| Author | Message | ||
     rickards_scott New member Username: rickards_scott Post Number: 2 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 69.6.160.98 |
Howdy from the great state of Texas! With permission from Steve (a great friend of mine) I am notifying all concerned that he has resigned from NTCC (Sioux Falls, SD) as of 1/6/08 - the same day as my twin brother. Oh, and did I mention that Jon Crum & his wife Kristen, previous helpers of mine, resigned the same day I did last month from our church in Amarillo. C'ya! | ||
| steve_bellman New member Username: steve_bellman Post Number: 1 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 71.32.36.197 |
Well, here I am. Yes it is true. I have resigned from NTCC. Just so all will know, my wife fully supports and backs me in my decision. Our transition in Sioux falls has gone incredibly well so far. The new pastor took over Sunday, and essentially all that is left is the paper work. I see that Scott posted that I resigned at 1:20 and I received my first call from a concerned Brother at 3. Allow me to share with you the reasons for my resignation. POLICY VS. DOCTRINE. To all of you who know us in and out of the Church, I want you to know that we are not leaving God. We will continue to go to church, serve God and reach out to men women and children with the reality of Jesus Christ. At the present time I have no immediate plans of pastoring a church but hope to get involved where ever I go. If any of you wish to contact me, I would love to hear from you. Steve kdinc@live.com | ||
| weezer Junior Member Username: weezer Post Number: 29 Registered: 8-2007 Posted From: 70.6.7.164 |
the majority continue to serve God. Should i even say "continue"? i guess that would be hard in the context of what we're dealing with: "If you leave ntcc, you have left God". just as well rev kekel mocks those who say "i'm still serving God" as if ntcc is the only place to be a christian. | ||
| doug_allen Intermediate Member Username: doug_allen Post Number: 263 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 67.35.72.9 |
Scott, what is the status of the Douelles? I hope I have the spelling correct. Were they not working with you in TX? They are such nice people and so far from the ideal ntcc minister. | ||
| just2bhappy New member Username: just2bhappy Post Number: 11 Registered: 7-2007 Posted From: 70.121.192.69 |
Well, since others appear to be "coming out of the Factnet closet of anonymity," I feel compelled to present myself by name. Tony R. Perdue aka Bulldogs40 & my wife, Renee' Perdue aka just2bhappy. Our resignation came as a result of the same POLICY vs. DOCTRINE issues, as well as other things, such as how we were treated. You can see the thread titled "Loyalty...My Story" to read more about the events of our resignation. We are excited to have other new comers who have joined the X'ers gang. One of the best advantages of being on the outside are reconnecting with those who left before us. Tony rlobo83@aol.com Renee' reneedperdue@yahoo.com PS HOW IN THE WORLD DO YOU PEOPLE ACTUALLY READ THROUGH THE RAMBLINGS ON AND ON AND ON AND ON AND ON OF greg_s ????? | ||
| pelfdaddy Senior Member Username: pelfdaddy Post Number: 1021 Registered: 12-2006 Posted From: 166.128.201.73 |
Tony, I read the postings of greg_s the way one would look slightly too long at a tragic accident in the road. Everyone says "keep it movin' folks", but I have to drift slowly past and stare...the way you gulp back rage and disgust when you see films of the Auschwitz camp, but cannot tear your eyes away from the scene...the way you sit through Jaws for the tenth time knowing that the guy's head is about to float out of that hole in the wreck...you know, like that. | ||
| rls Junior Member Username: rls Post Number: 44 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 65.28.108.137 |
Pelfdaddy! Too funny. ROFL! | ||
| rickards_scott New member Username: rickards_scott Post Number: 3 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 69.6.160.98 |
Scott, what is the status of the Douelles? The Deuell's are fine...they're wonderful people! However, if you think they're not cookie cutter NTCC you're sadly mistaken. Well, he isn't, but she most certainly is...she's been with Pastor Davis from the beginning & as soon as we resigned we were disdained. | ||
| steve_bellman New member Username: steve_bellman Post Number: 2 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 71.32.36.197 |
The phone calls have begun, and the e-mails are coming in. It has been very suprising to us the people that we have spoken with that share our disagrements with the Organization. Preachers and preachers wives, once we tell them yes it is true we have resigned, the flood gates open. OFCOURSE we have spoken to some that have been truly saddened to hear that they have lost a brother and sister. I have made it clear to everyone that I am still a Christian and will continue to live and work for God. Also I have not gone into any detail trying to pursuade these individuals to thinking like me. My reason for writting here is very simple. It is very obvious to me, again from calls and e-mails that there are a lot people that are questioning "Things" with in the organization. The policies, the "Rules". It has also come to our attention that we have not been the only ones willing to ask questions of the organization. Of all of those that have contacted us and confided in us that they to have asked questions, everyone has the same response. Little to None. The most common recurring comments are. It is "Policy vs. Doctrine." "It is not a sin, but it is what we signed up for." Here is the point I am trying to get at. If you are in NTCC and you have questions, You need to cast off the fear and come out and ask. If enough people ask, Maybe an answer will come. Maybe at this point some will come to the conclusion that I am fighting against the organization. That is not at all what I am doing. Make no mistake, I have serious disagreemtns with numerous policies of NTCC, but I am not fighting them, I am simply saying that if you find yourself filled with doubt and questions, Ask. I think it would be wise to continue this post with what has lead us to where we are today. | ||
| tracypelfrey Junior Member Username: tracypelfrey Post Number: 46 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 76.211.6.33 |
Hey Steve: NEWS FLASH! To be out of NTCC and post anything publicly in the negative (as they define negative)... IS TO BE FIGHTING AGAINST THEM! To speak to anyone in NTCC or anyone straddling the fence (which hurts, I'm sure...just jump off already)... IS TO BE TRYING TO PULL PEOPLE OUT! Oh...that I could PULL SOMEONE OUT. To pull them out...paints a picture of them pulling in the opposite direction. They are coming out of NTCC...without any pulling. Again, we are only saying here...what everyone knows...and what no one dares to say to one another. You can claim to be serving God all you want... the fact remains... THEY WILL TELL EVERYONE THAT YOU ARE CROSSED UP WITH GOD. These be the fact Jack!}}} | ||
| pelfdaddy Senior Member Username: pelfdaddy Post Number: 1024 Registered: 12-2006 Posted From: 166.128.156.172 |
RW Davis is determined to ignore questions and critiqe. The hallmark of his ministry is "My head is harder than yours." Based upon the fact that "I was here first", Davis feels he has the right to do anything, or say anything, and those who choose NOT to follow him are, in his mind, condemned and without excuse. You are trained from the beginnings of your association with this group to obey without question, and this is what Davis demands. Kekel himself has said that this is the main purpose of The Rules. "God sent you here, God wants you here, no one has ever left in the will of God, and God put me here to tell you what to do." Your only responsibility is to continually submit to his authority. Therefore, he does not care what you think. He does not care if you leave. He does not care about anyone who does not bow to his will without asking "WHY?" | ||
| steve_bellman New member Username: steve_bellman Post Number: 3 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 71.32.36.197 |
"No one leaves overnight" So true so true. Ever since I started attending NTCC I have always questioned certain practices, standards, and policies of the Org. I started coming to the church just after I turned 19. The thing that kept me was the fellowship. The brothers. I was a single G.I. at the time and so I just determined that all of these things really did not matter to me, I was happy and having fun with the brothers. Two years later I meet and married my wife and once again these questions came to the surface, but by then I was just a part, keep on keeping on. Through out the years in Bible college and beyond we continued to question, and we continued to supress our questions. Then we moved out into the work of the Lord. God has been so very good to us, and the church began to grow, men and women were getting saved. I built strong relationships with my members. (Now if you do not know me or the church in Sioux falls SD. The church is comprised of Ex-Hutterites. The Hutterites are similar in many ways to the Amish, they are different, but so as to save a lot of explaining, they are very similar.) As I grew to know these men and women I fell in love with them. They are my Brothers and sister. (I am so very greatful for their outpouring of love and support through all of this.) THE POINT OF THIS. Meeting and dealing with these men and women again began to cause me to question very seriously my own organization. Again we plodded on. Well, finally it came to a head in March of 07'. We decided to leave on a Fri. Afternoon for a fellowship meeting. (Our leaving a day early was approved.) We went to the town and got a hotel room at a hotel with a pool and small water slide. This was planned. I had told my Son he could bring his bathing suit and go swimming. Sat. morning when he went to the pool, there was not a single soul there but him. That was a good thing. My wife and I sat down ate breakfast and relaxed. We then got ready went to church and had a good time. In the course of fellowshipping with the local pastor my son began to share what he had been doing earlier. continued.... | ||
| steve_bellman New member Username: steve_bellman Post Number: 4 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 71.32.36.197 |
Now to the Local pastors credit he did not say anything then or later, BUT, as my son began to talk about this I began to get very uncomfortable, I did not know how the Brother would respond, or what he would do. So first chance I got I told my son in a hussed but firm voice, Shut Up!! Later I began to explain to him how if I allow him do do certain things, like go and see a Star wars movie, or go bowling with the Christian Cadets, or go to a skating ring with his Christian school, etc. He was not to go around talking about it. (Let me throw this in here at this point. This is prevelant in the org. Kids are confiding in other kids the things that they are being allowed to do. Sometimes these children open the doors for the parents to come clean with one another. Sometimes the kids just talk and tell each other with the mutual agreement, "don't let our parents know that we each know that we all do the same stuff.") That teaches hypocrisy. Continuing on. THE VERY MOMENT I SAID IN THIS HUSSHED VOICE "SHUT UP" it his me that I was at the very least being disingenuis with my son if not outright hypocritical. (One man, a faithful minister in NTCC told me last night that all of us have a certain level of Hypocrisy with in us.) Again continuing on. (Can anyone here tell that I am a preacher, getting off on all these rabbit trails and tangints.) OK so this reality hits me and it hits me hard. I then began to seriously consider what I had to do. After a few days I spoke with my wife and told her what happened and how I felt. She fully understood and was supportive of me. SO. In April of 07' I resigned via mail. I still have a copy of that first resignation. It simply stated that after due consideration I felt it was necessary to tender my resignation from NTCC. I also expressed my willingness to work with the org. in completing the transition. Continued | ||
| steve_bellman New member Username: steve_bellman Post Number: 5 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 71.32.36.197 |
I know this is getting long, I am almost done I think. I have quite proof reading and correcting, so bear with any mistakes. CONTINUING ON. So Rev. Johnson happened to be close, so he arrived the next day. He was truly gracious to us and expressed a real desire to work with us and resolve these issues that we had. I was thankful for his visit and felt a reliefe in being able to express my opinions with him. One example of this. One of the ladies in the church was wearing polish on her toe nails. Sitting in my house he asked me what I thought of that. I said plainly, "I don;t care." He asked why they do that and my wife let us both know that women will do that so that if they wear open tow shoes you cannot see any dirt under their nails. With that I was once again asked, so now what do you think, again, "I don't care." I knew this sister and I knew that she did not and does not feel comfortable wearing high heels of any sort because she feels that they are not modest. I expressed that to Rev. Johnson and that was that. I also learned with the Johnsons that not all make-up is make-up. Sis Johnson told me and my wife that she wears some kind of cover up for her rosey checks condition. My wife was blown away. Sis. Johnson said she did not consider it make-up. Please I am not finding fault with the Johnsons. They are great people and we love them. This was our conversation. So all said and done we once again continued on. My wife also asked Rev. Johnson how long they needed to answer our question. This was in April, so she asked will we get the answers in June at the Conference? That question was not directly answered. (Here is another one of my opinions. If you cannot deal with these issues at a ministers conf. where can you? Close a service. Allow only misters and students and lets air this stuff out.) Ok so we go to conf. hopeful that we will be given some kind of answers. At the conf. we sad, but not shaocked to see that nothing was happening. Wed. night service I come in and Pasot got up before Rev. Olson preached and said a lot of what I have heard before. I cannot point to any specific thing that was said, but essentially he was letting us know where the door was. SO I got up and walked out. I guess people just thought I was going to the bathroom or something. Well, my wife did not see me leave so I sat in the van until after the service. I was upset, MAD, angry, hurt. She got in and I began to drive away never to return again. continued.... | ||
| dtaylor New member Username: dtaylor Post Number: 9 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 71.197.255.52 |
Steve, I appreciate your honesty! I have heard, and this is only hearsay, but I'm sure someone out there knows. Someone told me that the Kekel's took Grant to the beach. Is this true? If so, what is the big deal of you allowing your son to go swimming in the pool at the hotel? This is what I mean about a double standard. Who has changed the standard and why? Diana | ||
| steve_bellman New member Username: steve_bellman Post Number: 7 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 71.32.36.197 |
As I was driving away I realized I could not leave like this. So I turned around and I went back into the chapel, as I was walking in Rev. Kekel was passing by and said, "Hello Brother how are you." I responded in typical "Were doing good sir." "Wait, sir I just lied, I have a serious problem." So we sat and talked in the chapel until 2 a.m. Again he was very kind and even shared a lot of his message that he preached the next night about fear. Yet for all that was said, nothing was resolved. The next morning I went to Pastor and Rev. Olson and told them how I felt. To be completely honest I told Pastor that I sometimes felt that he was very Mackavelion (I am sure that is not spelt right) anyway I later apologized for that statement. Again both Pastor and Rev. Olson were kind, but I left still unresolved. We kept on keeping on. Then we went to the Ministers seminar. That was a truly awsome time. The fellowship was great. We had a really good good time. It was here at this seminar that I apologized to Pastor in the presence of Rev. Olson for my comments at Conf. (I figured I said with Rev. Olson present, and I should apologize with him present.) (((This apologizing thing is a whole different story There are some preachers that need to apologize to some brothers.))) So the seminar was good. In that seminar Pastor was very clear that he was not and will not change, end of story. We still left kind of on a high note, we just had such a good time with everyone. Then we got back to Sioux Falls and the answer settled in. Nothing is going to change. I have to believe that Pasot knows how we feel what are questions are etc. and that seemed to be the answer. It was and is certainly the clearest answer anyone has given us, if that was what he was refering to. So now we move into Dec. The answer has really settled in and I realize I cannot do this anymore. So I called and asked to be replaced. The Transition has gone great. The new pastor has been kind and gracious, Rev. Olson has been kind, gracious and honest with us, as we have been with him. There has been to this point no nastiness on either side. THANK YOU! So finally I mailed in my lic. on 1-6-08 with a very simple letter that I have decided to resign from NTCC. That is pretty much it to date. This is me and this is my side of the story for what it is worth. Plans: We are looking to get involved in a local church and continue to serve God and reach people with the good news that Jesus still saves. We are looking to God and the Bible to live Biblically balanced lives. Will we make changes in our lives. YES. when we were a part of NTCC we did what we did as unto the Lord in the org. (Not always so well, Some of you have mentioned how I was never much of a conformist. One brother said that he did not believe that, but rather I was just real, Thank You.) So as we leave the org. we will continue to live our lives as unto the Lord according to his Word. This is not a dig or a shot at NTCC. We have been told very plainly that there are policies and rules in the org. that are not a mater of doctrine and they are not sin, they are just NTCC policies. That is pretty much it. Take care and God bless Bro Steve Bellman (605) 254-7272 kdinc@live.com | ||
| victorjohanson Junior Member Username: victorjohanson Post Number: 40 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 66.230.101.16 |
"... that are not a mater of doctrine and they are not sin, they are just NTCC policies." That's the new spin, because they've been unable to furnish any biblical justification. But back in the day, these "policies" were SINS that would cause you to SPLIT HELL WIDE OPEN. For all RW's "I'm not gonna change" rhetoric, he really is a subtle chameleon. | ||
| weezer Junior Member Username: weezer Post Number: 32 Registered: 8-2007 Posted From: 68.26.21.9 |
policies because they ran /are running it like a business instead of a loving merciful christian church. they'd have more people if they ran it like the latter. | ||
| steve_bellman New member Username: steve_bellman Post Number: 9 Registered: 1-2008 Posted From: 71.32.36.197 |
I want to say thank you to everyone that has written, and called us to express their love for us. Let me share some good news. We went to a different church Sunday night. We went back tonight, Wed. Our Son Stephen went to Awana and had a good time. David went to the nursery and he had a great time. We went to the Bible Study and we were blown away. It was awsome, Relveant, real, just incredible. I am really looking forward to Sunday morning. Everyone was friendly welcoming, and I was suprised at how many people remebered our name. The Pastor was very friendly and we look forward to spending some time with him. This is just another segment in our smooth transition. Thank you God! Keep in touch The Bellmans | ||
| ntcctruth Junior Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 34 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 70.102.118.90 |
Hi Steve, Congratulations on being set free from the middle-men cult leaders of NTCC! I hate to burst the bubble, but there is no leaving on a good note. I GUARANTEE YOU that all of that kindness is not genuine because a tiger like that never changes its stripes. They may not have acted nasty towards you (yet), but believe me, Davis holds you in contempt as he does everyone else (esp preachers) who leaves and they talk bad about everyone who had left amongst themselves. Do this - have one of your family members of the household call DAVIS (not KEKEL or OLSON) to wish him a happy birthday or something like that and see what happens. I know of one man who tried to leave like you did and his daughter called Davis to wish him a happy birthday. Davis put the phone down, said nothing, and eventually he heard the "click." So much for nice... Marc Perez | ||
| clearwater Junior Member Username: clearwater Post Number: 46 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 24.17.248.210 |
Brother and Sis Bellman, God bless you. As I remember, will pray for you. Good testimony, very edifying. Take care....rejoicing with you. | ||
| ntcctruth Junior Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 37 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 70.102.118.90 |
Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2008 - 12:43 pm: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "... that are not a mater of doctrine and they are not sin, they are just NTCC policies." That's the new spin, because they've been unable to furnish any biblical justification. But back in the day, these "policies" were SINS that would cause you to SPLIT HELL WIDE OPEN. For all RW's "I'm not gonna change" rhetoric, he really is a subtle chameleon. The only thing to add to that is that the "SIN" was nothing more than disobeying the whims of the Man of GAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWdduh! Marc Perez |
