| Author | Message | ||
     chris_fears New member Username: chris_fears Post Number: 5 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 96.230.206.254 |
First of all a sincere, loving greeting to all of those who we have called our friends over the years. We have missed many who left before us and longed for that fellowship. We look forward to catching up with many of you! Anyway here it is: We decided to leave mid-Sept 07 and moved back to So. IL on Nov 1. We attempted to leave quietly, graciously, and as painlessly for the church members (and ourselves) as we could. That was not to be. Maybe it was because we were helpers, maybe it was the pastor there. I may go into details later, but suffice to say; it was painful. I do not know what the church members were told, but I was most certainly forbidden to give them our side of the story. But I respected this because I am not their pastor. Anyway, we are active in a wonderful church here and have already gotten more opportunity to labor for God here in two months than what we had in ten years at ntcc. This church was UPC years ago and actually removed themselves as a congregation from that org. The Pastor totally relates to what we went through because he was there himself. What won us? The same kind of love and care that we felt so many years ago there in Fairbanks! Even with 500 people the Pastor made a point to find us every service to say hi and ask about us. How comforting to know that, YES God can still lead and guide you to where He wants. Yes, you can still be effective for God and fulfill the calling He has on your life. And No, just because God calls you while you are in one org, does not mean you have to stay there. I guess as I have gotten older and more comfortable in my skin, The question I ask myself is "What is the worst anyone can do to me?...." Can they kill me? What are they going to do; kick me out? When I started answering myself "I dont' really care what they think." that is when the fear left my life. Right is right. The Bible is Right. God is right no matter where or who you are. I am not bitter, nor is my wife. But we have been hurt We still love and respect those who showed their love for us at ntcc. I know that God has saved people out of sin there. Me included. So I tread carefully. Why post now? While we were "in" I never looked at Factnet or talked to anyone who left. I even waited a bit after we left. But we have friends still in who made a decision to maintain contact. Funny how the floodgates do open once you leave! Come to find out there are many of a like mind who haven't left. Physically. Once you find out that NORMAL, REAL people like Steve,Kurt,and Doug; people you have known, leave; it is a bit more satisfying and encouraging. ( not that the rest of you are wierdos or anything) I know that there are many who are still "in" who check factnet out from time to time. Only they know why. I want to encourage those who need it. I also need the encouragement! Leaving ntcc has been the hardest thing I have had to do to date. Yes, it sucks. You lose friends. I spent every last dime I didn't have just to move. But I do not care. How many people get a chance to start their lives completely over? No regrets baby. Drop me a line, don't forward me junk, www.cwfears@hotmail.com | ||
| chief New member Username: chief Post Number: 11 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 75.104.192.39 |
"I know that God has saved people out of sin there. Me included. So I tread carefully". I can appreciate and totally see your point. What I am about to say is not to argue with you or contradict you in any shape form or fashion. I have seen so many people born again in the NTCC. There is little doubt in my mind that God has used the NTCC to bring many to Christ. The problem is that the NTCC is extremely poor at keeping born again converts. For some reason the most faithful ones are often abused the worst. Absolutely horrible leadership. Some associate Ministers leave one church to move and help at another church not realizing that the problems that existed in the church they left exist throughout the NTCC origination with very few exemptions I believe. I had to go through many different Pastors and different churches within the NTCC before I was able to see this clearly as a FACT that is widespread in its existence. Brother, I don’t believe there is much need to be very apologetic. Some of the Pastors that I have had the opportunity to know in the NTCC have been some of the most non loving people that I think I have ever met in my entire life. I mean folks that totally lack simple and basic consideration for their fellow man. I am just talking about the lack of good decency. Many of these guys have no business continuing to attempt to try and serve as Pastors. I know for a fact that abuses have been brought to the leadership’s attention in Washington. I personally have made mention of abuses to more than one overseer in the NTCC. Allegations that were verifiable and tangible and I've yet to see one Pastor removed for outright verbal and psychological abuse. Just plain nastiness which is an utter abuse of authority. | ||
| tracypelfrey Member Username: tracypelfrey Post Number: 79 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 69.208.5.30 |
As Davis says: "The devil can preach salvation and folks will get saved"}}} | ||
| chief New member Username: chief Post Number: 13 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 75.104.192.38 |
I must say that was quite a good response Tracy. Quite appropriate. Chief | ||
| victorjohanson Member Username: victorjohanson Post Number: 68 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 66.230.101.251 |
"Some of the Pastors that I have had the opportunity to know in the NTCC have been some of the most non loving people that I think I have ever met in my entire life. I mean folks that totally lack simple and basic consideration for their fellow man. I am just talking about the lack of good decency. Many of these guys have no business continuing to attempt to try and serve as Pastors. I know for a fact that abuses have been brought to the leadership’s attention in Washington. I personally have made mention of abuses to more than one overseer in the NTCC. Allegations that were verifiable and tangible and I've yet to see one Pastor removed for outright verbal and psychological abuse. Just plain nastiness which is an utter abuse of authority." Chief, the saddest thing of all is that not only aren't they removed, but that such men as you describe are precisely the ones who are elevated and presented by RWD as models to be emulated. These 'go getter' types are willing to ride roughshod over anyone and "make it happen" to reach their goal of personal power over others, and they find no shortage of sincere believers to victimize. Getting big numbers and pumping fodder into the "seminary" in Graham is the coin of the NTCC realm, so the most skillful manipulators win and gain stature within this sick organization. They have it all backward. It's the meek who will inherit the earth. | ||
| chief New member Username: chief Post Number: 14 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 75.104.192.37 |
"Chief, the saddest thing of all" Vick, that simple portion of your response says it all. I do see this whole NTCC situation as a sad situation; the word sad being used literally. I genuinely feel bad for so many good people that are still in the NTCC and for so many friends that have left the NTCC due to the abuses that have existed and continue to exist within the ranks. | ||
| tracypelfrey Member Username: tracypelfrey Post Number: 82 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 69.208.5.30 |
Hence...the reason many of us post to this forum so regularly Chief. | ||
| weezer Junior Member Username: weezer Post Number: 40 Registered: 8-2007 Posted From: 70.0.215.183 |
that's how people behave in business. this type of behavior shouldn't be in a christian church. so now we know that you don't run a church like a business which is what davis has instituted. if anyone wants to post but wants to stay anonymous, you can use www.ninjaproxy.com | ||
| victorjohanson Member Username: victorjohanson Post Number: 71 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 66.230.101.251 |
"I do see this whole NTCC situation as a sad situation; the word sad being used literally." Another sad aspect of the whole situation is that NTCC is in a position to be a tremendous blessing, but instead they exploit those they should be helping. What an opportunity to do good that is being wasted! Those becoming involved with this organization are generally sincere and dedicated people; if the leadership would just be an encouragement instead of the bloodsucking parasites they are, positive results would ensue. Apparently that's not as important to some as living in splendor and having personal vassals and undeserved prestige. | ||
| chris_fears New member Username: chris_fears Post Number: 8 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 96.230.201.75 |
"I personally have made mention of abuses to more than one overseer in the NTCC. Allegations that were verifiable and tangible and I've yet to see one Pastor removed for outright verbal and psychological abuse. Just plain nastiness which is an utter abuse of authority." Yep me too. My wife wrote a letter to R.W.D. Now believe it or not, he was all over it. We had made sure that over the years he knew us. He knew it was legit. He called this local pastor on these issues. Things were better for a while. Then I started to hear things over the pulpit that indicated the man thought he was misrepresented by us. Really my wife, who wrote the letter. The things we put up with bothered her a lot more. Probably because she doesn't just ignore it when stepped on like I have tended to do. So this pastor took the correction but did not really receive it. Just like most. "a man convinced against his will is a man unconvinced still." But I would imagine many of us have been called on the carpet, and "jacked up" about things that weren't really as they seemed. I have. That pastor has. These men just do as they have been taught. It was nothing I could change,even after speaking to overseers in the proper "chain of command." Why change them when I can change me? | ||
| mklo Advanced Member Username: mklo Post Number: 694 Registered: 8-2005 Posted From: 67.185.114.218 |
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| gjhall New member Username: gjhall Post Number: 2 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 207.200.116.135 |
I was raised in a Pentacostal "Holiness" church, so even though I'm not "privy" to NTCC per se, I know where you all are coming from. The problem is, they get people "saved," but then they suck the life out of your with all the man-made rules and regulations. NTCC and most "Christian" churches are nothing more than spiritual abortion clinics. Oy! I don't even know where to begin...even though I'm not part of NTCC, I feel your pain! | ||
| grtgogetter New member Username: grtgogetter Post Number: 18 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 72.178.64.142 |
Hey Chris. This is Kevin Oravits. We were in BS together. We left in 2004 but we were in California so people probably didn't know if or when we left. One of the things that disappointed me the most when we left was the lack of care from anyone in NTCC that we were leaving. I even made sure Rev. Olson had our contact information and he never called. Interestingly enough, HOP made a very aggressive pursuit of us but I wasn't interested. Hit me up sometime. grtgogetter@hotmail.com | ||
| tracypelfrey Member Username: tracypelfrey Post Number: 94 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 76.211.5.163 |
Davis received enough letters and phone calls about abuse in his organization to paper the walls of his home. He cares not for any of it. And, it's those who have been reported on the most...who seem to stay around the longest and rise through the 'ranks'. | ||
| makingitknown New member Username: makingitknown Post Number: 1 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 67.159.49.250 |
Chris good to see you unshackled! | ||
| matthew_wadsworth Member Username: matthew_wadsworth Post Number: 84 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 206.174.0.146 |
Hey Chris Fears I remember you, this is Matthew Wadsworth, I'm not sure if you remember me, but I was at the bible school at the same time as you. Anyways I remember you came from Fairbanks, and now that is where I live, funny eh? | ||
| chris_fears New member Username: chris_fears Post Number: 10 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 96.230.210.201 |
Yes matt i do kind of. Met you at conf. May even have a pic. You knew my wife? Good to see ya here. Who is making it known? E- mail me if iknow you. If not dont worry bout it. Thanks anyway! |
