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imaskingwhy
Intermediate Member
Username: imaskingwhy
Post Number: 123
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 208.79.15.2
| | Posted on Saturday, January 05, 2008 - 11:36 am: | 
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Is this true? Boy Greg you just opened a can of worms. |
imaskingwhy
Intermediate Member
Username: imaskingwhy
Post Number: 128
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 208.79.15.3
| | Posted on Sunday, January 06, 2008 - 5:16 am: |
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Can anyone confirm if this Greg S. was the young man who married sister Blumenthal like a month after brother Blumenthal left NTCC.?
Bryan David Hill |
bro_derrick
Senior Member
Username: bro_derrick
Post Number: 1980
Registered: 9-2005
Posted From: 75.197.253.73
| | Posted on Sunday, January 06, 2008 - 11:34 am: |
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Yes.
They lived next door to us in Bible School (Training for the 'Church Business')
He was a good guy, and she was a wonderful person, but of course as time passes in NTCC, so does the heart, affections, Jesus' faith, etc...
Too bad, but people DO make their choices, and hopefully theirs' will be to get out for God, before it's too late for either or both of them (including their current marriage.)
Prince Davis declared Blumenthal to have committed adultery, which may or may not be true, either during or after their marriage.
With Davis no one (But God, himself, and those involved) knows exactly HOW he spins things, but the WHY is always the same: Business, Politics, Organizational Loyalty, Family Inheritance...
I say that Davis himself is one of the few who knows how he is spinning things, but that's not necessarily true. You can spin things for so long and in so many ways, and get so good at it, that you forget where the spin is, even as you forget where the Lord is that once bought you... (Judges 16:20)(2 Pegter 1:9,2:1) |
weezer
New member
Username: weezer
Post Number: 24
Registered: 8-2007
Posted From: 99.200.37.124
| | Posted on Sunday, January 06, 2008 - 11:37 am: |
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so what about all the others that have committed adultery ?
and so for what, adultery he was kicked out of the church ? |
bro_derrick
Senior Member
Username: bro_derrick
Post Number: 1982
Registered: 9-2005
Posted From: 75.197.253.73
| | Posted on Sunday, January 06, 2008 - 1:15 pm: |
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Not necessarily.
Davis will keep adulterers, fornicators, and homosexuals... so long as they keep it under carpet and are productive workers for his program. All manner of uncleanness and lying-ministerial wonders are acceptable in Davis' filthy business.
The cardinal sin is disloyalty to his Organization.
For politics Blumenthal left Davis' program: he knew Kekel-in-law had the top spot he coveted by virtue of marriage into the Davis Family. He may or may not have committed adultery. (Davis and Kekel have, but Davis was there first, and Kekel married second.) (Who's on third? Son of the Son-in-law!)
My own perception (which is what Davis' spins for) was that Blumenthal had committed 'adultery' after his departure (as his 'wife' did not got with him), and so she was now 'free' to remarry Greg Shuck.
The perception also was that he just up & left her as well.
But of course with clearer (nonloyal eyes) we see anything was possible.
But none of that Bible and right manner stuff matters with Davis. The ONLY thing is who's loyally staying and getting paired up with a team-mate to work his program unto success. |
bro_derrick
Senior Member
Username: bro_derrick
Post Number: 1983
Registered: 9-2005
Posted From: 75.197.253.73
| | Posted on Sunday, January 06, 2008 - 1:20 pm: |
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I say again. Shunk was a good and decent guy, and that 'wife' was a really kind, quiet, and faithful girl.
But loyalty to Davis will kill faith to Jesus and love to others, when caught up in the web of cultism. (too bad for good people gone bad for bad leaders)
The standard true scenario was:
Married person ceases loyalty to NTCC/HOP. Spouse separates from them. Loyal spouse remarried another loyal unmarried or ex-spouse.
The spiritual spin and cultism is that the 'unbeliever' has spiritually separated and departed from their spouse by leaving their first love, so the loyal one is 'free' to remarry.
1 Cor 7 does not command a believing spouse to stay with an unbeliever; however, the believer is free to remarry ONLY if the unbeliever physically departs: desertion. (7:15)
And so, this is how Davis-types are guilty of adultery by teaching it to the servants of Christ and thus defiling His body (1 Cor 3:11-17)(Jude 4)(Rev 2:14,20)
Even as they make themselves false apostles, so they eventually will also make themselves vessels fit for destruction rather than of honor: Even as they have made others!
The Good News is that apparently couples are getting out from under Davis' worship with their marriages and families in tact. God is truly able to bless now!
After all, Jesus wants ALL people to be saved and in His kingdom, even as Davis-types want ALL believers to be saved enough to work in his organization, even if they MUST lose it later for high success.
That's why we can't serve two masters, because both want your undivided attention, love, and service.
That is why Jesus commands us to mark & avoid them that cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned in the Scriptures.
Davis' unscriptural commands and anti-christian demands for personal loyalty to his personal ministry and church program will divide the believer's love, affections, and faithfulness from Jesus, His body, their families, and even their spouses!
Davis has so many such 6's to his ministerial account, that he's plainly marked himself as a beast of a minister. An apostle of destruction. A church-builder fit more for the kingship of the Destroyer (Rev 9:11), rather than the Prince of Life and of Peace! |
greg_s
Intermediate Member
Username: greg_s
Post Number: 348
Registered: 6-2005
Posted From: 64.12.117.202
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2008 - 1:36 am: |
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*bump* |
imaskingwhy
Intermediate Member
Username: imaskingwhy
Post Number: 139
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 208.79.15.3
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2008 - 9:33 am: |
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So then Gregy married his pastors wife? I remember Greg being a very young boy when I first saw him with Sis Blumenthal many years his senior. Not that that is a problem. However, when I saw them together for the first time, it just didn't seem right. Something was amiss. Marrying my pastors wife would be like marrying my mother due to the position of being, well, my pastor's wife. Greg how long was it after brohter Blumenthal left NTCC that you went for it? Or was it stewing for a while? Just curious.
You know I remember so many years (think 1982) ago sister Blumenthal being my pastors wife. I just couldn't bring myself to consider my pastors wife as my own.
Do you ever think of your ex pastor, brother Blumenthal?
I think you were a victim of NTCC's manipulation and not even know it. How could you, you were so young and it happened so fast, huh?
You don't think it was concievable for anyone else but a no name newbee to marry into such a pillar of the church do you? And who would want to see all those years of experience in the ministry sis Blumenthal had go to waste? not NTCC.
Hey look at it like this, it is a win win situation. You were a no name newbee with nothing for the org to lose and sis Blumenthal a wealth of experience. So bottome line is:
win win
The org. gets to marry off an excellent NTCC wife to a young up coming minister. By the time your in a position of influence all the history is forgotten (right?) and abbra cadabra you get a good wife ready made, sis Blumenthal gets to be there while you develop your ministry together (like wiping noses and changing diapers for her) and in time NTCC has a brand new couple for the field. And boys and girls that's how NTCC marriages are born.
Unless of course you think it was all God and love. But thus far I have seen to many marriages that the leaders of NTCC has had their hands all over. I hate to break the news to you but (in the old timers minds) sister Blumenthal will always be the wife of a man RWD practically raised and dubbed the next CEO of NTCC. You were allowed into the picture to change that, at least for some.
BDH |
charger
Junior Member
Username: charger
Post Number: 42
Registered: 12-2007
Posted From: 71.32.36.197
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2008 - 2:08 pm: |
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I've got a question here. I started my sentence with ntcc in 92' so I never meet Blumenthal myself. I heard some great things about him.
Understand, I do not know how old he was, or anything.
So the Question is if This man Blumenthal was dubbed the next CEO, does this mean that he was suppose to marry Tanya?
Was this maybe the first time she bucked at one of her dads commands.
It is my opinion (which isnt worth much I know), but it is my opinion that she decided "I do not care what my dad says, I am wearing my nails."
Seems like dad caved in too. (Again just my opinion.)
So is it possible that Tany was meant for this Blumenthal guy?
I have also heard that blumenthal would have been content to dwell with his wife, but the ORG determined that he abandoned her.
Hearing this stuff about Greg marrying his pastors wife so quickly reminds me of another great incident in NTCC history.
I have heard that Jim Ashmores son went to a work as a helper, commited adultery with the pastors wife and is married to her to this day.
Can anyone verify or attest to this fact?
Again this was before I started my sentence with the ORG. |
imaskingwhy
Intermediate Member
Username: imaskingwhy
Post Number: 140
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 208.79.15.3
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2008 - 11:13 pm: |
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The Blumenthal saga is quite wrenching. The high profile of both Deborah and Richard Blumenthal demanded some type of damage control by the org. Sister Blumenthal (innocent party in all of this) rebounded extremely fast with (Gregy Phooh)a young man in their congregation. This marriage the org. allowed, I believe, was meant to simply bring a even quicker end to it all. A new marriage after all is a picture of new beginnings. Meanwhile Richard leaves a org. he could never preach in again (whole other story). Greg comes in the picture thinking he is in love, never the wiser he was a pawn to help bring closure and deflect a prior image of a prior marriage.
BDH |
donethat
Junior Member
Username: donethat
Post Number: 37
Registered: 8-2007
Posted From: 71.212.62.211
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2008 - 11:41 pm: |
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I remember Sister Blumenthal from Hawaii what a nice lady.I hope she is happy. |
rls
Junior Member
Username: rls
Post Number: 42
Registered: 12-2007
Posted From: 65.28.108.137
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2008 - 11:58 pm: |
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What a bloody mess! Org causes trouble, yet again.
Sanctions illegitimate marriage, yet again.
When will the abominations, ever end? |
tracypelfrey
Junior Member
Username: tracypelfrey
Post Number: 42
Registered: 12-2007
Posted From: 76.211.6.33
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2008 - 8:07 am: |
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I had Blumenthal as a pastor in the Philippines.
Now that my husband and I have seen how the organization spins the reasons surrounding the resignation and/or disappearance of their preachers...now I wonder...what really did happen to him?
We were told one thing, but I've wondered what ever did happen to him.
Don't get me wrong though...he was one of THEM. He pulled some shenanigans that will live in infamy, but he's still a human being...and it just makes me wonder about all the stories we were told about anyone who ever left. I know now that most of it is hogwash.
There was a couple who left NTCC somewhere around Christmas, 2001. We had just moved ON CAMPUS in the Fall of that same year.
Our family was entertaining the Waltermires and making Merry around our Christmas tree...and the Davis' came over for a visit. V. Davis and A. Waltermire and I were sitting at the table...listening to V. Davis rehearse in our ears the STATS concerning couples who leave NTCC together: She made the claim that ALL OF THEM END IN DIVORCE...without fail.
We were wondering aloud..."How does it happen that a couple will leave together?" We were of the mind that they must have been talking to one another about it...or one was filling the ears of the other with rebellion. And, all of this was sinful. To speak of the MAN OF GOD or HIS CHURCH...was and still is...SINFUL.
So, she was saying that even though this couple left TOGETHER...it wouldn't be long and they would be divorced.
What she was leaving out though...were the STATS of all of the couples that she and her husband and her daughter had broken up by whispering in the ears of the wife or husband...that "YOU KNOW...YOU DON'T HAVE TO STAY WITH HIM IF HE IS NOT GOING TO SERVE GOD"
Is it Biblical to justify divorce... JUST BECAUSE THE SPOUSE ATTENDS ANOTHER CHURCH?
Or, let's operate on the NTCC premise...they they ARE THEE Body of Christ...and there is none other and that to leave THEIR FELLOWSHIP is to leave the Body and therefore...is to leave God:
O.K.: That still doesn't give anyone the grounds to divorce their spouse. It seems to me there is provision for the "unbelieving" wife or husband in the New Testament.
This is one of the practices of NTCC that is one of the most hideous. Because...it doesn't just rest in the lap of Davis and those in his leadership which promote the same smack...but there is a trickle down effect...and it goes on in manhy of the local churches where the pastor is a Davis emulator.
I cannot tell you how many phone calls and emails I've had since leaving NTCC... from local church members...around the world...not just in the States...who relate stories of how that their NTCC pastor encouraged them to leave their spouse MERELY because they stopped attending their church.
What kind of monsters masquerade as Christians...men and women of God...and yet can do such things? They must have desensitized themselves to it long, long ago. Their conscience is seared.
Fight with all of your might to keep these people from messing with your family.
What is more disgusting than having them break up marriages though...is how they attempt to put distance between parents and their children. I need to sign off. I'm getting worked up.
Tracy |
nbrown
New member
Username: nbrown
Post Number: 11
Registered: 11-2006
Posted From: 71.39.121.221
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2008 - 9:54 am: |
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That's the biggest secret of ntcc - if you're spouse stops attending "it's okay to get a divorce".
They might sneak in the bible verse "do not be unequally yolked" to make it seem biblical.
It's very very tragic. And only a monster would do that.
My husband has so many pictures people gave to him throughout the years. He has several just of the Blumethal's together.
Probably many people out there who have been around for some years could take the pictures couples have given them, cut the people out and rearrange them with who they are with now. It's that bad. Try living on Merz Row and watch how many times people get divorced and switch spouses with someone who is more loyal. There was one couple (a preacher and his wife) who fell on hard times and my husband and I were helping them out for awhile. She got a divorce and remarried another preacher. Whenever I saw her, no matter how hard I tried, I would accidentally call her by her previous last name. I got a pretty nasty look, but man I just couldn't keep up with all the swapping!
There's a show on one of the local channels called Wife Swap. They could film several episodes if they ever took a trip to Graham.
Whispering in someone's ear they can divorce their non attending spouse is sick. I'm glad this is posted here so maybe it can help someone who's in realize what is going on. |
bro_derrick
Senior Member
Username: bro_derrick
Post Number: 1996
Registered: 9-2005
Posted From: 70.208.111.39
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2008 - 4:45 pm: |
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'For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark...' (Matthew 24:28)
The rise and fall of man's Organization of Churches, even the Richest Man In Babylon's...: Davis.
Get out while the gettin's good, because there is a flood coming, and there is still an ark waiting: Jesus, His body, and His ministry.
'And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.' (Rev 18:2-5) |
michael_ismyfirstname
Junior Member
Username: michael_ismyfirstname
Post Number: 27
Registered: 11-2007
Posted From: 72.172.42.141
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2008 - 10:01 pm: |
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----Is Greg_s consenting to the discussion of these personal matters on a public forum???----
I think this is wrong. Stop discussing his personal (PRIVATE) life in such a manner unless he permits. |
clearwater
Junior Member
Username: clearwater
Post Number: 47
Registered: 11-2007
Posted From: 24.17.248.210
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2008 - 11:06 pm: |
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bro derek, your pretty "fired-up" you contribute many long post and often full of scripture. You ever do any street preaching???
michael_ismyfirstname, classy thing to say, and agree with you. |
imaskingwhy
Intermediate Member
Username: imaskingwhy
Post Number: 141
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 208.79.15.2
| | Posted on Thursday, January 10, 2008 - 11:53 pm: |
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----Is Greg_s consenting to the discussion of these personal matters on a public forum???----
I think this is wrong. Stop discussing his personal (PRIVATE) life in such a manner unless he permits.
Ok, once he regains his footing, I give him permission to respond.
Bump* |
gjhall
New member
Username: gjhall
Post Number: 1
Registered: 1-2008
Posted From: 207.200.116.135
| | Posted on Friday, January 11, 2008 - 2:58 am: |
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I remember Greg S...I served with him in the Marines back in the late '80s...I remember him being married with a daughter then, Ashely I believe her name was. Whatever happened to them? |
imaskingwhy
Intermediate Member
Username: imaskingwhy
Post Number: 143
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 208.79.15.3
| | Posted on Friday, January 11, 2008 - 5:09 am: |
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For the record, the primary point of this thread is to point out that the great apologist himself is more than likely a victim of manipiulation.
NTCC is a self serving organization and is not beyond exerting shrewd or devious influence in the name of God.
BDH |
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