| Author | Message | ||
     jet_lagg New member Username: jet_lagg Post Number: 3 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 24.2.239.118 |
I've been hearing word that a lot has changed since I left Graham. I haven't gotten much in the way of details other than that many restrictions have been lifted from the school. Anyone currently attending that can fill me in? | ||
| mklo Advanced Member Username: mklo Post Number: 672 Registered: 8-2005 Posted From: 67.185.114.218 |
Yes, there has been a lot of buzz about how: "It's not like it used to be" "Things have changed" "Things are different now" But these statements only raise the questions: How did it used to be? What has changed, and why? What is different now, and why? Good luck obtaining any concrete answers regarding NTCC's reformation as a kinder, gentler organization. | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 963 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 70.102.118.90 |
If you're a part of NTCC Graham, your life is still under their control. The only way that will ever change is if the member ever makes the break from Davis/Kekel worship and makes their escape. Marc Perez | ||
| jet_lagg New member Username: jet_lagg Post Number: 5 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 71.234.232.149 |
Yes, NTCC is a cult. Rev. Davis is the antichrist, and blah blah blah. Furthermore, blah. I'm aware I'm being snarky, but there are many other threads for preaching the organization's cult status. All I really wanted to know is if anyone is aware of specific changes at the school. I will give examples. At school I could not have a computer in the dorm or the internet. I was not allowed to fellowship without permission. I was not allowed to wear colored shirts while soulwinning. I was not allowed to speak to a sister unless it was with Pastor's permission and on the wall. Have any of these things changed? | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 966 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 74.50.202.54 |
Your awareness is correct, and I wouldn't be too proud of it if I were you. Yet we're all human and prone to mistakes and all. I left on July 10, 2005, but I still talk to a few people that are attending Graham. I'm not sure about some of these changes, but I can enumerate a few of them: Computers are allowed since typewriters have become obsolete. Fellowship without permission has been modified a bit, but I'm not sure to what extent. Courtship on the wall has not changed unless it just changed very recently. Preaching against the internet has stopped and now they have a website and even MCKEKEL has internet. Videos, movies, DVD's are basically ok to a degree now. Many of these things, especially the last 2 things, were taboo not too long ago. They were ok for the M.O.G./M.O.B. (men of God/men of business), but that was not revealed to the general membership until it was discovered during the split, etc. One thing that has not changed, nor will ever change, is control. This is illustrated in the example given about not letting the general membership know about their liberties/changes of personal convictions. One thing that I had noticed in the 16 years that I was in NTCC is that the people coming in became more materialistic, more snooty/snobby, more high and mighty, etc. Walking up to the Graham chapel and seeing those men in suits with their radios and the ushers inside made me feel like there were G-men/secret service agents around. Oftentimes they acted as such. I remember bringing a family to Graham who had a baby that wasn't feeling its 100%. It made a single snort and an usher came to me wanting me to have them remove the child. I told that man to cool his heals, for it was not even crying. It made another snort and he looked at me again. Finally, it made another snort and RWD looked up and said to remove the child. I never brought anyone to the cult campus again for that reason. Ridiculous. A tiger will not change its stripes. Marc Perez | ||
| imaskingwhy Member Username: imaskingwhy Post Number: 77 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 216.40.83.170 |
Just curious, do the men sit on one side and the women on the other | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 968 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 74.50.202.54 |
When I left in July 2005, that wasn't going on anymore. They started to phase that practice out soon after they built the new Graham chapel in 1999. I remember being told that I could sit with my wife when we came back to Graham in January, 2000. Marc Perez | ||
| victorjohanson Senior Member Username: victorjohanson Post Number: 1417 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 66.223.233.130 |
"When I left in July 2005, that wasn't going on anymore." It's bad for business for this organization to outwardly appear as weird as it truly is. Such male/female segregation is a bit too Talibanish for the general public and tends to alienate normal people. But for the sixteen years I was there, it was an unquestioned practice. | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 971 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 70.102.118.90 |
"It's bad for business for this organization to outwardly appear as weird as it truly is. Such male/female segregation is a bit too Talibanish for the general public and tends to alienate normal people. But for the sixteen years I was there, it was an unquestioned practice." My thoughts exactly. I thought some of that as early as the time I had returned to Washington State in January, 2000. Yet I put it in the back of my mind thinking that all of those other churches are SO APOSTATE as RWD, MCKEKEL, and Co teaches - that I figured this was a small matter at the time. Yet once one realizes this is a symptom of a less than Godly leadership in its cult-style religious control over others, then there is no other choice but to escape that mess. Marc Perez | ||
| jet_lagg New member Username: jet_lagg Post Number: 8 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 24.2.239.118 |
"Your awareness is correct, and I wouldn't be too proud of it if I were you. Yet we're all human and prone to mistakes and all. " - Marc Perez I never said or implied I was proud of it. Of course, I don't make apologies either. I mean, let's face it. You were being annoying. I do owe you for the information on the other hand. You have my sincere thanks. (Message edited by jet_lagg on December 15, 2007) | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 977 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 74.50.202.54 |
"I mean, let's face it. You were being annoying." ------------------------ Really? For making a succinct and truthful statement? Yet mocking and insulting me wasn't being annoying? You're quite welcome for the information. Your credibility would go up considerably if you revealed your true identity. It will also be a step forward towards freedom in Christ. As Dr. Vic taught me (perhaps the best thing he ever taught me) was that you have to eventually realize that they can't do anything to you. I'm free to post, to comment, and have nothing to hide. Are you free? Marc Perez | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 990 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 74.50.202.54 |
Oh, and I forgot to mention, the women and men were still sitting on opposite sides of the sanctuary at the annual campground conferences in Missouri when I left in 2005. Marc Perez | ||
| jet_lagg New member Username: jet_lagg Post Number: 9 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 24.2.239.118 |
at ntcctruth: The annoying part wasn't in being truthful or succinct, but in using my thread to rant about the organization without dropping so much as a hint of an answer to my original question. (which you later rectified but not until after I had mocked you) I don't know what kind of credibility I need to ask a question, so your advice seems somewhat... nonsensical Nevertheless. I already have revealed my identity. *points to screen name* My name is Jet (Brother Jet for those of you who like using that term). Paine's the last name, though not as many people know that since I prefer to be called by my first name. I also go by Jet Lagg, Jet Black, or Batman if you prefer. | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 991 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 98.203.136.85 |
"...but in using my thread to rant about the organization without dropping so much as a hint of an answer to my original question. (which you later rectified but not until after I had mocked you) " "MY THREAD?" That sounds alot like Davis or some other NTCC pastor saying this is "my church" and how dare you question or say anything in "my church" and "my pulpit" and bless God I was here first! Remember RWD's famous line "I was here first?" "I'll jack you up..." - MCKEKEL's famous words. See the similarities? Instead of Bible School changes, how about jet lagg changes? I didn't know I had to rectify anything on a public forum unless I did something really outrageous or something. Excuse me for imposing comments about current borg control on YOUR thread. By the way, thanks for re-revealing yourself. Marc Perez | ||
| bro_derrick Senior Member Username: bro_derrick Post Number: 1938 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 70.216.42.107 |
Get 'em guy... I learned long ago, and am often reminded, there is no MY on Factnet. Which is good! We had enough of MY in Davis' organization (oops, sorry... It slipped) I learned it again when Vic and begone has their affair over Dake on MY thread about apostles. So, I just waited until something came along, or I wanted to post on it again. After all, there is such a thing as live and let live (Howbeit, not with devils in pupits... oops, slipped again) | ||
| bro_derrick Senior Member Username: bro_derrick Post Number: 1939 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 70.216.42.107 |
"It's bad for business for this organization to..." Hey, Vic, what do you mean by business? What kind of crack is that?! Are you implying that Davis is making a business out of the church and only makes decisions based on that business?? Hey look, sir! I'll have you know you are talking about a man that is preachin' the gospel and is a FELLOW MINSITER of all good but flawed ministers everywhere in God's church! If there's ANY business in Davis' organization, it's the FATHER's business, go it?! So rejoice! Be glad! Thank God! At least he's preachin'! At least he's trying to do SOMETHING for God! Give praise, man! He's not THAT bad. Yes, he's a little more flawed than us, and we are better at it than him, but that's absolutely NO reason to make him some kind of cult-Leading antichrist from heck, or something like that! So, you just watch that 'bad for business' stuff. Rather give thanks for our FELLOW MINISTERS of the gospel. So, lighten up. | ||
| imaskingwhy Member Username: imaskingwhy Post Number: 91 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 216.40.83.166 |
There you have it, a more reasonable clear thinking brother Derrick. I see your no longer breathing fire and wielding a bloody sword at the enemies of God. You were starting to concern me with all the jihad mumbo jumbo John 8:7 "If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her." Of course when you were one of these "enemies of God" while in NTCC did you consider yourself saved? You seem to fancy yourself in the "inner circle" and giving of your lifes blood to keep the organization afloat. Have you relinquished all rewards associated with your tenure as the backbone of all NTCC ministers? Oh let me guess you have a scripture. The fact of the matter is, now that you are out you want to continue to perpetuate your percieved importance in your apocalyptic mind set. Kinda like the alcoholic that comes out of the closet and then blasts all other alcoholics that are still in hiding or denial. BDH | ||
| jet_lagg New member Username: jet_lagg Post Number: 10 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 24.2.239.118 |
At Marc Perez: Well I had intended on first pointing out some common traits I see in your and Derrick's posts, but Brian has explained it just as well as I could have. As for the use of the term "my"... If this forum was like many others and had a decent search function you could indeed look up the term "Jet_Lagg's threads" and be directed to this one. Would the php coding in this case remind you of Pastor Davis for considering the thread I had started "mine"? Seriously, you need to lighten up. You say you are a brother, and, because of that, I don't wish to contend with you over something so petty. You can have the last word if you wish. | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 993 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 74.50.202.54 |
Bro Derrick is welcome to correct me if I'm wrong, but he has nothing against current members and well meaning Jesus preachers of NTCC. He, along with many other people on FACTNET (myself included), have a beef against those in leadership and pastorship in NTCC who are improperly usurping the pulpit for the furtherance of their ambitions rather than Christ. Along with that, the culture that is furthered by such leadership is that of pressure to do things or not do things in respect to what RWD/MCKEKEL thinks rather than the Bible. Any of us who had spent much time in NTCC and HOP knows this is true. I'll give the saddest example of this. I know of many parents, including myself, who had to apologize to our respective children for being so tough on them during our years in NTCC because we were so worried about looking robotically perfect for RWD and Co...for we didn't want to appear as one who can't RULE over our own household. I also saw ministers in Graham jack up their respective wives in broad daylight. Again, same reason applies. The frustration Bro Derrick expresses is towards a perceived lack of holy indignation for the said users and abusers of God's heritage. I'm also sure he'll admit that he was a true believer who gave up all his personal ambition for the borg as unto God for the time he was there...but he could never make himself the pusher and user of souls like the accomplished leaders could which is why he never "made it" in such an organization. I can say the same. Thank God we never "made it" in that place. Thank God for our freedom in Christ from such oppression and extra biblical bondage. Marc Perez PS: Brian, are you still living in WA? What's your email address? | ||
| ntcctruth Advanced Member Username: ntcctruth Post Number: 994 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 74.50.202.54 |
To Jet Lagg: I'll quote Pop Gaylord when they asked him to share a word during service in Graham back in 1992: "WORD"  Marc Perez | ||
| imaskingwhy Member Username: imaskingwhy Post Number: 93 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 216.40.83.166 |
Hey Marc I am currently in Bagdad not WA, although I certainly miss it. Your post above is well taken. My email zappertoy@yahoo.com BDH |
