemy and devil worship, and it’s claimed that they venerated the Devil under the name of Baphomet. But I doubt that much of any of that is true. Baphomet is considered to symbolize the dualistic nature of knowledge, that it can be used for both good and evil, and I think a few other traits like fertility. And, as they were still Christians, I doubt they would even venerate Satan, though the Gnostics have a very different way of looking at the world than their more mainstream Christian brethren. They emphasize more of an individual spiritual relationship with the divine, and look for god within, and tend to view Jesus as a spiritual leader, and a role module, akin to how most Theravada Buddhists look upon the Buddha. But I’d recommend going to a Freemason site to learn more about them, as my knowledge of them is extremely limited, and I’d probably go to a site like beliefnet, here’s the link: http://www.belief.net/boards/boards_main.AllCategories.asp?Category=119 To learn more about Gnosticism. Some Gnostics consider themselves Christians, others don’t. But over all, they are rather polite in my experience. | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 128 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.8.92 |
devilsadvocate666 .... You do not know how much I wish that you were on our side, boy oh boy could we use you. Are you sure you are not a Christian some where in your heart. YOu even admit that your knowledge of Masons is limited and send people to seach for themselves instead of believing a bunch of garbage. That is very Christ like, you had better watch out. Yeah the pope, I did not see the anti smoke myself but I hear that he is real. Well as real as an anti pope can be. Thanks for the info. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 242 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
While I don't see spiritual issues as a matter of taking sides, I know a lot of people who do. Even though I disagree with some of the things said in previous post by Sharon, still, it was a nice conciliatory post, as was the one she wrote on the Wicca thread. It would be nice to get along. | ||
| doug (doug) Advanced Member Username: doug Post Number: 739 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 138.89.26.205 |
da I hope you have a document you can copy and paste every time someone asks you about what Satanists believe. God help you if you don't. | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 134 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.76.73 |
ball_of_fluff ...I never had a problem with the Wiccans, I have always believed that most of these are innocent of hate and evil doing. They have more hate preached against them than hating. In most places I am defending myself from you, you spoke for the satanic pope so I assumed you are one of his, for who else would speak for him. Sorry if you are not. You see some people think this is a game but it is not. Real people come here, like that sixteen year old who was here telling us all about satan. Did you read his posts. He is who I am fighting for, him and all the children who might come here and believe what is said. People think words are not weapons. I say that they are the mightiest of weapons. Why do you think I did what I did with the satanic popes message. I want young people to know that all of us would not find them cool. Because most of them are searching for something, I do not want them to find satan and think he is a powerful god to worship. I do the same thing with the nazis, actually I am worse there for being straightforward. I see this as work, which I wish I did not have to do. And I just recently thought I would leave. I am tired and more is falling down than I can put back up. But then that young boy picked up that gun and killed more children. He was to all the nazi web sites and that means he was probably here, for when you type in nazi up we come. What did he learn, well it was not love. So I can not leave, unless some one takes my place. For what if tomorrow another child comes to this board, or reads the message of the satanic pope. There is no difference in what hate group it is the end result will be the same. What I said to da is true, for he is bright and very good at what he does. To get people to believe him. Think of it, the satanist do not believe in satan, he does not really exist, and if he does he is just a figure head. School children know better. But there are still some who would believe it. I think that da is so clever he could convince people that they all get together and knit mitten for the kittens. And while this is a gift it is the same one that Hitler used to convince the world that the Jews were going to take over the world. The same tracts that were used then against the Jews, now have masons named in stead. But it is the same garbage. Thirty years ago I was fighting nazis and hate groups, so you can guess I am tired. I did keep the Moonies off our streets here where I live. I also pointed at the kkk, and other hate groups where I live. Yeah I am popular here also. But in those days it was a much more personal thing, no internet. My parents did not like that I used my real name. They were afraid for me, I did not have the brains to be afraid. But I always felt that a black mother could not really stand up against the kkk, nor could her son. But I could. What is the worst that they could do, kill me, big deal. This was before I became a born again, so think of how much that changed me. I care less now what they might do to me, because my Father protects me. You see I think that in my heart I think of all children as my children, even when I was a child. That young man who just took a gun and killed all those people, he could have been my son, it could be me laying in a coma and my son blows his own brains out after killing others. We failed him. He joined that nazis instead of a church of any kind. I do not know why I am telling you all of this, I guess maybe it was that olive branch. I did want you to understand that even I know that the term zealous fits me more than a little. I was burying bottle when I was seven with pictures of people and things so that when the world was destroyed that those that came after us would know what we once were. I did not understand what I was doing at the time and I did not even remember it until a few years ago, so I guess I have been this way for a while. You know what they say you can not teach an old dog new tricks. So here we are, I hope that this explains a little of who I am. My messages to the nazis and Satanists will probably not get any less biting, but maybe you will let them slap me, they are quite capable you know. Like me they have the gift of gab. I know I know you have it to and a gift is hard not to use. So if you do I will not take it personally. How is that. And I will try to keep my finger pointing down to the minimum | ||
| happyperson (happyperson) Junior Member Username: happyperson Post Number: 41 Registered: 2-2005 Posted From: 217.15.96.18 |
Hi devilsadvocate666, first of all thanks for answering my questions and thanks for your information. Still I do have more questions to ask. hahaha. So, if you consider Satan as a symbol, then can't u call yourself an aetheist instead of satanist? I mean satan is evil. So, aren't you afarid of evil? I mean what if you find out that satan really exists, then wouldn't you be afriad that you'll spend the whole eternity with him? You see I'm a Catholic and I'm not perfect but I do my very best to be a good person and I'm still afriad and ask myself, 'What if I go to hell?' Still, I'm not saying that you have to be a Catholic to be a good person, but isn't it more safe to ask yourself, 'What if God really exist?' I'm not saying that you are a bad person coz u seem kind and respect other people, but aren't you afriad of just calling yourself the deviladvocate? Although it may seem that I am exaggerating, I still see it as frightening. Also, as children and animals should be protected, aren't adults to be protected too? I mean I know that adults now are grown-ups and they should know how to protect themselves, but in reality I believe that every human being should be protected. Remember that those same children that you tried to protect, now they have become adults (so they remained the same persons). So we should love and protect every human being. Plus adults should be protected so that they will be able to protect their children. As for saying "I don't harm anyone unless they really deserve it, i.e., they are either attacking me, or someone I care about, or something of the like." I agree with you. hahaha. I always end up fighting with someone who tries to hurt someone who is innocent or my sister (even though she's older than me and getting married next year!) hahahha. But that'natural and it's not evil. Ohh and one last question, 'How come did u want to be a satanist (from a Catholic)?' Thank you very much your sister Happyperson I hope I didn't bother you or offend you by what I said. I just feel curious about how you feel and what you believe. youe | ||
| happyperson (happyperson) Junior Member Username: happyperson Post Number: 42 Registered: 2-2005 Posted From: 217.15.96.18 |
ohh and one last question devilsadvocate666!!! if you happen to have children, will you be happy if they tell you that they want to be satanist? Say the truth. ok? What would you prefer to hear them say, 'I am an atheist?' or 'I am a satanist?' or 'I am a Chrisian/Catholic...' I know that u will love them no matter what and that u will respect their opinion but what would you prefer to hear them say? Thanks again and talk to you soon. (Keep smiling keep shining!!!) | ||
| infoman (infoman) Intermediate Member Username: infoman Post Number: 204 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 67.175.179.251 |
Foolishness of playing with things of Satan. Messing with the occult is messing with Satan and is just plain stupid without power over Satan and demons. It's like walking into a lions den unarmed. Lions are wild, have teeth and eat flesh. Only with the power of "Jesus name" which comes from having accepted Jesus into your heart and being born again in your spirit from above, will you be able to render Satan and spiritual demons harmless from doing evil against you. There is a heaven to gain and a literal hell to shun in the spirit realm. Satan and his demons are real and only have one attribute and nature EVIL. God has given you the solution and priviledge to have "authority over all the power of the evil one." Use the name of Jesus commanding all evil to cease and be removed. "The name of Jesus is above every name that is named on the earth, under the earth and abovre the earth." Quit living below your privledges and accept Christ today and take your authority in Jesus name. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 247 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Hi, Sharon, It's always good to get along. I'm neither an atheist nor a Satanist. I do prefer to discuss theological, spiritual, cultic, religious issues from as an objective a standpoint as I can. Meaning, rather than say "Ok, I believe in XYZ and that's why I feel that so and so's cult/religion/occult practice/mystic spelling bee is bad"-- I would rather say something like "What I find interesting about so and so's deal is that X, but I have also noticed Y." | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 138 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.110.55 |
ball_of_fluff ...You have that right. I wish I could say i will be different in the future but that is not likely. I am born again and well you know what that means. But baby steps baby steps. Nice to make peace. Seems funny. Nice but funny. Well trent awaits me, he misses me if I do not go and say hi, dont want to make him jealous talking to you to long. | ||
| marilyn_m (marilyn_m) New member Username: marilyn_m Post Number: 9 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.222.57.138 |
Hi Sharon, I would like to talk to you too, or do you prefer to only talk to the boys ( thats a joke by the way)} | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 248 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
By the way, I do pray. Just in case you wanted to know. So peace and thanks, Sharon. | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 150 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.106.221 |
marilyn_m .... Hello. Welcome to factnet, we are a group of all different sorts. Many have much to teach, many have much to learn. Some come and some go. I have been here for awhile and I too come here and then I go. Last year I left for awhile and when I came back I needed a password and membership to write. You will find it a joy and a pain here, but well worth it. ball_of_fluff ... I liked harry potter, just in case you wanted to know. I liked the books and the movies. Not only that I went to every one of them on opening night and Im pretty sure I was the oldest person there. I know it may not seem it but I am a child at heart. I am glad you pray. Love and Peace Sharon. | ||
| marilyn_m (marilyn_m) New member Username: marilyn_m Post Number: 20 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.222.57.138 |
Sharon, thanks for the welcome ,i find your comments interesting, i don't always agree with them but i do respect them & when i do agree BOY DO I AGREE.some of your stuff just blows me away.i look forward to hearing more from you . | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 72 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.0.232 |
Informan, What experience do you have with the occult? Really, do you even know what that word means? What it refers to? I refers to “that which is hidden”, often knowledge. Only those who don’t have an understanding of the meaning of that tem foolishly associate it with evil or dark magick or demon summoning. And by what authority to you presume to command me, and make accusations which you have no proof of? Sharon, I wouldn’t make the claim I have a well spring of knowledge on the Free Masons, as I would be lying if I did. So, rather than give out information I don’t have, I felt it would be better to admit my lack of knowledge in that field and give a link that could lead to the desired information. I wouldn’t consider my self a Christian for several reasons, mostly going back to a lack of faith. To me, faith is something that develops on its own, often through experience, and cannot be forced or gained through constant study or the like. It comes on it own. And, as I don’t have the faith necessary to be a Christian, I don’t make any claims of being one. It would be false and insulting to the religion, which is something I really don’t feel like doing, as it would just be pointless. Happy Person, Actually, as a Modern Satanist, I am also an atheist. “Satan” exists to me, as a symbol only, not a real being. The symbol that “Satan” represents for me is more of humanity’s primal nature, not necessarily good or evil, but self-interested in the point that all humans have basic animalistic instincts like hunger, the need to defend and retaliate if attacked, self-preservation, etc. As a human though, and a thinking creature, I don’t view these as bad, but rather take them for what they are, and learn to live with them, control them, and embrace them. For me, there isn’t this evil figure when I think of “Satan”, as I don’t believe in a monolithic source of evil. Evil to me, comes in more mundane sources, such as the exploitation of the innocent, genocide, etc. Actually, the name “Devil’s Advocate” was a term that refers to a person who plays the role of adversary in testing out an idea or plan, to help make it better. It also refers to a person who poses counter arguments with the intent of making things interesting or challenging another person’s perspective. I actually first invented this alias on another site, meaning to go an debate with people, but I bought this one over mostly because I am too lazy and uncreative to come up with a new one…hahaha… Adults should be protected just like kids, hell, just like anyone else really. The difference to me is that most adults tend to have a better grasp of their actions and the results better than most kids. And, if they do a crime, they have to take responsibility for it. And, if they harm someone I care about, then they are fully responsible for their actions, and thus, deserving of punishment. So yes, to go around randomly attacking innocent people, child or adult, to me is a very bad idea and wrong, as most people probably have done nothing to deserve such, but if an adult consistently harms those around them for the sake of doing so, then something must be done about that individual to prevent them from performing that behavior again. I came to the realization of my status of being a Modern Satanist over many years. I left Catholicism mostly because I had negative experiences with the faith, lacked faith, and had constant heretical ideas that were my core beliefs that were just incompatible with Christianity in general. I then became an atheist and over some time of studying various religions, I thought that I should probably see what Satanism was about, as I didn’t believe what I was being told about it. I wanted to see what it was all about, and verify the truth of claims of devil worshippers for my self, as I was naturally skeptical. I found out about Modern Satanism, and decided to read the Satanic Bible by Anton LaVey, and found many of my own beliefs staring me back in many of the pages. But, keep in mind that Modern Satanism is more of a philosophy for me, so, for me, I finally had a name to give to much of my philosophical beliefs. So, philosophically, I’m a Satanist, religiously, I’m an atheist. And my religious beliefs are also ever evolving too. If I were to have children, I wouldn’t mind if they were Satanists, Christians, Buddhists, Atheists, etc, as long as they studied their beliefs and picked the religion/philosophy that most matches their beliefs. I don’t care if their beliefs radically differ from mine, I just want them to have become part of their respective faiths or lack there of, by their choice and reason, not by compulsion. This shows me that they’ve actually thought of what they believe, and as such, limits the possibility that they would be blind followers. If its one thing I can’t stand, its blind follower ship coupled with the demand that others do likewise. Either way, I’d support them with their beliefs and search for knowledge and purpose. | ||
| happyperson (happyperson) Member Username: happyperson Post Number: 51 Registered: 2-2005 Posted From: 217.15.96.18 |
Thanks deviladvocate, now I do have a more clear picture of what you believe. It seems to make much more sense to me now. hahaha. I'm glad you don't worship the devil though (it's much safer u know). As you said, about being blind-folded. I totally agree with you. Although I'm Catholic, I'm not blind-folded coz I talked to other people with other beliefs but I still feel that being a Catholic is good for me. And if I have kids I will accept their beliefs too even if it's different from mine. But if they are in the wrong path (such as harming people), I wouldn't accpet that even though they would be my children. Thanks for your information. I liked talking to you!!! your happy sister (in Christ) | ||
| anone (anone) Member Username: anone Post Number: 79 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 213.48.162.53 |
Franklin: You gave them. "I am a scientologist". Your words. Ball of Fluff: No, Franklin, those are not my words. Anone came on here and said something on that and my response was that I am ex Church of Scn and really don't have most of the beliefs I'd had Presumably, most of the beliefs you had, have now changed again since Jan 2005? Ball of Fluff: I am a Scientologist. Scientologists like Scientology. If this is a problem for you, then feel free to find or start a forum where only one point of view on the subject is allowed. Until that happy day dawns, then deal with it. Mon, Jan 17 2005 Note the date. TOM PADGETT suggests Dr. Touresky is a Withhunter. Ball of Fluff: "I am a Scientologist" Ball of Fluff sure does ride the fence. Oct 17 2004 Claire Swazey/Fluffy Girl/Ball of Fluff: Proven Liar. Once again. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 251 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
No such post anywhere on Factnet. And, no, I have not posted my beliefs. I personally know many Methodists who have different beliefs from other Methodists. So.Nope. But thanks for playing. We have lovely parting gifts. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 252 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Hi, Sharon, When I was a kid my parents bought me the fairy book series edited by Andrew Lang (the blue, the green, etc) I had some old Edwardian era children's classics that had magical adventures in them (5 Children and It, etc) and used to really enjoy books by people like Edward Eager, as well. Oh, and Oz! Our Evangelical Christian friends (Our family was Catholic)- very devout people- had bought every Oz book for their kids. Those kids had Oz books I never heard of. I loved Oz. So when Harry Potter came out, I found that it was very nostalgic for me to read them. Plus, they really are well written. It's funny about referring to praying, too. When I'm around people who do not, I'll say something like (when something's going on with them) "I'll have a good thought for you, I'll cross my fingers" -particularly when I'm at work because I don't want to bring up religion there. But when I'm with my Christian friends, I feel I can come right out and say "Yes, I prayed about it" or "I will pray for you" etc. 'Cept when I was working in the South for a year. There, it's very common for people to talk about God and prayer in the workplace, so I was able to just say that the way it really was "I am praying...I will pray"..etc- when I worked there. And when I pray, I often do feel a presence and I believe that sometimes I actually get an answer, though it isn't always as expected. Really. I mean that. | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 170 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.12.20 |
devilsadvocate666... I must say that for a satanist you are awful moral. Does that not get in your way? Couldn’t you call yourself a non Christian intellectual or something. Why does it have to be a satanist, just sounds so darn evil. I guess you might think me a little zealous, a nice word for it, even some christian do not care for the way I speak. But then we are all different, and I am not here to make Christians happy either. But you do not call names nor any of the other things that I expected. I like that , respect that , but would still like to change you. But you knew that, I am still praying for you, because we need you and I do not intend to stop. Just wanted you to know. The power of pray is a mighty force so you had better look out. I fitting up a pair of Jesus boots for you right now. Well I had better get out of here cause I think Fluff is going to come back and she is not going to be happy with that post above me. Catch you on the flip side. | ||
| anone (anone) Member Username: anone Post Number: 80 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 213.48.80.21 |
Ball of Fluff: No such post anywhere on Factnet. Weak, very weak and transparent. Always slippery and duplicitous, which is exactly why the Satanism section is perfect for your character, or lack of it. By their "friends", you shall know them. Who decided personal quotes on the NET were restricted only to Factnet? Who previously qualified their own statements with such a SATANIC RULE? Not you, not Franklin, not I. Just another SLY attempt at changing the rules of the "game" once you were exposed AGAIN, as the duplicitous LIAR that you are. The Internet is a big place, but your lying inconsistencies are plastered all over it "Lady" and you'll be constantly called on them and constantly EXPOSED. You may try to compartmentalize your life, trying to hide your own personal DARKNESS, but it won't wash anywhere else. All will see that you're forever playing loose with the truth and judge it for what it's worth. Always trying to deceive, whatever forum you're on. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 253 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
See previous post. I don't discuss my beliefs. And I'm not going to. As I said, I have known several Methodists who didn't have at all the same theological views as other Methodists. Yet they all call themselves Methodists. Names aren't beliefs. Beliefs are beliefs. A statement like "I believe in X" would be your first clue. I can name several forums where, right now, Scientologists are completely disagreeing with one another about things Scientological.And they all call themselves Scientologists. I know a number of Jewish people who all call themselves Jews, and do not agree on many points. So, no, you just have a category name that you are attributing to me from some unrelated forum. I have no obligation to disclose anything to you. You have done nothing to warrant it. Quite the contrary. People like you are so funny. Act really venomous, nasty and generally unpleasant then wonder why they can't get the person at whom that's directed to do what they want. Gee, wonder why. So, no. You don't know why my beliefs are. But you have succeeded in making yourself look like a nut and a cyberstalker. Congratulations! | ||
| anone (anone) Member Username: anone Post Number: 81 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 62.30.106.18 |
Ball of Fluff: As I said, I have known several Methodists who didn't have at all the same theological views as other Methodists. Yet they all call themselves Methodists. Presumably they didn't deny it when others claimed they were Methodists, as you did above, ref. Scientologists? But you have succeeded in making yourself look like a nut and a cyberstalker. That's your educated opinion is it? The word of a proven duplicitous LIAR? Whatever Claire, those who hold a mirror to your lies suddenly become a "nut" huh? And you've succeeded in making yourself look like the LIAR we all know you are. Now lurkers, please note, this could go on ad infinitum! You're exposed. Again!. Not me. I have no cyber past, unless you care to speculate, nicely exposing your own paranoia? Why don't you run and defend Terril on OCMB? He needs your "help". Too bad. Boo hoo. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 74 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.9.229 |
Sharon, I find that my sense of morality doesn't conflict at all with my Satanism. Satanism is a very individualistic belief system, and as such, we are free to decide our own codes of conduct, save for a few restrictions backed and based in reason, not divine or infernal inspiration. I think I use the term Satanist because of the concepts I associate with Modern Satanism, where as many people automatically here or read "Satanist", they will associate it with the beliefs about it, (despite their inaccuracy) promoted by popular culture. So, to many, the term, "Satanist" invokes an evil image, where as to me, it doesn't. Happy Person, The pleasure of chatting with you was all mine. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 254 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Anone, perhaps you should post your real name and physical location as I've done in the past instead of cyberstalking and whining behind a cloak of anonymity. Would make you look less like a stalking nutcase. As to "OCMB" or other "posts" on other "forums", I have no idea what you're talking about. If it ain't on Factnet, I've nothing to discuss on Factnet. | ||
| anone (anone) Member Username: anone Post Number: 82 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 213.48.162.2 |
Ball of Fluff: As to "OCMB" or other "posts" on other "forums", I have no idea what you're talking about. Tuesday, March 29, 2005 Very highly convenient for you! You believe you can flit from forum to forum, lying through your teeth and not be called on it? Dream on. Ball of Fluff: If it ain't on Factnet, I've nothing to discuss on Factnet Okay, we'll play by your rules for a while. Harvested quotes from Factnet: Ball of Fluff: I am a Scientologist who practices Scientology... November 12, 2003 Ball of Fluff: Perhaps I should call myself "Scientologist's Friend"- no, wait, can't do that, that implies I'm already not a Scientologist. August 25, 2004 There's lots more in a similar vein. Those two will do for now. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 255 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Wow. Those are really old. And they weren't ever posted on Satanism subboard in any case. Which is where we are posting now. So, nope. Sorry. I ain't discussin' them. And, as I said, I've known many Scn'ists, Methodists, Jews, etc, who called themselves those things and yet had very different beliefs than others who also called themselves such. As I said, you don't know my beliefs. I don't discuss them on critical forums. So dig up whatever it is you think I wrote wherever, it's just appellations. Cyberstalking nut! | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 133 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.205 |
Ball Of Fluff, First off, pleasure to hear from you: Second - my apologises go out to you in light of this verbally impotent "internet lawyer". He certainly does seem to be entertaining a void in himself. Loneliness can surface in the most peculiar of places. Maybe he'd be willing to start a member complaint thread, so those who are visiting this post wouldn't have to wade through bitter water? Advocate, Do you attend a certain church, or place of worship/study? And do you consider modern satanism to be a philosophy or religion? I realize the belief is individualistic, so from your stand point. Before you switched your religion over, had you met anyone who was either a traditional or modernistic satanist? I have met a few, but they fit the stereo-type mold - young, black garments, you know the rest. Thanks for handling these questions in a polite informative manner, I appreciate it ......... Jeffrey, | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 256 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
I don't discuss my beliefs on Factnet. So, no, you don't know what they are. I haven't lied about any- I just won't discuss them. And you haven't discussed any beliefs you think I or anyone else might have. You've just discussed labels and posts made on other boards. Posts which did not discuss any beliefs, not Christian, not Scn, not Satanist. This is a sub-board pertaining to Satanism. That's all it is.Your issues with people who post to other sub boards, other message boards, other ngs, are irrelevant. Satanism is the topic under discussion. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 257 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
Hi, Jeff, Anone's posts certainly speak for themselves. Heh. I don't owe that person anything. Perhaps some of the others here should see if they can get Anone to stay on topic and actually discuss Satanism. Fat chance o' that. Well, he/she/it/they/hive mind whatever, sometimes post on the Scn sub brd of Factnet but it mainly seems with intend of bashing. Seems that the interest in bashing is viewed as portable and universally applicable by this entity. Which puts it squarely in the realm of crazy troll. Every now and again on usenet, you'll see someone post to numerous boards about one person, vilifying them and posting names, etc. It's fairly common. What it means is that the person under discussion pissed off a nut. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 75 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.3.55 |
Jeffery, I personally, attend no form of church or services of any kind. Modern Satanism, to me, is more of a philosophical belief system, though there are some sects of Modern Satanism that do have formalized services and "churches", most notably, the Church of Satan. Actually, I don't think I've met any real Satanists before making the change to Satanism. Once I did though, I've met quite a few both Modern and Traditional Satanists. A few met the stereotypical dress, others don't. It really depends on what style they have. I've met a few that are dressed rather preppy, actually. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 258 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
Naive question here-- when a theistic type Satanist worships, does his thing, etc,is he doing something he considers "evil" and if so, is it that he has a different definition of evil than the common one? Not to be insulting, but would such an individual be interested in doing or condoning harm? (Ok, some of my Catholic upbringing is obviously rearing its head, but I'd like to know. I had read a book about these death rockers in Norway who were pretty callous, but it seemed to me that their worship was more something they twisted and used as a rationale to excuse things they wanted to do anyway.) | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 76 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 4.185.9.52 |
Ball of Fluff, Actually, your average theistic Satanist, (I'm talking about mature ones, not the "I'm a dark warrior of Lucifer" types), tend to have their own personalized rituals or ceremonies to praise the Adversary, the Bringer of Light, etc. From what I've gathered, they are nothing like the holly wood stereotypes, and as many theistic Satanists do not follow the Christian cosmology of Satan=Evil and God=Good, Heaven, Hell, the Bible, and the like, they have no use for doing what many may consider evil acts. To many of the theistic Satanists I've met, harming an animal or sacrificing an innocent human being is just as repulsive to them as it would be to a Christian. So, I'd have to say that it depends on the individual sect, but never have I once found proof of animal or human sacrificing or the like in any of those ceremonies. And, to farther clear things up, Traditional Satanists, one the whole, do not believe they are servants of evil, nor do they think they should be. They are simply worshipping a pre-Judeo-Christian deity, not a quasi-god of evil that Christians view Satan or Lucifer to be. The only harm they would condone is that in self defense or retaliation. And, yes, there are individuals who claim to be Satanists, such as many of those death rockers you speak of, but many of them just use the title as an excuse to act irresponsibly and cause harm at their whims. And, many of them are only Satanists in name or image. Also, a few of them aren't even Satanists, but Asastru, worshippers of the Norse Gods like Odin and Thor. And, even then, they aren't particularly pious. I'll be the first to admit, we have our crazies, but they are a fringe group, and every belief system has them. And these fringe groups are despised by Satanists even more than they would be despised by Christians or anyone else. Why? They help promote countless malign stereotypes that paints us more civil and reasonable Satanists as malefactors and menaces to society. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 261 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
That's interesting. So I'm guessing that "Satan" is an older name? Pre Christian? Maybe the Christians then appropriated it? Otherwise, wouldn't there be a different name for this entity? | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 142 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.212 |
Advocate: In and about this post site, I have witnessed Christians rationalize their omniscient "facts" on the way the universe works. They have "among themselves" declared they worship the "only God" - and their way in to heaven is the "only way", and hell will be to pay for those not "enlightened" to this "fact". Did this hauteur attitude by christians push you from being catholic? At a young age, could you see something was wrong? You had said prior that most modern satanists were above average intelligence, why do you think this is? Your ideals are almost identical to my families and myself. We could never take seriously the jargon from pedestal opinions on life and its meaning. I find Christianity beautiful and rich, but the majority of literalists are a detriment to peace on this planet. Also, on one of the other threads for satanism, a man who calls himself the satanic pope (blackwood666) seems to disaprove of modern satanism .......... do you know this fellow? The best of luck, Jeffrey Ms. Fluff, Not a naive question, great topics .. keep it up. Jeffrey (Message edited by jeffrey_costa on April 01, 2005) | ||
| franklin (franklin) Intermediate Member Username: franklin Post Number: 446 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
"I find Christianity beautiful and rich, but the majority of literalists are a detriment to peace" (to us devil worshippers) "on this planet." "literalists"? If you don't believe the doctrines of your faith literally, then you are not of that faith. "You had said prior that most modern satanists were above average intelligence." Sounds pretty haughty to me. Jerry, you've earned 1st prize in the Christian-hating contest tonight. Congrats. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 152 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.187 |
Literalists meaning "burning lake of fire" - "only one God" - "only one way to heaven" - Literalists interpret the already interpreted, overly translated series of books to mean exactly what it reads: Talking snakes and poison apples - Adam and Eve and parting seas - You know, childrens fairy-tales - Instead of pulling my writing from posts, you might want to try and create your own, it will build your creativity. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 153 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.91.101.187 |
This list of people seem runner-ups for 1st prize Franklin, do I really deserve such an honer? Nuevo_nacida and others claiming to have penetrated the mystery of the divine universe: Your obstinate theories lined heavy with currents of judgement, suspend this world from experiencing unity as a whole. You energetically barricade alternate paths, and shackle those youth whom are new, and searching for a guideline philosophy to exist by. Your pedestal opinions, and use of the word "only" is in direct result of war upon this planet. According to your unvalidated, blind-faithed, sheep-like ideology, man will suffer immensely if they don't abide to life as you do. Man must believe as you do, man must walk with you unless doom is the latter. A list of those en route to the plutonic pandemonium in accordance with Jesus and followers: The greek Philosopher Anaxagoras - his writings pertaining to Gods being only mystic abstractions, let him to a dungeon charged with impiety and handed a death sentence. This all for exercising free thought: Protagoras, another greek philosopher who declared no validation for Gods, fear among the people created need for saviour and fantasy: John of Lackland: He was excommunicated as king for holding contempt for Christianity: Francois Marie Arouet "Voltaire" Quote - " Christianity is the most rediculous, the most absurd and bloody religion that has ever infected the world." Little did he know that upon our time now, it is the most sexually devious, criminally saturated religion. The churches are actually closing in light of these scandals: Benjamin Franklin - "The way to see by faith, is to shut the eye of reason" - according to NN and others, he resides in hell as we speak. Foolish! David Hume, philosopher - "Christianity cannot be believed by any reasonable person" Fredrick the Great, King - ". . . you will certainly grant me that neither antiquity nor whatever nation has devised a more repulsive and blasphemous absurdity than that of eating your God. This is the most disgusting dogma of Christian religion, the greatest insult to the Highest Being, the climax of madness and insanity." (from a letter to Voltaire, March, 19, 1776) Thomas Paine, English born American author and revolutionary leader (1737-1809). "later generations reviled him for his social and religious views. Theodore Roosevelt called him a 'filthy little atheist.' . . . He is probably the most illustrious American Revolutionary uncommemorated by a monument in Washington, D.C." James Madison, American president and political theorist (1751-1836). "During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry, and persecution." "In no instance have . . . the churches been guardians of the liberties of the people." "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise." [April 1, 1774] Napoleon Bonaparte, French emperor (1769-1821). A theist, for sure, but he knocked religion: "Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet." "All religions have been made by men." "as for myself, I do not believe that such a person as Jesus Christ ever existed; but as the people are inclined to superstition, it is proper not to oppose them." Auguste Comte, French philosopher and mathematician (1798-1857). Comte is considered the father of sociology. Elizur Wright, American (1804-1885). "Christianity is itself a total failure... so far as it is a plan of saving souls for a future life without saving souls and bodies for this." Charles Robert Darwin, English naturalist (1809-1882). From the age of forty he was, to use his own words, a complete disbeliever in Christianity. He professed himself an Agnostic, regarding the problem of the universe as beyond our solution, "For myself," he wrote, "I do not believe in any revelation. As for a future life, every man must judge for himself between conflicting vague probabilities." "It appears to me (whether rightly or wrongly) that direct arguments against christianity and theism produce hardly any effect on the public; and freedom of thought is best promoted by the gradual illumination of men's minds which follows from the advance of science." Abraham Lincoln, American president (1809-1865). John T. Stuart, Lincoln's first law partner: "He was an avowed and open infidel, and sometimes bordered on Atheism...He went further against Christian beliefs and doctrines and principles than any man I ever heard." Joseph Lewis quoting Lincoln in a 1924 speech in New York: "The Bible is not my book nor Christianity my profession. I could never give assent to the long, complicated statements of Christian dogma." Edgar Allan Poe, American writer (1809-1849). "No man who ever lived knows any more about the hereafter ... than you and I; and all religion ... is simply evolved out of chicanery, fear, greed, imagination and poetry." "The idea of God, infinity, or spirit stands for the possible attempt at an impossible conception." Karl Marx, German political philosopher and economist (1818-1883). Marx saw religion as "the sigh of the oppressed creature . . . the opium of the people, which made this suffering bearable." Walt Whitman, American poet (1819-1892). Walt reportedly said, "God is a mean-spirited, pugnacious bully bent on revenge against His children for failing to live up to his impossible standards.$quot; Does this mean he believed this mean-spirited bully didn't really exist? I'm not sure. Andrew Carnegie, Scottish-born American industrialist and philanthropist (1835-1919). "I don't believe in God. My god is patriotism. Teach a man to be a good citizen and you have solved the problem of life." Samuel Clemens "Mark Twain", American author and humorist (1835-1910). "Faith is believing what you know ain't so." "'In God We Trust.' I don't believe it would sound any better if it were true." "It ain't the parts of the Bible that I can't understand that bother me, it is the parts that I do understand." "Religion consists in a set of things which the average man thinks he believes and wishes he was certain of." "There is no other life; life itself is only a vision and a dream for nothing exists but space and you. If there was an all-powerful God, he would have made all good, and no bad." Thomas Edison, American inventor (1847-1931). "Religion is all bunk." "I have never seen the slightest scientific proof of the religious ideas of heaven and hell, of future life for individuals, or of a personal God." Luther Burbank, American horticulturist and pioneer plant breeder (1849-1926). "The Bible is an incomplete history and the folklore of an ancient race, but no more inspired, I believe, than the works of Marcus Aurelius and other great men of the day." Sigmund Freud, Austrian physician and pioneer psychoanalyst (1856-1939). "It would be very nice if there were a God who created the world and was a benevolent providence, and if there were a moral order in the universe and an after-life; but it is a very striking fact that all this is exactly as we are bound to wish it to be." "In the long run, nothing can withstand reason and experience, and the contradiction religion offers to both is palpable." "The whole thing is so patently infantile, so foreign to reality, that to anyone with a friendly attitude to humanity it is painful to think that the great majority of mortals will never be able to rise above this view of life." Freud certainly regarded belief in God as an illusion that mature men and women should lay aside. The idea of God was not a lie but a device of the unconscious which needed to be decoded by psychology. A personal god was nothing more than an exalted father-figure: desire for such a deity sprang from infantile yearnings for a powerful, protective father, for justice and fairness and for life to go on forever. God is simply a projection of these desires, feared and worshipped by human beings out of an abiding sense of helplessness. Religion belonged to the infancy of the human race; it had been a necessary stage in the transition from childhood to maturity. It had promoted ethical values which were essential to society. Now that humanity had come of age, however, it should be left behind. [A History of God] George Bernard Shaw, Irish-born English playwright (1856-1950). "The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one." Albert Einstein, German born American threoretical physicist (1879-1955). "It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it." [From a letter Einstein wrote in English, dated 24 March 1954. It is included in Albert Einstein: The Human Side, edited by Helen Dukas and Banesh Hoffman, published by Princeton University Press. "A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death." Virginia Woolf, English author (1882-1941). DH Lawrence, British writer (1885-1930). "God is only a great imaginative experience." "Brute force crushes many plants. Yet the plants rise again. The Pyramids will not last a moment compared with the daisy. And before Buddha or Jesus spoke the nightingale sang, and long after the words of Jesus and Buddha are gone into oblivion the nightingale still will sing. Because it is neither preaching nor commanding nor urging. It is just singing. And in the beginning was not a Word, but a chirrup." -Etruscan Places Sir Alfred Hitchcock, British film director (1899-1980). I have heard that in later life, Hitchcock become areligious. If you have any information on his beliefs, please let me know. Here is an anecdote that may illustrate his growing anti-religious sentiments. (Though at the time he was apparently still a church-going Catholic.) Driving through a Swiss city one day, Hitchcock suddenly pointed out of the car window and said, "That is the most frightening sight I have ever seen." His companion was surprised to see nothing more alarming that a priest in conversation with a little boy, his hand on the child's shoulder. "Run, little boy," cried Hitchcock, leaning out of the car. "Run for your life!" H. P. Lovecraft, American author (1890-1937). Here are extracts from Lovecraft; A Biography by L. Sprague De Camp: "H. P. Lovecraft was strongly influenced, not only by his mother but also by the books he read. . . . At five, he . . . (read) . . . a junior edition of The Arabian Nights. He at once fell in love with the glories of medieval Islam and spent hours playing Arab. . . . One effect of dabbling in non-Christian traditions was to make Lovecraft skeptical of the faith of his fathers. Before he reached his fifth birthday anniversary, young Lovecraft announced that he no longer believed in Santa Claus. Further private thought convinced him that arguments for the existence of God suffered the same weaknesses as those for Santa. "At five, Lovecraft was placed in the infant class of the Sunday school of the venerable First Baptist Meeting House on College Hill. The results were not what the elders expected. When the feeding of Christian martyrs to the lions came up, Lovecraft shocked the class by gleefully taking the side of the lions. He wrote: The absurdity of the myths I was called upon to accept and the sombre greyness of the whole faith compared with the Eastern magnificence of Mahometanism, made me definitely an agnostic; and caused me to become so pestiferous a questioner that I was permitted to discontinue attendance. . . . My grandfather had travelled observingly through Italy, and delighted me with long, first-hand accounts of its beauties and memorials of ancient grandeur. I mention this aesthetic tendency in detail only to lead up to its philosophical result - my last flickering of religious belief. ". . . His skeptical view of the supernatural - his nontheism - and his love of the Classical world were not the only lasting passions formed in his childhood. Ernest Hemingway, American author (1899-1961). "All thinking men are atheists." [A Farewell to Arms] On page 144 of Paul Johnson's book Intellectuals, it states that despite being raised in a strict Congregationalist houshold, Ernest "did not only not believe in God but regarded organized religion as a menace to human happiness", "seems to have been devoid of the religious spirit", and "ceased to practise religion at the earliest possible moment." Other's have pointed out to me that Hemingway used the non-existence of God as a theme in his books. Walter "Walt" Disney, American cartoonist, showman, and film producer (1901-1966). I had one report that Disney was non-religious. Apparently, he was not a member of any religion and did not attend services. Also, he apparently had an entirely secular funeral. It was "very private" and off-limits to the press, perhaps to conceal it was not religious. There is no "In God we Trust" on Disney Dollars! I have also heard, however, that Disney was a member of DeMolay, a young men's group in which members swear on a Bible that they believe in God. I guess Disney is in the DeMolay hall of fame. Maybe he got wiser when he grew up? This is obviously not much information. Can anyone confirm anything about what Disney believed? Nazim Hikmet Ran, Turkish poet (1902-1963). George Orwell (1903-1950). Joseph Campbell, American mythologist (1904-1987). Howard Hughes, American manufacturer, film producer, and recluse (1905-1976). Joseph Fletcher American ethicist (1905-1991 Katherine Hepburn, American actress (1907-2003). Richard Wright, American author (1908-1960). L. Ron Hubbard, American Author (1911-1986 Gene Kelly, American dancer, singer, actor, and director (1912-1996). Burt Lancaster, American actor (1913-1994). William M. Gaines, American publisher (1922-1992). Anton Szandor LaVey, American (1930-1997?). Here is some information about LaVey, provided by Aaron Jacques: LaVey Was most definitely an anti-christian, and despite his recommendation of "using" various gods, I am quite certain he was atheist. He formed the Church of Satan, not only to frighten the status quo, but more as an alternative to secularism. He wrote that it was necessary for man to have a fantasy element in his life. LaVey's satanism provides this in the form of rich ceremonies. The idea behind which is not that one is praying to an actual being but is unleashing mental/emotional/physical energies which have the power to alter the state of one's existence. Most satanists don't believe in satan or any other deity in a physical sense but more as a force of nature. In the introduction to The Satanic Bible, Burton H. Wolfe recalls a story told to him by LaVey about his youth, when he worked in a traveling carnival: "On Saturday night, I would see men lusting after half-naked girls dancing at the carnival, and on Sunday morning when I was playing organ for tent-show evangelists at the other end of the carnival lot, I would see these same men sitting in the pews with their wives and children, asking God to forgive them and purge them of carnal desires. And the next Saturday they'd be back at the carnival or some other place of indulgence. I knew then that the Christianchurch thrives on hypocrisy, and that man's carnal nature will out no matter how much it is purged or scoured by any white-light religion" Carl Sagan, American astronomer and author (1934-1996). John Lennon, British musician (1940-1980 Barry White, American singer (1944-2003 Frank Zappa, American musician (1940-1993 Michael Zaslow, American Actor (1944-1998). And the list goes on and on ........................................................................................................................... | ||
| franklin (franklin) Intermediate Member Username: franklin Post Number: 449 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 205.188.117.72 |
Yes, and I or any anyone else, including yourself, can post a list of hundreds of well known people alive or from history who are/were "literalist" Christians who have nothing but praise for God and Christianity. There is not a name from your list who was a surprise to me. Some renounced their statements later on in their lives. Many on your list were notorious for their immorality and self destructiveness. All in all, not a good list to be associated with, Jerry. There are many you obviously left off your list. Those who condemned Christianity but are too despised to give your list any credibility. Do you really want to be associated with Karl Marx? Marx, through his writings, created a system that murdered millions. I would match my list of good men and women of the Christian faith and walk against your list any day. These are people the world admire, not feel sorry for or condemn. "Burning lake of fire" could be a spiritual metaphor. Separation from God is the consequences of rejecting God's love for you. What you are experiencing now. What you choose to call children's fairy tales, I call human history. Only one God is the belief of Christians, jews and moslems. "Only one way to heaven." "I am the truth, the light and the way. No one comes to father except through me." Jesus Christ | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 156 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.147.65.148 |
The bible is in question with morality: It has become a pick and choose religion based of an overly translated series of novels. I don't agree with the bibles: 1) Treatment of women 2) theories on marriage 3) acceptance of slavey 4) cruelty to children 5) rules for living 6) the many contradictions 7) and general teachings If you'd like I have examples for all of these. The examples would make this post a mile long. Please, if you would, leave your emotion in your head, opinion and fact is welcome. PS - I wasn't stating I wanted to be associated with people like Carl Marx, I just thought they'd deserve your first place ribbon over myself. Enjoy the weather - What state are you in? location, not of mind. JWC | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 79 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 129.174.123.20 |
Ball of Fluff, The name "Satan" is pre-Christian, as it means, "The Adversary", and it shows up in Jewish texts that predate the Bible for hundreds, if not thousands of years. The role the Adversary played though, was the Accuser of Mankind and his role was to test faith, not be the source of all evil in the world, and was actually a loyal servant of God. I would make a guess that the idea of a monolithic evil character came from contact with the Zoroastrians when the Jews were liberated by the Persians from Babylon, and the concept of a divine war between good and evil, a monolithic good and evil character, a firey inferno for the wicked, etc. The Christians probably inherited these beliefs from a few Jewish beliefs on the subject, or texts. It is also possible that the early Christians found truth in such conepts, and included them with their beliefs. Jeffery, I think the attitude definately had something to do with my rejection of Christianity as my personal choice of religion. I also found the arguement that "you have to have faith", to be a poor answer to my questions concerning God, morality, the role of the Church, the status of the Bible, etc. So, where as Christianity may suit some, it doesn't suit me. As for Black Wood, I went to his site, and sent him a message, but haven't gotten a reply. He seems to believe that Modern Satanism is confined to only the LaVeyan sect, rather than as a branch with its own dissenters. He seemed to view Modern Satanism only through the eyes of LaVeyans, but may not have realized that there are other kinds of Modern Satanists, many whom come up with their own beliefs than may conflict with those of LaVey. As for my claim that most Satanists tend to have above average intelligence, I'm not saying that Satanists are all a bunch of smart guys, nor am I saying that being one makes you smart. To be a Satanist, a real one, it takes lots of reflection and critical thinking. And, many of the Satanists I've met are able to grasp concepts that are often above the level of their peers. This is because on average, we like to think about a topic, and come to our on conclusions about it. This just means that we tend to be smart because we place such a strong emphasis on finding things out for ourselves, and learning. Anyone who does this can advance their intellect, not just Satanists. And, I'll be the first to admit, I've met plenty of idiotic Satanists who really paint a bad picture for the rest of us. So, in conclusion, the only reason that Satanists tend to have above average intelligence is that we tend to love learning and finding things out for ourselves. This pursuit of knowledge is what cultivates our intellects. And anyone who pursues knowledge like that also gains similar benefits as well. | ||
| jeffrey_costa (jeffrey_costa) Intermediate Member Username: jeffrey_costa Post Number: 167 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 24.147.65.148 |
Thank-you advocate, I've no more questions - until after I read the satanic bible ...... Then I'm sure questions will arise - Thanks for your information. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 274 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Ok. I remember seeing something on History Channel about how the biblical role of Satan changed. That at first, God and he were almost like betting buddies (book of Job) and then the manner in which Satan was portrayed was changed. So when theistic Satanists are worshipping or getting in touch with Satan in any way, are they more interested in the earlier version of Satan as opposed to the entity who tempted Jesus? | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 193 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.97.205 |
Franklin...I think it is a tie, but really do not worry about the intelligence thing. With all the learning and the high brain work going on the satanists figured out that Satan does not exist so they are following him. At least that is what they are telling us, so are you really worried about them. They can not fool a Christian with that story but they will find plenty of others who need something to not believe in. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 278 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
I think that it may be more of a name thing. Let me put it this way. Did you read the Narnia series, Sharon? (Cool books) In the Last Battle, the young Calormen soldier who worshipped the evil god "Tash" (kind of a Satanic figure) went to paradise with Aslan the lion (The Christ figure) after the end of the world. He was surprised to be there and he, being an honorable man, told Aslan he didn't belong there, 'cuz he'd always worshipped Tash, though now he could see that Aslan was the one who should have been served. Aslan said that dishonorable service cannot be credited to Aslan and also that honorable service to Tash cannot be credited to Tash. So that people who live honorably, with love, etc, are really serving Aslan, not Tash, even if they say they are. I think the idea is that what one person may think of as Satan or "XYZ" or whatever, may not be. I could paint an inaccurate cruel picture of Jesus in my mind and label it such but it wouldn't be Jesus, would it? I'd really be painting a picture of someone else, no matter what I called it. If someone does not have evil intentions then they are not serving "Tash", or, in this case, the being called Satan who is shown in Christianity as being evil. It does seem odd to me, having been raised staunch Catholic, but I remember a doctrine in that religion: If someone is doing what they believe to be right and honorable and would have accepted the true God had they known Him, then that's "Baptism of Desire" which is probably what CS Lewis was talking about. He was, you know, church of England, which has many of the tenets of Catholicism. Not all Christian sects give credit to the "honorable pagan", but some do. If someone is constantly good and decent, then, as far as I can see, they are not serving the forces of evil. Just as if you had someone who was a real creep and he said he was a Christian, for example, but he wasn't, and did evil in the name of Christianity- he wouldn't be serving God, now would he be. Can it not work the other way around? Ok, my brain hurts. I'm going to turn off the computer now. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 279 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
I mean, it matters what the person's intentions are. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Intermediate Member Username: franklin Post Number: 471 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 205.188.117.72 |
The Holy Spirit can work through those who know God AND those who do not. God is an all powerful God. God is awesome! | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 280 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
True 'dat. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 81 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 70.179.98.130 |
Sharon, no matter how many times I say this, it never seems to get accross to you. Modern Satanists use the term, "Satan" as a symbol, it has symbolic meaning, it isn't a literal being to us. Traditional Satanists ventrate a Satan or Lucifer figure. Ball of Fluff, From what I've gathered, most Traditional Satanists tend to view a Satan or Lucifer being either a ancient being without a real relationship to the god of the Bible, a deity that is maligned by the Bible and is actually on humanity's side, or something of that nature, but it varies by sect. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Intermediate Member Username: franklin Post Number: 486 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.9 |
Then, as I said before, modern satanism is a farce! Name a belief in the world that is named after an entity that they don't believe ever existed. They don't use the names Jesus, Mohammed, Buddha etc. as someone they don't believe existed but just use the name as a symbol. You are an atheist. You have nothing to do with satanism. Honestly, you just use the term satanist to piss off the Christians you despise. I've read that in every explanation you've written. "Nyaah, Nyaah, Nyaah, Nyaah, Nyaah! We hate you Christians!" Rather immature! Just like the punk teenager who gets a ring put in their nose and a mohawk, just to conform with his friends in pissing off their parents. Your beliefs are not based on what you believe but on what you don't believe. You are your own god. That is intelligence? That is narcissism. Forgive me for not worshipping you.  (Message edited by Franklin on April 09, 2005) | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 82 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Franklin, Your statement just proved what I've suspected all along. You are here to harass the Satanists, pure and simple. And if you can't follow what I've been trying to tell you, then why bother to talk to me? You do this to yourself. You come to a Satanism Board, and then complain when you find a Satanist. You just aren't happy with the fact you found a Modern Satanist, rather than the archetype devil worshipper. Oh, I mean, it is so nice of you to mention worshipping me, though I never asked anyone to do such a thing. But the fact that you mentioned it is so nice. Lets me know that you really admire me enough to consider worshipping me, even though I never asked you or anyone else to. Honestly, I think you are angry because I love myself, and am not ashamed to say it. Never said I was overly modest, nor will I say that I'm invincible. It is called having self esteem. What are my beliefs based on? Dozens of things, if you haven't been keeping up. But you seem to act as if I don't have some Biblical for what I believe, then I am some how deluded or idiotic. Sad, really. You can't step outside of your frame of thinking just for one second, you keep your mind just narrow enough that you can shut out all outside or alien modes of thought, but open just enough to give of the facade that you are trying to understand. Ignorance is a terminal case which only challenging one's own current way of thinking can fix, but unless you decide to take the first step, you'll never understand what I do. You are still stuck on the name, and the imagery you associate with it. I can't change this. Only you can. But if that's what allows you to have comfort with your existence, then fine, it is not my place to try to rob that from you. As far as I'm concerned, you follow your own set of beliefs, much of which are centered on a character just as symbolic as Satan would be to me. Can't come to terms with the fact I don't bow down to your interpretation of god? That's your problem. If you understood the meaning behind the statement, "I am my own god", then you'd understand that it isn't a statement of hubris, but, from my atheistic view, a statement of fact. To me, there isn't some imaginary figure writing out my destiny, or undermining all of my actions for the sake of its "plan", nor is there any binding power of some book, a collection of religious stories and traditions of a faith I was never a member of in the first place. I am my own "god", because I am responsible for what happens in my life, all of my choices, failures, and successes. Not some divine, non-existent being who barks orders through clergy and dusty old tomes. If there are any consequences for my actions, I shoulder them. I don't run from them and blame them on infidels or having "weak faith". All of my actions are ultimately for me to deal with, and made concerning how they affect me, and those I care about. I don't need a man made being telling me how to treat my family or friends. I don't need some book telling me what I can and cannot do. If you need that, then be my guest to it. But don't be surprised when there are those like me who scoff at the notion that we need some imaginary being telling us how to run our lives, treat others, and how to wipe our asses. All in all, YOU are here to piss off Satanists Franklin. There is no other reason for you being here. You are trying to tell me what I believe. That is where you are out of line. I don't tell you how to be a Christian, nor do I make much of any attempt to tell people how to define Christianity. You, on the other hand, make the foolish assumption that you know everything about Satanism. Then attack anyone who has a different take on the matter. If I sound venomous, it is because YOU asked for it. With your last post, you asked me, pretty much, to tell you exactly what I think of you and your actions here. You are NOT on a Christian board. This is a Satanist board. And, I haven't gone to the Christian boards. I'm not here to piss off Christians. I don't give a hoot what they are doing, as long as they don't come here and do what YOU are doing. You are coming here to pick a fight, and tell people like me what we believe. You are in no position to do such. If anything, YOU are the punk teenager who got a nose ring and a Mohawk just to piss off his parents and conform with his friends. Only, this time, you assume that just because you're a Christian that I give a rat's ass. I don't. Does this come as a rude awakening to you? Does it come as a horrific surprise to you that some of my closest friends are Christians? Based on your actions here, I be it does, but only you know for sure. But its okay Franklin, not everyone can be as enlightened as you as to the personal beliefs of every man, woman, and child on the face of the planet as you, nor can we possibly compare to your vast wealth of knowledge of non-Christian beliefs, all your information coming from your impeccable deductive reasoning, such as picking at the name of the RELIGION OF SATANISM. That's all you ever work with, isn't it? Names. You nit pick constantly at names, mostly because you haven't anything else to work with. I mean, if you had actually researched Satanism beyond what your Bible and theologians tell you, maybe you could provide more insightful posts, instead of the same recycled "You're an atheist, not a Satanist! Get your terms right! Your usage of those terms doesn't match my definition of them, nor my out-dated dictionaries made before the emergence of Modern Satanism" spiels. But its okay, Franklin, don't cry. I know I probably came off rather rude, crude, and cynical, but think my post was obnoxious, so was yours. (Message edited by DevilsAdvocate666 on April 12, 2005) | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 283 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
It's like his comment about someone (you, maybe?) being an apologist for Satanists, Scientologists, Wiccans, etc. There's an implication of an intolerant and hating attitude there. It's very different from the attitude my Mom would have displayed which would have been "I don't believe in what he believes in." and she would have proceeded to treat you, me, and anyone else on this board with respect while still being honest and open about her feelings about the various topics under discussion. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 515 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.9 |
All I'm saying is that you are not a satanist. Not by any stretch of the word. You can not make up your own meaning of satanist. The world knows what a satanist is. You are not that. You are an atheist. That I can accept. I can also accept if you were a satanist, if that is the poison you choose. But for you to say you are a satanist/athesit is like if I were to say I am a Christian/atheist". An oxymoron in terms. The wikipeda definition has no relevance. That is an amateur's way to get free publishing. Anybody can submit their ideas there for free. So despite your insults to my intelligence I hold still to the fact that you are not who you say you are. A satanist I could converse with. An atheist with just an overt hate Christian bias will get just as much respect they give to Christianity. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 516 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.9 |
"There's an implication of an intolerant and hating attitude there." You are so right, ball. From every post of yours, da's and jerry's (who I said was the apologist), your posts are laced with intolerance and hatred for Christianity. None of you really believe in anything except you don't believe in Christ. Well so be it! Your belief is that anyone has a right to state their opinions except Christians. I classify the three of you as the ABC's. "A" nything "B" ut "C" hristianty. So shallow in your dogmatic anti-beliefs. I believe Ball that your mother is the good Christian woman you say she is. But I also believe she would be disappointed in your intolerance and the way you bushwhack Christians on the internet. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 84 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Like I said before Franklin, you haven't the slightest idea of what a MODERN SATANIST is. You don't choose to listen. Hateful to Christianity? You must obviously be inable to distinguish between ideology and religion. I despise ideologies that vilify us for being human and tell us to hate ourselves for being "imperfect". And, I despise trolls. You are a troll, clear and simple. You are upset because I won't bow to your form of Christianity, nor do I change my beliefs to match what you think they should be. There is also a difference between respecting Christianity as a valid faith, and respecting those who claim to represent it. I can respect the faith, but not the individuals, who, under the banner of that faith, decide to harass me for my lack of membership. I'm sure you can't honestly claim that you respect every Christian, and I'm sure you would not consider the White Identity Movement to have any validity as a Christian sect. I wouldn't. But here is what you are doing, -you come here, to a board for Satanists. -you attack anyone who has a different view point than you, including Satanists who post here, be they Traditional or Modern. -you don't even make the distinction between the branches of Modern and Traditional Satanism. -thus, you apply an out-dated definition of Traditional Satanism to Satanism as a whole, while at the same time, ignoring the fundamental differences between Modern and Traditional Satanism. -then, when you are called out on this, you claim that the other poster is anti-Christian, just because they challenge a claim YOU MADE. -you apply the concept that just because you are a Christian, you have the right to badger non-Christians, and not be held accountable for it. -you forget, you are on a Satanist board, and as such, you are not entitled to special immunities from challenges just becuase of your faith, no one is. -no matter how many times I try to reason with you, it always goes back to your ignorance of what the Satanist religion/philosophy is TODAY. Your definition only applies to TRADITIONAL SATANISTS, not MODERN SATANISTS. There is a big difference between the two branches, whether you like it or not. And you claim that we are anti-Christian, yet you are anti-all other beliefs except Christianity. You are anti-Satanist! So what are YOU doing here? You expect to be treated with respect, yet you call my beliefs a sham?! I don't owe you respect. You haven't given it. How do you expect people to respect your beliefs when you call their's a lie and a sham? You are demanding special treatment. I don't give such to you, nor most anyone I know. You are a troll, and I'll treat you like one. Don't like this? Then stop demanding special rights and special treatment, stop attacking everyone who disagrees with you, and actually listen to what they have to say before you bother to type a response. You can't demand respect if you don't give any first or in turn. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 285 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
I've posted absolutely nothing that indicates any hatred of Christianity. There is no post like that anywhere. I didn't write such things and I didn't feel such things. So, no- you are lying. The intolerance shown here isn't mine. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 286 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
My Mother's dead, thank you very much. And no, I've never posted my beliefs. You don't know what they are. So you cannot assess them. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 85 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Franklin, You talk so much about how I trash Christianity and that I'm anti-Christian. Okay, prove it. Where have I directly attacked Christianity, the faith? No, this doesn't mean you, the Christian, as you have given me more than enough reason to go after you. I'm talking about the faith, the religion itself, for example, where have I once said that it was evil, or, to use your own words, a "farse"? | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 527 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
Sorry to hear about your mother. But yes, you have. You are a scientologist (small "s"). | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 528 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
da, read your posts. If you don't see your attacks on Christianity, then I will highlight them for you tomorrow. Goodnight. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 288 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
Franklin, you don't know my beliefs. I am not a member of the church of Scientology or of anyreligious or cultic organization ( I don't think my mortgage women's assn counts here). So, no. My Mom knew I respected the beliefs of others and the beliefs with which I was raised. My Minister cousin does, as well. Both great ladies- one still with us and the other, alas, not. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 86 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Franklin, There are criticisms of YOU, not Christianity. You still fail to realize this. You pick the fight, and then get on the defensive, claiming I'm going after Christians. Gee, you think I'd treat you any differently if you were a Satanist? Nope, I treat all trolls the same, regardless of their religion. You are not a representative of Christianity, or if you think you are, you are doing a poor job of making a favorable impression. You are doing nothing but picking fights with non-Christians. And don't get me started on your level of hypocrisy. You claim I'm anti-Christian, yet you insult and attack my beliefs constantly. What do you expect? I can easily point of instances in which you attack Satanism, claim it’s a sham, and yet you would go berserk if someone where to say the same about Christianity. Does this get through to you? Do you not see this? How can you be justified in attacking Satanism, without proof of your claims, and then get pissed off when someone has the resolve to challenge you? You claim my beliefs are a sham, yet if I where to do the same thing, say the same about Christianity, then you'd claim I'm anti-Christian, and act as if you hadn't brought this on yourself. You act justified in declaring other people's beliefs a sham, and then act as if you are terribly wronged when you are challenged or someone disagrees with you. It’s that mentality of entitlement, the demanding of immunity from criticism just because you are of a given religion. I challenge out to prove my beliefs are a sham. Or is that just your personal opinion there. Objectively prove it. Back any of what you have claimed about Modern Satanism. Can you? Probably not. If I were to say even half of what you said about Satanism, but apply it to Christianity, then you'd be justified in your comment about me. But I haven't. You, on the other hand, already came here out to attack Satanism, without proof or reason. Don't like Satanism? Then why are you still here? If you don't like it, then leave. Go start a Christian board or something. You'll be able to espouse all the anti-Satanist rhetoric you'd like then, without challenge. Otherwise, grow up. You are a troll. You've been one since day one, even when you posted as anonymous, just to avoid criticism. It doesn't matter if you are a Christian or not, your behavior is that of a child out to pick a fight with those who don't believe like him. You are no better than the "punk teenager with a nose ring and a Mohawk" character. You're afraid of differences. It’s obvious. You are afraid because all you do is pick a fight, and label all those who oppose your view point as anti-Christian. Where as you might need to fight with others to strengthen your beliefs, I don't. I'm comfortable with what I believe. I don't need to go out and badger people about their faith, and try to force my beliefs in their face. But if you want criticism of Christianity, you could go to these sites: www.evilbible.com www.jesusneverexisted.com Those are places that fit your bill of anti-Christian. It is people like you Franklin, regardless of their religious or philosophical beliefs, that are their belief systems' greatest enemies. You are self-righteous beyond the pint of reason, and have the "you are either with me or against me" mentality. I have to say, you’d probably help turn off more people to your religion with your attitude than the previous sites could. Go ahead, visit those sites. You want to see anti-Christian, then visit them. Then you’ll understand what anti-Christian is. | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 194 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.93.47 |
Da, so you only use Satan as a symbol. What is he a symbol of? I ask again. Franklin... here is exactly what is meant by Da. Dictionary:Devils+Advocate One who argues against a cause or position, not as a committed opponent but simply for the sake of argument or to determine the validity of the cause or position. This person is chosen by the Catholic Church. If you go to the Christian hating sites he advised you will find jeffrey_costa, funny eh? A satanist selling out his own. But I am with you on the if you do not believe in satan or Christ you are atheist. I like when he dissed you for being either for or against, that was very humorous, bet you got a chuckle over that. They really do not know Jesus here. You think if they were so against something they would know what that was. They make such childish claims, like you would go berserk if someone said Christianity did not exist. That was a chuckle, you must laugh here all the time. How do you keep a straight face. I have never met you but I am pretty sure you are not a troll. Are you rejoicing at the name calling as your Father told you? It is nice that they can give you such laughter and Joy. I would be envious if it was not a sin. Da seems to be losing his calm exterior, and has resorted to his nature, scratch a satanist and find an angry atheist. I thank God for men like you, and remember laughter is the best medicine. | ||
| mingodrake (mingodrake) New member Username: mingodrake Post Number: 2 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
To me from what I know of modern satanism it is basicly a form of hedonism . Am I correct on this? I think most christians see the " comic book" satanists that teenage kids sometimes become to rebel. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 89 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Sharon, I've repeatedly told you what Satan to me, as a Modern Satanist represents. I've done so numerous times, in earlier threads. You just don't listen nor take into account anything I write. So, its pointless to constantly tell you, as every time, your response tends to be the same, "You believe in a lie. Don't you know you worship evil? You can't be a Satanist becuase you are an atheist", etc. Always something along those lines. You ignore every explaination I write every single time. Those sites I posted were just to give Franklin an example of what is truely anti-Christian. He just tends to throw around that label so often, it seems to have lost all meaning other than a term used to demonize people who don't agree with him. But from here on out, it seems pointless to bother to chat with you or Franklin, as all you wish to do is play piss of the Satanist. Minigodrake, You could argue the claim that Modern Satanism is a form of hedonism, but, in the view that hedonism is the pure pursuit of personal satisfaction over everything else, I'd have to argue that Modern Satanism is more than just that. Yes, we do try to live our lives in a way that allows us to secure our enjoiment of it. Why? We usually don't believe in an afterlife. Might as well enjoy life while you're alive as much as possible rather than waiting for a possibly non-existant afterlife. The creedo we have is do what you wish, as long as no one innocent gets hurt, this means, if you are mad, go ahead and thrash a punching bag, or if someone is trying to harm you physically, then hammer them. But, this doesn't give you liscense to go around attacking random people just for fun. Also, when most people think of hedonism, they think of a lack of responsiblity. Our view point is, if you start a fight with some random thug, and he pounds the snot out of you, then you have only yourself to blame. So, no one is saying you can't pick the fight, and you might find that to be a cheap thrill, but since you started it, you can't come back, crying to mommy if things go against you. So, if anything, Modern Satanism is a more restrained, thought out form of hedonism. It seems that we will forever be portraied by the media as a bunch of gothic rebels, conforming to every malign stereotype in the book, and a bunch of anti-Christian punks. Its sad. We are constantly represented like that, even though the people making and promoting such images and stereotypes aren't Satanists, and probably never have met a single one. But what can I say, Western society is heavily influenced by Protestant Christianity, and we all know what the name "Satan" immediately brings up in the minds of most Westerners...the monolithic source of all evil. Ironic that the concept of Satan never started out that way. In Judaism, Satan isn't a literal being, but a metaphor, as the Adversary/Accuser of Man and Angels. It served as the tester of faith. Evil, for the most part, in Judaism, is a result of humanity's actions. Not some quasi-deity lurking in Sheol/Hell. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 293 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Sharon, Franklin acts exactly like a troll. He's accused me of being anti Christian when I've not written one single solitary thing that was anti Christian and, in fact, have written sentiments to the contrary. He's whined about Ss$cientology (small s, capital S, dollar sign- I really couldn't care less) when I'm an EX church member and am not in any group.He's accused DA of writing anti Christian sentiments. He basically stirs up crap. You can tell by all the false statements and generalities he makes. | ||
| anone (anone) Member Username: anone Post Number: 84 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 62.30.187.76 |
Ball of Fluff/Claire Swazey: "I am not a member of the church of Scientology." Did Franklin say you were? He said you were a scientologist, little "S". Once again, a nice attempt at yet another deflection. In future folks, just ask her if she's a scientologist, period? She claims to belong to the Freezone section of Scientology, which she bizarrely calls "indie scientology". Ball of Fluff: "I have no problem admitting I'm an Indie Scientologist", Factnet, November 04, 2004. These are people who generally claim to still follow L. Ron Hubbard, the founder of Scientology, but disagree to varying extents, with the current Church of Scientology leadership. She claims she pays for scientology auditing, services and procedures outside the official Church of Scientology. But then again, as she has said previously, as recently as Jan 2005, "I am a Scientologist. Scientologists like Scientology". Read the thread above. She claims my posts speak for themselves, but I claim her deflections, obfuscation’s, avoidance and general dishonesty truly speak volumes, not just about her, but the particular brand of Scientology she claims to follow. As most of you "truth seekers" have no doubt figured, you are dealing with a highly slippery one here. Thankfully, her intelligence level is well below her pretensions or her imagined abilities, so all in all, she's pretty transparent. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 531 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.9 |
"Franklin.... basically stirs up crap." I stir up the crap of satanism and scientology. And, my Lord, what a stink that comes from these two cesspools of human narcissism and deception! P. U.! Ball is so slippery because of all the crap she swims in and spews. I know a Scientolgist. Big "S". She admits it is a cult. She makes very good money and has filed bankruptcy numerous times so she can feed the demons in Clearwater. Everytime the cult audits you they have more to blackmail you with. Satanism, modern or traditionial is just self destructiveness. Neither religion can submit to the one true God. For in order to do that they have to admit they are not gods themselves. Their ego driven narcissism won't allow that. It is these cesspools of crap that I am accused of stirring up. Why do I do that? Why do I allow myself to be abused by those who hate God and His Son Jesus who died for them? Because I love people. I do not want to see others suffer like da and ball. It might be too late to save those two. But because of my love for God's creation I will continue to warn anyone who will listen. So if you want me to stop stirring up crap, stop spewing it! | ||
| mingodrake (mingodrake) New member Username: mingodrake Post Number: 5 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
Franklin what do you think of wicca? buddhism? asatru? do you feel Ghandi is in heaven or hell? I am just wanting to see if your mindset is that every religion not Christian is an evil cult. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 533 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.9 |
I know wiccans. They are searching like many others. They are lied to about the origins of their new age belief. As to whether they fit my definition of a cult, the jury is still out. Buddhists are by definition a peaceful people with benevolent precepts. Asatru, dont know of. I would like to believe that Ghandi is in heaven. He knew of Christ and had many Christian qualities. No, I don't believe that "every religion not Christian is an evil cult." Do I believe that scientology is.... YES!!!!!!! I'm still studying this satanist fad. Now that I have answered your questions, what are your beliefs? | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 294 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
I already explained this to you, Anone. You and Franklin do NOT know my beliefs, and you never will. I know Lutherans who do not have all the same beliefs as other Lutherans. I have a relative who's into some real odd stuff, and calls herself a Catholic, and she has absolutely nothing in common with my Mom's beliefs, or those of Sister Mary Harmona who was my first grade teacher. So call me a Scn'ist all you like- it proves nothing. I personally have written many times that CofS is a cult- written that on several different forums. Some or all FZ groups may be cults, too. Don't care. I'm not a member of anything other than my mortgage assn. Of course I'm not gonna discuss my beliefs with an asshole like you, for fuck's sake. Why should I? What would possibly be in it for me, as hostile and silly as you are? Nope. You're a troll and Franklin prolly is, too. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 90 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Franklin, Just for future reference, Asastru is the name of the old Norse religion centering around deities like Thor and Odin. You are entitled to your opinions and beliefs about Satanism, BUT, the double standard that you hold is very hypocritical. Based on your posts, you believe that being a Christian gives you the right to bash other beliefs that refuse to bow to your concept of god, yet, be immune to all form of critique just because you are a Christian. That is extremely hypocritical. Despite how much I personally disagree with Christianity, I don't take it upon myself to go places frequented by Christians and harass them and badger them about their beliefs. I guess it must be me, but didn't your Jesus tell you to treat others how you wish to be treated? I can understand the missionary impulse that you might have, BUT, to harass people of different beliefs just because you can, and you disagree with their religion is not just immature, but to me, it comes off as a sign of weak faith. If you are so convinced that your way is right, then why do you need to harass those who follow a different path, especially if they are not interested in converting? As for Satanism being a fad, Modern Satanism first became prominent in the early 70s, with the Church of Satan. Traditional Satanism goes back to even before the existence of Europe as a nation. So, if it’s a fad, then how could it have been around for so long? Especially in its Traditionalist form? You claim that I am spewing crap. You base this on the fact that I find the idea to bow to YOUR idea of god to be alien, and pointless. If this is the kind of stuff you base your judgments on, then I can only say that I pity you. You cast so many judgments based on your own personal prejudices, but, rather than admitting this, you accuse everyone who disagrees with you of being anti-Christian. You want to stop spewing crap yourself? YOU are the intruder here, on this board. Again, in case you have not figured this out by now, this is a SATANIST board. This is not a place you are going to find a bastion of Christian thought. You are going to find views from a Satanic view point. So, based on the standards of this board, being a place for Satanists, the Satanist view point is quite appropriate. Your attacks and groundless accusations are not. And, you said you would highlight all my anti-Christian statements today. But you did not. So, can you be so kind as to elaborate on what you mean exactly by anti-Christian? Do you mean someone who stands against all Christians as a whole, a person who makes blanket statements about Christians and hates them all, or just anyone who disagrees with you? Based on every instance you have used this term on someone, it always seemed to be due to them calling you out on your behavior here, or because they disagree with something you said. You see, it is your constant assaults and groundless accusations that are bugging me. Are you here to try to enlighten someone? Odds are, you have done nothing but driven people from your views. You don't like the Satanic views here? Then leave. Go to a Christian board and have a party over there. Your proselytizing is inappropriate here, and would be better spent on people actually interested in converting to Christianity. Also, you have YET to prove anything you say. How is Satanism self destructive? Is it because it differs from YOUR religious view point. Wake up. This is the real world. Not every religion is centered around YOUR concept of god. That does not make them self destructive. Going by that logic, Theravada Buddhism would be self destructive, especially the Zen sect, as Theravada Buddhism is rather atheistic in its views, as it does not focus on deities of any sort. But they are still Buddhists. They still believe in the Four Noble Truths and follow the Eight Fold Path. So, now is Theravada Buddhism self destructive because it does not focus on your concept of god? Objectively prove that Satanism, due to its lack of veneration of YOUR concept of god is self destructive. | ||
| anone (anone) Member Username: anone Post Number: 85 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 62.30.182.199 |
Ball of Fluff: "You and Franklin do NOT know my beliefs, and you never will." Factnet, April 16, 2005 Ball of Fluff: "I consider auditing, most wordclearing worthwhile and helpful. I also like most although not all of the ethics stuff, a lot of the "admin" stuff, I like the scales- tone scale, chart of human evaluation, the ARC triangle, KRC triangle, his ideas on spirituality and on the overt motivator sequence and so on. Sprinkled within those topic, sometimes, are things with which I disagree, but the majority of these things are things that I do subscribe to. [insert: As you would expect from someone who states; "I am a Scientologist. Scientologists like Scientology", she subscribes to the majority of it.] Anyway, I've found that auditing helps a person confront his personal problems and unresolved issues. And I appreciate that. My husband had an interesting experience. He was reading "Morals and Dogma" which is, I believe, a 35th degree Masonic text. He said there were concepts in there that, hitherto, he'd only seen in Scn. This conversation was several years ago but as I recall it was pretty esoteric stuff. What I'm getting at is I like the esoteric stuff in Scn and Hubbard's concept of the way the spiritual universe works. It appears to me that when I use the concepts in my life, that they work." Factnet, March 10, 2004 Ball of Fluff: "Some or all FZ groups may be cults, too. Don't care. I'm not a member of anything other than my mortgage assn." Factnet, April 16, 2005 Ball of Fluff: "I did not say I was an "expert" in general. I said I was one regarding the FZ compared to someone who wasn't in it, never had been in it." OCMB, April 07, 2005 Ball of Fluff: "I did write some posts outing myself as a newbie FZ'er. For some reason, I don't like that term all that much. I usually call myself an Indie Scn'ist, which is my own term for it." OCMB, April 07, 2005 Ball of Fluff: "you didn't know I did FZ stuff." OCMB, April 17, 2005. Ball of Fluff: "I go to FZ practitioners." Factnet, March 11, 2004 | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 296 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Those are very old posts. The 04/05 posts, the most recent, are phrased in the past tense, depicting old events The comment "some or all FZ groups may be cults too...etc" does not indicate any affiliation or beliefs. It discusses whether or not a group may be a cult. I do not discuss my beliefs anymore, and I do not discuss the changes thereof- and I assure you, there have been. Not that it's any of your business, cyberstalker. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 297 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
It's amusing to see Anone squirm. I've written many posts lately describing various indie and FZ Scn'ists, in specific and in toto, in a negative light. He doesn't quote them. That is because he is a cyberstalking dork. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 534 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 205.188.117.72 |
"I do not discuss my beliefs anymore" Then you have no right to criticize anyone else's opinions or posting style. You are the troll and the cyberstalker. IF you can not discuss your beliefs like 99% of all factnet posters (including da) then why are you here? To bushwhack those who do? Totally unfair! What do you bring to the table? What do you have to offer to a discussion? Your haughtiness? Your holier than thou attitude? That dog won't hunt. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 300 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Yes, Franklin, I do have every right. This is a topic about Satanism. I have identified myself as a non Satanist. That's all you need to know. So ad hominem commentary quoting stuff posted months or years ago on other forums is irrelevant. There now. I've cleared that up. Either discuss Satanism with me (in other words, stay on topic) or go fuck yourself. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 538 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
You're not here to discuss satanism . You are here to promote scientology. If you deny it, you're lying. One method of promoting scientology is to defend any belief except Christianity. Tear Christianity down so you'll have more willing dupes to get sucked into your cult. The demons in Clearwater need more worker bees to feed their lavish lifestyles. You are here as their apostle. You use your powers of persuasion to try and pull away those who are searching and weak in faith. You would like to convert da. Your motives are transparent. I'm honest about mine. I'm here to help bring people towards Christ. You are here to do the opposite. To deny that is to deny that you have basic human motivations. You don't want to be identified as a scientologist because most people know it as a destructive mind controlling cult. Why do you proselytize to the Christians? Because we are the most numerous. Such a mouth you've got! | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 91 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Franklin, I still have to ask, why exactly are you here to preach Christianity, if this is a Satanism board? It is utterly off topic, and rather offensive when you come here to attack the beliefs of people who are ideally posting here, i.e., Satanists. Wouldn't it be more effective to preach to those who wish to learn about Christianity, instead of intruding on message boards frequented by non-Christians? Call me crazy, but in my own humble opinion, given the wide spread popularity of Christianity, hardly anyone who posts here has not heard of it, and, given its status as probably the most prominent religion in the Western Hemisphere, that anyone curious about Christianity would know where to look, such as Churches, the Bible, etc? So, what' is the point of preaching to people who don't want to be preached at? Isn't it perfectly plausible that plenty of the non-Christian posters here have heard of Christianity, and disagree with it, and choose not to follow it because of such, and preaching at them won't help change their minds much, but rather, turn them off even more to it? Oh, and where were the anti-Christian remarks you were promising me? You still haven't given me a definition of anti-Christian, at least in the frame of reference you are using it. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 301 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
I don't promote Scn. I never have. I have always disliked proselytizing. So, nope. No posts where I tell people they should try this or that. I just don't do that. I don't believe in it. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 302 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.17.18.246 |
Yeah, DA,I know what you mean. But you'll never get the answers. He makes accusations of things being said or thought but cannot produce the posts to prove it. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 92 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Well Franklin, if you can make the claims, then by all means, why not oblige us by showing proof? Or have you been demonizing everyone who disagrees with you by labelling them anti-Christian? If so, you really should stop. And, why aren't you able to produce proof if your claim that my posts drip with anti-Christian sentiment are correct? Looks like you've been slandering...what does your Bible say about bearing false witness? Ooopppsss...looks like you just did... Ball, I didn't expect Franklin to back what he claims. He already admitted that he is here to "enlighten" people about Jesus...so, he's not here for any form of discussion, rather, just to preach at people...and lets not forget, we infidels haven't heard of Christianity before, regardless of the fact we both came from Christian families, and we live in America where a majority of the population claims to be Christian, or that I used to be a Christian...oh, I couldn't have possibly heard of Christianity, even though I spent my entire life around it... | ||
| mingodrake (mingodrake) New member Username: mingodrake Post Number: 6 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 152.163.100.9 |
Franklin, Sorry it took me a while to reply to your question I have been a bit busy. I am still trying to find my " religion" and I think it will still take a while. I am not a satanist , am not what anyone I know would think of as a Christian , know nothing about L ron hubbards teachings . I feel buddhists ACT in a way more fitting of Christians than most Christians do. I went to a baptist school in rural Alabama and went to church till I was 16 or so. I played in a band and had grown my hair long...a comment about " men with long hair burning in hell" sent me away from the Church for years. 2 years ago I tryed going back to another church . My wife and I were haveing hard times with money and my mother-in law decided to pressure my wife into going to the alter when she did not feel the call....to the point of grabing her from a pew and trying to walk her up when she did not want to go. I think a lot of people still confuse God with santa. I feel that everything happens because of a greater plan and hard times are to teach us something we need to know. That was the last time we set foot in a Christian church. I know a lot of people are going to say..." my church is not like that" or " she needed to go to Jesus" or something but that sort of thing is why a LOT of people turn away from religion. It's all over this board. I see any religion that spends more time trying to convert followers then acting with love to others as " not the place for me". To me Christ was the son of God and taught the correct way to live and act. I could also see God sending teachers to other cultures and places on the earth. Gods a pretty large concept and I'm not going to pretend I could put him in a little box and say " He does this" or "Would not do that". For those who find the Church a way to commune with God great!.....I myself find him alone in a sunset miles in the woods. I dont think he is limited to the Jewish war God. I think native Americans had a concept of God..many other cultures had what seems a more personal relationship with God...perhaps not by the same name but the same great spirit. I respect everyones chosen path and only ask them to respect mine( when I find it). So to answer your question : I'll tell you when I find it Thank you for your reply btw its not what I was expecting. Mingo | ||
| sharon (sharon) Intermediate Member Username: sharon Post Number: 202 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 142.177.6.73 |
devilsadvocate666...You put up a satanist board in a place for recovering victims of cults and cry because you must defend yourself against them. That is really quite sad, Franklin was here long before you came here and put up a satanist board. Maybe you should ask yourself why you would do such a thing. He is trying to comfort those who have been hurt by cults as this is a cult board on which you placed you satanist board. Stop whining , you give satanist a bad name. Just a hint, Franklin often speaks tongue in cheek and you are not getting it, which is funny for us but again makes you look like you have no sense of humor. Try to lighten up . Where is that huge brain power you speak of, you know where satanist are all smarter than the rest of us. You are letting Franklin make you look silly , not a good look for a satanist. Here is another hint, look up devils advocate, see what it means. Does not really suit you does it, more of that brain power at work? Sorry but if you are going to call yourself a satanist you had better not make satan look bad because he has no sense of humor. Just don’t want you to get in trouble with old nasty boot. Keep the Faith Oh and by the way when you say nasty things about us we rejoice as our Father told us to do, you have given us much pleasure. Sorry, hope that does not get you in more trouble. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 93 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 68.227.221.19 |
Sharon, first things first, I did not put this board up. Secondly, if I did, I'd make sure that it isn't over run by people out to "enlighten the infidels". That practice is immature and annoying. And, I'm still waiting on Franklin to supply me the anti-Christian remarks he claims I've made. I'm sure you'd like proof if someone accused you of being something you're not. | ||
| ball_of_fluff (ball_of_fluff) Intermediate Member Username: ball_of_fluff Post Number: 303 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.107.60.82 |
Sharon, Franklin lies a lot. He said things about me that just flat-out aren't true. I don't call that tongue in cheek. | ||
| franklin (franklin) Advanced Member Username: franklin Post Number: 541 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.73.104.62 |
da, have you reread your prior posts, like I asked you to? The proof is there. I have been constrained by time to do so. But since you are in denial, the proof is coming soon. If you are really curious, step outside your atheist ego and reread your posts. Talk to you soon. | ||
| jason_stone (jason_stone) Member Username: jason_stone Post Number: 70 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 65.78.218.6 |
Hello da. I have personally seen three devils. Or devil possessed people. Of whom Jesus used me to cast out two. It was quite nasty as the people threw up the devil in a white slime type of substanse. Which I promptly burned. As far as proof goes. Jesus said in Mark 16:16-18 that there would be five signs that would follow the believers. John 3:16 says if we believe on Jesus we would be saved. Then in Mark he said believers would speak in tongues, cast out devils, heal the sick ,take up serpents, and drink deadly things without harm all in his name. And, I am proof that those things he said are real. Becuase, I practice them all. You can believe what you want. I have no problem with that. I don't try to disprove it or discredit it. But, I have proof my God is real and alive. So no one can disprove that. My God promises me peace and Joy for eternity. He promises me that he will comfort me in my times of need. He promises me that when all is said and done. He is the true God. And, you could find this out if you really sought him. He would forgive you of your sins. Wash them from you and never remember them again. And, once you are baptized with the Holy Ghost. You will realize that his Spirit is more powerful than any other. And, all others have to subject to it. His Spirit will give you joy world can't give. He will love you in a way than natural thing could ever love you. So why don't you give it a chance. God Bless in Jesus name. | ||
| devilsadvocate666 (devilsadvocate666) Member Username: devilsadvocate666 Post Number: 94 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: |
