| Author | Message | ||
     Anonymous |
Problems abound for ministry by Jay Friess Staff Writer May 17, 2002 WALDORF -- Save the Seed Ministry of Waldorf, a nationally recognized television ministry and drug treatment program, is in serious financial trouble and deeply split by divisions within the church. The ministry, created by Robert "Dr. Shine" Freeman, has court judgments against it totaling more than $900,000. In addition, Freeman admitted that he bounced a check for more than $1,800.+++ "He's been a con man for years," said former assistant pastor Roy Bowman.+++ Last month, Bowman wrote a letter to several area pastors and Freeman's mentor, nationally recognized preacher Kenneth Copeland, calling the ministry a "cult." He charged that the church was fiscally irresponsible, said it no longer treated the men in its care, and claimed six counts of adultery between Freeman and wives of the men working for him, including Bowman's wife.+++ "They are mad at me because I preach Prosperity Gospel," he added. "They [are] mad because they ain't going to the next level with me." Prosperity Gospel -- or Word/Faith, as taught by Freeman's mentor Copeland -- teaches that if one has faith in God and visualizes what he or she wants, God will grant them the material possessions of their desire. It is also known as the "Name-It-and-Claim-It" gospel by its critics, who say it conflicts with the Timothy's admonition that "the love of money is the root of all evil."+++ Small part of http://www.gazette.net/200220/weekend/a_section/105333-1.html | ||
| Anonymous |
AS A FORMER MEMBER OF SAVE THE SEED MINISTRY IN 1995-98, I AM FULLY AWARE OF THE MISREPRESENTATION OF THE PROGRAM. I CAME INTO THE PROGRAM WITH FAITH AND GREAT EXPECTATION OF THE WORK THAT THE PROGRAM WAS NOTED FOR. WHEN I LEFT THE PROGRAM, MY FAITH WAS SHATTERED AND I FOUND MYSELF ANGRY AT GOD ALLOWING THE THINGS THAT HAPPENED IN THE PROGRAM TO TAKE PLACE. I COULD NOT UNDERSTAND HOW GOD COULD ALLOW A MINISTER TO DO THE THINGS THAT WERE DONE. I AM SO GLAD THAT OTHERS HAVE GONE PUBLIC WITH THE MSIREPRESENTATION OF THE SAVE THE SEED MINISTRY WITH HOPES THAT SOMETHING WILL NOW BE DONE. IF IT HAD NOT BEEN FOR A FEW SINCERE PEOPLE INVOLVED WITH THE MINISTRY, I WOULD MORE THAN LIKELY STILL BE LOST. | ||
| Mary Thomas (205.188.116.211) |
Warning to All! Be careful of what you hear. People who dont understand or dont know the Lord are quick to slander His people. Judge the spirit by the spirit and don't let others make quick judgements for you. People are quick to lie but God's word is true. | ||
| Dianne McNair (64.12.116.66) |
I usually don't post opinions, but feel led to do it now. Anyone gleefully awaiting a "knife-cutting ceremony" will be disappointed with my comment, for it lends to the positive. First let me announce that I am a believer who became lax in my walk with Christ -- yet all the while a nagging spirit to "come back home to Christ" hovered over my every departure from "The Way." Then one Sunday I had an occasion to visit the Save the Seed Church in Waldorf, followed by a Kenneth Copeland Believers Conference with one of the Save the Seed ministers that same weekend. That visit began my turning point to rededicate my life and heart to Christ, and I did so publicly at the Copeland Believers Conference. Save the Seed preaches and teaches. After hearing The Word at Save the Seed and the Believers Conference, that "come back spirit" began to cut away the mindset of indifference and the disappointments in my world that allowed me to forget "Whose I Am" in the first place. I also was present at an after-church Save the Seed mentoring session which included an open discussion on internal matters. The members freely shared their concerns with their Pastor, and he responded in ways that put the matters to rest and did so with obvious love and care for his people. In Save the Seed Ministry there is a mission to lift up the lost and the wayward, and to strengthen the people in their knowledge of God and Christ. Don't be too swift to judge, lest ye yourselves be judged by same measure. Remember that David (in the Bible) was prone to certain sins, yet God said he was a "man after His (God's) own heart." Not only because he repented greatly, but also because he truly sought after God and wanted to please Him. He worshipped God in Spirit and in Truth. God knew the heart of the man David. And God CHOSE David. No apostle, pastor, prophet, evangelist, or teacher is called or chosen by man. God alone calls...deep calls unto deep. No one is perfect, says the Word of God. Yet, even when the Perfect One was among us -- He, too, was woefully slandered and worse done to Him at the hands of the Pharisees. So who are you, or you, or you, or me, to judge ANY man? God raises men and women up; and God blesses the work that they do. If they fail, as Saul did, then God will remove His favor from them. It is not our place to judge. We are not qualified. Thank you for the space to air my view. | ||
| Anonymous (151.196.172.245) |
I was just looking for the address of the church. I was shocked to find such slanderous comments. The testimony of the Freeman's and the Copeland's suggest to me that an anointing rest on these ministries.They both credit God alone for pulling them up from nothing and using them to bless the lives of others. Their track records speak louder than these accusations. Now I really look forward to visiting the church because The Word also says that satan is the accuser of the brethren. | ||
| Anonymous (152.163.252.129) |
Not all comments were slanderous. There are two messages above your comment that do not bring accusation. Those that do speak against anyone's work in the Kingdom should examine their hearts and ask the question: "What is your true motive?" | ||
| Robert Clifford (24.177.23.150) |
If you don't have nothing nice or a word of encourgement for the Save The Seed Ministry don't say nothing at all because you are judging your self, the ministry has helped many people and today I can say that the Save the Seed Ministry is a great place to worship, Dr.Shine & Dr.Dee Dee has done and will contiue to do what that Lord has told them to do and if you don't like oh well because GOD has the final say over EVERY THING! | ||
| Anonymous (64.83.38.63) |
To all of you who have comments concerning "Save the Seed, Ministry",let me tell you that it is a cult and they worship Dr. Shine. No one has truly been delivered for years under his worldly philosophy. Check the facts, the ministry does not have the anointing of God upon it because it is not propering, but how can it when they worship a man. Ask yourself the following: Why so much controversy? Why did they lose there building? Why do they beg for so much money as oppose to allowing God to speak to the peoples hearts' instead of being manipulated into giving what they do not have? Why are so many who were (supposedly) delivered back on drugs? Why did an assistant pastor tell the world about the adulterous Dr. Shine? The list could go on! If you have an ear the Spirit will speak the truth to you. Avoid Dr. Shine and his ministry at all cost. It will be fatal to your spiritual health. | ||
| Dianne McNair (205.188.117.20) |
I am writing to remind us that this Board is for the sharing of the experience people have had under this ministry. I am certain it should not be used to contact others who have posted their experience, and attack them for what they wrote. I had the displeasure of receiving several e-mails in which I was shown hostility, berated and disrespected because my post was different. In the very first e-mail I was called ignorant, stupid and a fool, and people like me allow Jim Jones types to flourish in their evil rule over their followers. The following e-mails also suggested that I was part of the Shine conspiracy, that the FBI would be notified of me and I would be jailed, that I should sleep with this minister (Dr. Shine), that I should shut up because I don't know what I am talking about, and then finally, I should get laid. Each time I responded saying that yes, my experience was different, but that I should not be attacked because of it. I never disputed what this writer or others have said about this church. Each returning e-mail from this writer was filled with insults, to the point I could tell the writer never really read my replies. When I was accused of being tied in with that church, I assured the writer that I was not, but I happened to have a chance to visit there with a friend 2 years ago. When I shared information about myself, and that I support my daughter's new church and am a supporting member of another church (where we all used to worship before she stepped into her ministry, as associate pastor first, then pastor). Guess what this writer wrote back? That they would make sure no one ever attended either one of the churches (I didn't even name them...how can the writer tell anyone not to attend if the name/address of the church was never given???). I was accused of showing no compassion or love, then they had the nerve to quote scripture (We will know them by their fruits). It's funny how people use scripture when it is convenient for them and serves their own purpose. I replied "What fruit did you show me in your first, 2nd, 3rd,4th,5th,6th and 7th e-mail??? And I reminded the writer of every insult given me in their e-mails. I stated that their FIRST e-mail opened up with name-calling and insults directed at me -- as if my story somehow offended them. Then I reminded the writer that every e-mail that followed was belligerant, disrespectful, presumptuous and insulting to me, personally. They could not stick to the topic, just focused on attacking my every response. The writer even taunted me asking if the same had happened to my daughter would I be one of those people who cry "Lawd, Lawd, and wait for Him to fix it." I replied what action I would have taken, and the writer wrote back "YAWNING." Then I asked "Who gave you permission to burst into my world uninvited and proceeded to hurl names and insults to me??? I wrote that I really thought this would be a healthy and enlightening exchange, since the writer took the liberty of contacting me about my comment on the Board. Instead, the whole exchange was so futile, fruitless, mean-spirited and the comments so senseless (I should sleep with that minister??!!)that it began to irritate and tire me. So, after the 7th sarcastic e-mail from this person, I responded to their sexual advice and other low-minded comments and told the person this would be the last round and "We R Done." Then I blocked the person from my e-mail so I cannot be contacted again. This episode took on the likeness of harrassment, so I filed the e-mails for future reference if ever needed. People, I have read with shock and dismay the experiences you have shared. Even though the experience that I had served me differently, I am truly shocked and saddened to read the other entries. Finally, if you take the liberty of contacting someone to disagree with them on a topic, do it with decency and order. | ||
| Dianne McNair (205.188.117.20) |
Because of my comment regarding a positive experience I had when I visited Save the Seed Church, I had the displeasure of receiving 12 -- yes, counted them -- TWELVE insulting e-mails from a woman who accused me of being part of a "Shine Conspiracy." She even suggested that I am sleeping with the minister, and called me a fool, ignorant, and stupid among many other insulting things. Each time I replied to her assumptions, she returned a hail of verbal attacks on my intelligence, my church affiliation (I am not a member of Save the Seed) and promised that she would see to it that no one attended either my church or the church my daughter now pastors. How intelligent a remark was that??? She doesn't even know the name/address of either church. She accused me of showing no compassion or love (for her???) I never had the chance to show any understanding. I was too busy catching her insults and trying to set the record straight regarding her very wrong assumptions about me. She even quoted scripture (We will know them by their fruits). I asked her what fruits did she show me in all 12 of her e-mails, and reminded her of the unkind, low-minded remarks and stones she threw at me in her e-mails. Funny how people are quick to quote scripture when it suits their purpose. I have revisited this site, only to be dismayed at the additional postings I saw. I do not dispute any of these reports, and my heart is saddened to learn of these things. But still, my experience happened to serve to my spiritual benefit -- I was at a point where I was ready to rededicate my life to Christ. Already know about Him. It was time to walk in what I know and seek that relationship with Him. You know...make Him REAL in my life. So between that visit and the Ken Copeland Believers Conference I made that step. And returned to MY Church. To be berated and insulted just because my experience had no grief??? Because I happened to see something positive on my visit? Because I gave a testimony??? Threatened with FBI investigation??? To say that I should "get...?" (you fill in the blank). I finally gave up. Filed the e-mails and BLOCKED her e-mails from coming to me anymore. If anyone would like to contact another person to agree or disagree, do it with decency and order. | ||
| Anonymous (68.50.91.198) |
Stop lying on that "Anonymous" person Dianne McNair. Regardless of what may have happened, it should not have taken please between you and this other person, you're being lower than they are by placing it in this public posting area. This space is regarding some serious issues with a cult leader, not for you to attack someone regarding their experiences (regardless of whether you had contact with them or not). It sounds like you have the problem, not this other individual. I don't see her talking about you.... Spend some time researching different issues before attacking someone or talking about someone. There are always two sides to every story. It seems to me, in my opinion, that you're simply upset because a minister whom you thought was real, wasn't and you're lashing out without knowing it. Check this site out and then think about it a little bit. http://www.gazette.net/200220/weekend/a_section/105333-1.html But please keep other readers out of your personal conflicts. If you are a prayerful person, then take it to God in prayer. Be mature about it, not deceitful. Thank you. | ||
| Dianne McNair (205.188.117.20) |
I am not lying on this Anonymous Person. I have the e-mails to prove it. You are probably the one I wrote about - guilty of stepping outside of protocol and sending the nasty e-mails. Rather than give more life to you and what YOU represent, I will just BIND UP AND CAST DOWN EVERY EVIL SPIRIT AND IMP SENT FROM HELL, IN THE NAME OF JESUS. You want me to keep others out of personal conflicts? I have no personal conflict. This person wanted to establish one. Once it was clear that no ground for reasoning could be found, I shut it down. Remind yourself that Satan does his work in the secrecy of darkness. God's people are people of light. Are you having a problem with someone's misdeeds being brought to light?? Don't try to protect or otherwise uphold what Anonymous did. It was wrong. Period. At least you had the sense to post a related comment on this board. It is a PUBLIC Board, and I will not be badgered by you or anyone for having a positive story to relate. Nor will I be pushed into silence when good words/works are trashed. Make this YOUR last effort to address me on any matter. YOU do not have the last word in life and its circumstances. Neither do I. emember, Every tongue that rises up against a believer, God will condemn. Remember also to judge NOT, lest ye be judged also by the same measure. | ||
| Dianne McNair (205.188.117.20) |
Lying?? I have the nasty e-mails to prove it. Where is your proof that I am lying?? If this is a PUBLIC message board, it did not say "Only Bad Reports Will Be Accepted." Although I've heard some things about this church, I just wanted to share a good experience. It was MY story and MY testimony. Weeks later, this "Anonymous Person" contacted me directly by my e-mail address and hurled 12 nasty e-mails at me because of it. Regarding me bringing Anonymous' actions to this Public Board -- Don't speak too quickly of maturity, for you yourself have just put yourself on this public page to challenge me about what happened with this person. So why did you contribute your opinion on it?? and Yes, I HAVE visited the webpages, already said I was shocked and saddened to read the reports. But it does not change the experience I had. As for your comment on being deceitful?? Satan does things in the secrecy of darkness. THAT is deceitful. I simply brought it to light. That is not deceitful, that is UP-FRONT and OUT THERE for you to see. What Anonymous did was WRONG. PERIOD. Had no right to shred my positive comments and toss them through my e-mail door. Their experience was not my experience, and no one can rewrite it. Why would you protect or otherwise uphold what that person did, then tell me I was lower because I brought it to light. True, Satan doesn't like to be uncovered in his works. So RIGHT NOW WHILE THE FLAME OF LIGHT IS BRIGHT, IN THE NAME OF JESUS I BIND UP AND CAST DOWN EVERY EVIL SPIRIT AND IMP SENT FROM HELL TO ACCUSE THE BODY OF CHRIST. "Every tongue that rises up against you (the believer) God will condemn." "Judge NOT, lest ye yourselves be judged by the same measure (which you used to judge another)" Whoever you are, leave it alone. This board was not meant to become a Dear Abby column with personal exchanges between the writers. Nor was it set up so that writers could send personal messages to each other about their comments. Nor was it meant to be used to contact other writers directly through e-mail to harrass them. THAT was the purpose of me telling what Anonymous did and to remind us all that this is not the purpose for this Board. The first time I typed in this entry, it went through but did not show up. So, to ensure that you know I saw and appreciate what you wrote, I am re-entering this. | ||
| Anonymous (68.50.91.198) |
The only demon that I see is Dianne McNair. Your scribble is all over this message board. Why you so upset and why you got so much time to type all of that stuff? Sounds like you allowed the devil to set you up and you fell for it just like you fell for Robert "Shine" Freeman. I admire Anonymous' courage for sharing her experience and to be able to warn others with proof of evidence from a public newspaper that the facts are true. She is standing regardless of your outrageous burst of rage and stupidity. If you don't stand for something, then you will fall for anything. Like you just did. You're the only one that is demonically manifesting on this message board. I'm glad she wrote it and I'm taking her advice seriously! Thank you Anonymous! | ||
| Dianne McNair (205.188.117.20) |
Foolish people! I'm not complaining about the story Anonymous wrote, my complaint is with the intrusion into my e-mail by someone who disrespected my experience at that church. You who cannot see that, are unwilling to direct your attention to the unwanted e-mail from that person -- whoever it is. You are not worth my further efforts to point to the unkindness of those E-MAILS. I AM NOT DISPUTING HER STORY, NEVER DID. I took issue with her unkind gesture to me because I shared my experience. You keep missing that. You are looking for a fire to burn, but I am not your wood. The demons are within you, and I will have no further communication with those of you who want twist the focus and ignore the fact that one of your own is at fault. I DO TAKE A STAND, DID, AND ALWAYS WILL. Your convoluted theory does not wax. To find fault in a victim of nasty e-mail who let it be known is totally ludicrous. You are the one who is stupid - you keep missing the point. You just don't get it. SOMEONE ALREADY SAID THIS BOARD IS NOT FOR THIS TYPE OF ACTIVITY, SO WHY ARE YOU CONTINUING THE SAGA??? I'M NOT A STAR, SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO KEEP ME ON THE MARQUEE. OH...YOU ASK HOW IS IT THAT I HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO CHECK THE INTERNET AND THIS BOARD? NOT YOUR BUSINESS. I COULD ASK YOU THE SAME QUESTION. BUT I HAPPEN NOT TO CARE WHY YOU HAVE SO MUCH INPUT ON A MATTER YOU WERE NOT INVOLVED IN IN THE FIRST PLACE. BYE...... | ||
| Anonymous (152.163.242.212) |
I'm new in the area and was looking at church websites so I can visit some of them. Seeing this webpage lets me know that I will not visit this church. Not only because of what was said about the preacher. It's the vicious words I saw from some of the members that will keep me away. All that ugly talk about some lady who wrote a testimony and got a bad e-mail? If the devil is in the pulpit, he sure has enough devils in his congregation to keep him ompany. | ||
| Anonymous (64.12.116.66) |
I'm new in the area and was looking at church websites so I can visit some of them. Seeing this webpage let me know that I will not be visiting this church. Not only because of what I saw about the preacher. That was bad enough. It's the vicious words from some of the members that will keep me away. All because some lady wrote a testimony and said she got a bad e-mail? I did see her testimony. Looks like she shared it with the wrong people. If the devil is in the pulpit at this church, he sure has enough devils in his congregation to keep him company. | ||
| Anonymous (64.12.116.66) |
where is the ministry located? | ||
| John McKinley (138.88.119.135) |
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting." (Galatians 6:9-10) Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron" (I Timothy 4:1-2) "For the Love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. (I Timothy 6:10) "This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves,...Traitors, heady, high-minded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth." See II Timothy 3) My name is John McKinley. I graduated from Save the Seed Ministry and stayed there as a leader within the men’s' ministry for over two years. I was weary of the name-it-and-claim-it gospel that was preached, but I loved the men and residents who came seeking help from God. I made it a point to be a light shining in a dark place. I used to assume that Shine was a good businessman that preached as a hobby. I found out that he was not a good businessman at all and certainly not a student of scripture. I have never heard Shine preach a hermeneutically sound message. He had no idea how to exegete the message that God revealed in scripture, but he certainly knew how to use the scripture to convince people to give in to his plans and desires. He used seduction to convince the congregation to give exuberant amounts of money to buy his and his wife's suits and shoes, Cadillac, camera and music equipment. He seduced the mines of the men making empty promises of prosperity and shared wealth in exchange for slave labor. Some of the men (and women) in the ministry worked as much as 120 hours a week (really!!!). Men were bussed across the country to work 12 hours a day/7 days a week. For what? Food was donated. Beds were built out of planks and 2x4's by a carpenter within the ministry with used wood. There were many fire code violations, insects, lice, health code violations, etc. Men were transported around town to jobsites in unsafe vehicles (one young man was killed in a van accident with Shine's son at the wheel). Rumors of promiscuity permeated almost every conversation in the dorms. Yes, there are some serious problems with Shine Freeman and his followers, but God did work in the lives of many men that endured and came seeking God and deliverance, including me. God used Samson, but Samson's lust and disobedience cost him gravely. God used David, but the house of David never knew true peace. Pray for Shine and those who follow him. Pray for all those who are deceived to follow "another gospel". Paul warned us about false doctrine, false prophets and false teachers throughout the New Testament. Heed the warnings of God's Word. Live by His Word and leave the judgment and punishment of sin in God's hands. John T. McKinley Blessed_of_god2003c@yahoo.com | ||
| Bb in SC (66.192.63.5) |
I've read all the entries regarding Dr. Shine and the church and much of it is saddening. I've never been to the church and have just recently heard of Dr. Shine, so I'm very impartial. Prayer is the greatest weapon we as believers have. Those of you that feel you've been used by the ministry, pray for Dr. Shine. Those of you attacked during for your comments, pray for the attackers. We are all the body of Christ - regardless if we see eye to eye on any situation. And, if there are those that disagree with my solution, take it up with the author, God "our" Father. | ||
| Tia Titus (205.188.117.20) |
I am appalled about what I have read. All I know is that Dr. Shine and Dr. Dee Dee are my "Spiritual Father and Mother. Without them I would not have known how to even Praise God let alone search the scriptures for myself when I am going through something. Just face it, whomever came through the "Save the Seed" Ministry has the spirit of Dr. Shine and Dr. Dee Dee whether they want to admit it or not. Without their vision a lot of you would not be where you are today. For the record, God is the One that has to get the Glory for that! And know this too...What the devil meant for bad, God (turned) it into Good! Let's pray for another like the Bible says to rather than tearing one another down. People, these are the last days. Don't take it lightly, can't you see that you are playing right into the devil arms with all of that nonsense! | ||
| Anonymous (24.177.23.150) |
Ii tell u the truth u people don't make no sences not one bet all u can do is get on internet and talk about a man that u barly really know, i know the man personally and i think he is really a GREAT MAN OF GOd.Like I said Before if u don't have any postive or a encouraging word don't say any thing at all. I know for my self how the ministry is and the person who started this web page should be a shamed because if it wasen't for Dr.Shine and Dr. Dee Dee Roy Bowman would not have his family today so keep your mouth close. If only if you knew the where this man came from having nothing to having what GOD said he could have. The bible say's keep your mouth off the man of God so do it before the LORD DElll with ALL OF YOU | ||
| Anonymous (152.163.253.102) |
To Tia Titus, I was scrolling through when noticed your remark about a spiritual father and mother. FYI, did Jesus himself not say in Matthew 23:9 "And call no man your father upon earth, for one is your which is in heaven." Just some advice. This makes reference to a spiritual father which is God, and if we give that credit to any one else we upset God. You may be bringing a curse upon this man yourself by trying to share Gods glory with him. I am not doubting your salvation, in fact I believe you are saved, ask yourself the question who saved me? | ||
| Anonymous (68.157.139.194) |
My Heavens!! In doing research on religious organizations/churches, I ran across this. After reading all of the comments, I am disgusted by the idiocy of some of the writers calling others "demons." That these people could place judgment on another is unGodly - for only God will judge all of us. The attackers themselves are demonic, for they attack others without cause or basis. You all are the reason the world laughs at the church, and want no part of "christian experience." You don't represent well at all. | ||
| Anonymous (152.163.253.102) |
In the name of Jesus, for all that are wounded, I speak healing, In the name of Jesus, for all that are bitter, I speak healing, Dearest Father, in the name of Jesus, please help your people, send laborers to educate and admonish. Your will, will be done concerning every area, every aspect of all that concerns your people. In Jesus, Mighty, Name. Amen. | ||
| Diane (152.163.253.102) |
If Kenneth Copeland has anything to do with the ministry of the people sponsoring the minister, you had better watch your wallet. Kenneth Copeland has created a money making machine by giving Christian uplifting in their nature man by teaching incorrect doctrine and feeding to the flesh and the world and doing so in the name of Jesus. I have never heard of this ministry, yet the name implies it is part of Word of Faith and that ministry is not about teaching good sound doctrine. The word of Faith movement is about prosperity, name it and claim it, positive confessions, and everything Jesus and Paul did not teach. http://www.letusreason.org/Wf28.htm http://www.letusreason.org/Wf22.htm http://www.letusreason.org/Wf2.htm http://www.hbcdelivers.org/wfheresy.htm | ||
| tracieb (63.111.0.150) |
this is to clarify what the save the seed ministry is all about. my husband was a member of the 'rehabilitation ministry. the only thing that they do is shove religion down their throats 12-14 hours a day. they work them like dogs and all the wages go to 'dr shine', robert freeman the founder.robert freeman has a 850,00 dollar judgement against him for money. he has had several affairs with wives of the members of his flock. but,with all of this, he has just purchased a new jet!!! robert freeman is a worshipper of money and is ysing those who turn to him for help for his own financial gain. as of this writing, i have removed my man from his clutches.he is doing wonderfully in a program called teen challenge, also bible based, but doing it fir the good of the lord. | ||
| Anonymous (24.177.23.150) |
Boy i tell u u people just wont leave him alone, but it's all good because what u do to other it will happen to u but I just telling u need to go see him and talk to him about what really happen stop all this talking over the internet like a bunch of old women boy maybe u may get delivered one day | ||
| Anonymous (68.49.190.144) |
Deron Cloud and Robert Freeman were homosexual lovers in real life and have come up with a false doctrinal teaching of hatred against all females to cover up their homosexuality. Robert Freeman has been seen by our inside sources to perform rituals of voodoo by digging graves and killing chickens (by decapitating their heads) and performing séances in order to know what goes on in the personal lives and closets of other individuals. Robert Freeman then gets into the pulpit afterwards and deceives the congregation into believing that God talks to him only (of course) and loudly lies and yells across the sanctuary what was revealed to him in the séances in order to scare and deceive the congregation into believing in him. He is also deceived into believing that he is Moses and is the only prophet on earth that God talks to and that no one is to follow God, but to follow Robert “Shine” Freeman only. Robert Freeman is also known for having sexual relations with different female members of his ministry as well. He also declares death upon anyone who tells anyone what he does behind closed doors. Robert Freeman also curses anyone who stands in his way of destroying anyone by saying, "I cast you into the seven seas." This terminology is not biblical and is a voodoo hoodoo hexing term used in rootworking and crossworking rituals that are designed to destroy others. Robert Freeman was publicly destroying a young lady whom he lied and threatened before his congregation regarding a date rape in which a former minister of Save the Seed named Reginald Jones was responsible for. Robert Freeman lied to cover Reginald Jones date rape incident. Robert Freeman was rebuked by another minister before his congregation for threatening to stalk and kill the young lady and that he would know of every man that she dated (whether it was in his church or outside of his church). This young lady was devastated for she was not a member of his church, but visited from time to time to donate clothing and hygiene products. This young lady simply went to his wife (Claudette "Dee Dee" Freeman) for prayer and was attacked! Robert Freeman then went into a rage about being rebuked by God for lying on this young lady before the congregation, for giving away her personal information and prayer requests and faultfinding for he accused the girl of being a witch and a whore and that she was taking men in and out of her bedroom when this young lady practiced sexual abstinence for seven years and had not had any male companionship in her house during that time. This young lady then found out that a jealous pastor who practices witchcraft named Carmen Lattimore told the young man to date rape her and dump her for the young lady was making the promiscuous women in her church look bad and that she wanted to marry him to Dionne Camp who was a member of her church. Reginald Jones went along with the plot and tried to put this young lady in a predictament. So in order to cover up the plot, Robert Freeman went into a rage and yelled that he would kill this young lady if it's the last thing that he does because he is God and nobody rebukes him and shows him up ever! This outburst was simply to fool the congregation into thinking that the young lady was at fault when she wasn't. Reginald Jones lied to the young lady and told her that he was ready to settle down. Robert Freeman then proceeded to stalk the young lady after she left his ministry. This lady is horrified at the rituals, rootworkings, cursings and destructive powers that attacked her mind after these lies were told to 300 men. Robert Freeman continuously cursed any man from marrying her and kept finding out where she was living and working even though this young lady moved across the country. Afterwards one of Save the Seed's ministers and one of their vans was spotted circling around the young lady's apartment building where she had moved into across the country. After a couple of days of this activity, this young lady spotted them and called the police. Robert Freeman is a modern day "Jim Jones" and will destroy anyone who doesn't worship him instead of God and he is to be avoided at all cost! He will pay for the hurt and catastrophes that he has conjured in the lives of innocent people who will not allow their minds to be controlled by him. DO NOT GIVE MONEY at all toward this cult! Robert Freeman is a jealous, ungrateful ingrate! We're not being negative, we're just keeping it real! Check out the following newspaper report regarding validity: http://www.gazette.net/200220/weekend/a_section/105333-1.html | ||
| lynn125 (lynn125) New member Username: lynn125 Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.92.146.154 |
Don't know if this thread is dead, but I found this site after trying to inform Dr. Shine, (where'd he get that name from anyway?) about him and his "ministry" being in serious risk for a copy right lawsuit for using the logo and scenes from the movie,"Top Gun" in their tv broadcast. From this tread and the fact that the person that answered their 888-number was truely uninterested, let me know this was truely not a major concern for Dr. Shine. For those who are in the "Prosperity or Word/Faith" doctrine: (1) The bible in its totallity and not just the parts that suit our opinion is right and can only be the true instruction in our lives. (2) Read Matt. 7:21,22,23 & Matt. 7:15-20. | ||
| joynoel (joynoel) New member Username: joynoel Post Number: 1 Registered: 6-2005 Posted From: 138.88.142.41 |
I had the privilege(?) of attending the Save the Seed ministry in the deliverence program. I had heard none of the terrible rumors about Dr. Shine and Save the Seed before I arrived. I had planned to go to "the seed" to get a basic 'oil change'. You know, freshen up after being on a run and come out to jump back in my life with a little weight on me, no habit and feeling a bit better. That is not at all what happened. I arrived with my many bags and my attitude in tow. They owed me something - just like the rest of the world did. But they were time enough for me. It was like they had seen me before. They were ready for every trick and scheme I tried to come up with. What I did not expect was that Dr. Shine and Save the Seed would actually place me back on track. That my life would get better just because I went there and learned to rely wholly on God. The faith and deliverence ministry that is run by Save the Seed may have some 'cultish' behaviors and I am sure if I look back, I could point some out. But the people that they take in, try to nourish - both physically and spiritually - usually do not END UP at Save the Seed until they are beaten up and beat down. I personally had burned all bridges to my family, my friends and my future. I needed some good ole fashion discipline to get me to be able to start thinking clearly. I was delivered 4 years ago, with the guidance and help of Save the Seed and Dr. Shine, who I will never forget, and thank Him for sending me there. I have not waivered from my path and continue to walk in faith. I am not promiscuous (anymore), I do not get high (anymore), I do not steal, lie, cheat, (anymore) and I did all that before I ENDED UP at Save the Seed. Best of all, I have a working relationship with God, one that I can understand and feel comfort in. It was an awesome experience, and the last buffer between me and going back to the way I used to live. I always say that I cannot go back because I would have to go to Save the Seed again, and I never want to have to go back there. It was tough, which is what I needed. There were some things that I saw there, however, that did not sit right with me. They do work the men, hard. But hard work is good for the soul, and anything good for the soul is what we all needed in the seed. The food is second rate, but probably the best food I had eaten in a while, and I know it was the most consistent. The beds were not real comfortable, but then if they were, I may still be there. I did get jealous when I saw someone go to the pastor's offices with fast food or something, but it just gave me determination. Pastor Shine does ask for a lot of money from his congregation, but he also takes in anybody that comes knocking and helps those (like me) that thought there was no help for. If you want to find the bad in someone, you can. There is not 100% good in any of us. But if you want to find the good, if you look at Pastor Shine and Seed, it is there. I know. I got it. Thanks - Shine and the Seed. And thank you all who have written about the bad things that have gone on with him and his ministry, it strengthens my resolve not to want to go back, even though I know that the doors would always be open if I did. | ||
| nae (nae) New member Username: nae Post Number: 1 Registered: 6-2005 Posted From: 170.22.76.10 |
I am a little shocked by some of the stuff I read today. God said touch not my anointed... so I keep my mouth off the man of God regardless of their condition or mine. Like me, Some of you got issues that you need to seek God about. Don't lash out and damage others. We are all a work in progress. I am a member of Save The Seed and I do worship God and not man. God ain't raising me to be no fool. God sent me to Save the Seed to learn ... I do exactly that. I've been there since 7/16/2003 and thank God my focus is on the Word just like God said for me to do. I believe Dr Shine & Dr Dee Dee are the Man and Woman God choose to use teach me. I don't care what you all say about them nor what you may say or think about me. I am not ashame of the Gospel of Christ delivered by Dr. Shine & Dr. Dee Dee, nor Kenneth Copeland. If anyone have a problem with the people God chose to use, take it to the face of God or Shut up. My name is Renee Thompson and I am a Frontline Warrior in training by the Holy Spirit(my personal trainer). God calls me blessed, Jesus calls me friend. No one calls me "anonymous". (Message edited by nae on June 25, 2005) | ||
| cocoa (cocoa) New member Username: cocoa Post Number: 1 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.46.0.226 |
Well, I see that people are beginning to come forward and tell the TRUTH about Carmen Lattimore! My name is Cocoa Love. (For real). I am a law student who attends law school in Maryland. I also am a major in journalism and I, me, I decided to write the article about satanic cults and interviewed quite a few individuals who have been wounded by these false prophets and their falsehoods. Carmen Lattimore is the head of all LIES and she went to every minister listed on this page and lied on someone who is very special that she's jealous of. Carmen Lattimore has had about 20 bishops reside over her and what she does is so evil, that Satan is even taking notes! Carmen Lattimore runs to this bishop to cover her church and that bishop because she is under so much judgment and torment that she can't even see straight! Once she sees that she can't manipulate a particular bishop to let her perform evil deeds on others, then she runs and finds another bishop to cover her. When she sees that she can't seduce that bishop, then she runs and finds another one, and on, and on, and on on and on! Carmen begs for relief from the darkness that she's in and she's in it for hurting and accusing other people all the time about being a witch when she doesn't even know what she's talking about! Carmen Lattimore can't stand true love! She manifests all sorts of distorted lies about you and runs and tells people all kinds of fabricated crap! Carolyn Gaymon, Wynetta Green, Cynthia Brazelton, Claudette Freeman are all Carmen's fools and have joined her in her satanic devices. This occultic organization believes in sacrificing prosperous souls to satan (thinking) that this will bring them prosperity. IT'S ALL HOCUS POCUS! Up and coming ministries huh? The same people that you screwed on the way to the top are the same ones you are going to meet on the way down. Believe me, you will not prosper and you will always beg for what someone else has. ALWAYS! The problem is that all of these ministers have been slapped in the face so hard by The Almighty about touching children, stealing, killing and destroying, that they don't even have their own identity anymore! So they have to pretend, emulate, chant, perform rituals and false sacrifices just to get a buck! Remember, vultures of a feather flock together. It's a shame how these false leaders don't give a crap about what they do to innocent, sincere individuals. They don't care! They are just tryin to make a buck! Remember, Satan is the REJECTED ONE! If any of these leaders were favored by The Almighty at all, they wouldn't be thinking about nobody else! It's all true. It's hard to believe, but it's true. I've interviewed too many individuals who have fallen prey to the schemes of these false ministers. So let them continue to trample on babies and children to become famous for that's all they think about. And once they get there, watch what happens. Zeal without knowledge will get you no where. ~Cocoa~ | ||
| miracle1 (miracle1) New member Username: miracle1 Post Number: 3 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 205.188.117.13 |
What is the name of this Carmen Lattimore's ministry and what are there website addresses? I never heard of her or even Carolyn Gaymon and Wynetta Green. Just curious, thanks. | ||
| clintonmyman (clintonmyman) New member Username: clintonmyman Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 70.106.24.162 |
Oh my God! I have a loved one in this ministry and I was so relieved that he had found hope and such an excitement for the Lord. I am sad all over again now that he may fall prey to yet another disappointment that could spiral him back into the world of drug addiction. Please just pray with me that God is in charge of all of this and he see's all that is going on and if we pray ferverantly and without ceasing he will see the heart's of the souls at Save the Seed ministry and make it plain to them what is of man and what is truly of God . I want to ask you all to pray daily for this ministry that it can be of Glory to our father. Thank you Trusting in God | ||
| clintonmyman (clintonmyman) New member Username: clintonmyman Post Number: 2 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 70.106.23.125 |
Mr John T. McKinley, Could you please e-mail me at divatheeva@yahoo.com, I could not get a message to you at Blessed of god2003c@yahoo.com. I truly need your advice and help. Thank you so much in advance. Clintonmyman | ||
| saywhat New member Username: saywhat Post Number: 13 Registered: 4-2006 Posted From: 12.42.180.130 |
Hello all. I thank you so very much for your support. Over the past few years, I believe that God has been trying to remove false ministries, cults, and occults from being in operation so that our communities can be protected. One of those ministries which has done much harm to our communities, and especially harm to women was Save The Seed Ministries, International, located in Waldorf, Maryland. This so-called outreach ministry is headed by Dr. Robert "Shine" Freeman and Claudette "Dee Dee" Freeman. Thanks to the Charles County police department, the ministry was closed. Robert and Claudette Freeman are trying to start a new ministry (which is causing problems in the lives of innocent people) again. This time he's going under the guise of Seed Faith International which is located in Waldorf, Maryland in Prince George's County. This man and woman are not real ministers, but are frauds. Robert Freeman stalks women, and believes that women are not to have money, education nor freedom. He loves to cause disasters and to perform rituals of witchcraft gimmicks. He hates women. PLEASE DO NOT SUPPORT THIS MINISTRY MONETARILY OR IN ANY WAY! Robert Freeman seduces people into believing that he is an outreach minister so that he can get donations and run to Las Vegas and spend it all. He is only using these poor souls who are looking for shelter and support as guinea pigs. He is also in a deception of thinking that he is God. Robert Freeman is a thug and this ministry is a scam. | ||
| saywhat New member Username: saywhat Post Number: 16 Registered: 4-2006 Posted From: 76.243.135.211 |
Hello readers! I was informed that Save The Seed International which was shut down by the St. Charles Police Department in Waldorf, MD has started another ministry in a different county, but same city as Waldorf, MD by the name of Seed Faith International Ministries. The following is the webpage of so-called Dr. Robert "Shine" Freeman who has been known to be a sexual predator by stalking women for a long time. Once you have the webpage up, click into the "View My Guestbook" which is located on the upper left hand corner of the page. Afterwards,..., you figure it out! http://www.blackplanet.com/SAVE_THE_SEED/ | ||
| saywhat New member Username: saywhat Post Number: 17 Registered: 4-2006 Posted From: 76.243.135.211 |
Oh by the way readers, please note, that Robert "Shine" Freeman knows that this webpage is up on the internet, and he can kindly request that it be removed due to fraudulence, in which he hasn't. Another thing is that, once other christians learn of church or christian websites or webpages, they always want to drop a note and say hello, for that's the nature of christians. Why aren't there any christian posts? It seems that there may have been, but he removed them because he only wants to see naked women. These types of pics are never posted on a ministry or church website, so what's the deal yo? Robert "Shine" Freeman bka Jim Jones the second has lost his mind! Please check out the following and once you have this ministry's webpage up, click on "View My Guestbook" in the upper left hand corner. Afterwards, well..., you go figure. http://www.blackplanet.com/SAVE_THE_SEED/ | ||
| jazz5s New member Username: jazz5s Post Number: 1 Registered: 12-2007 Posted From: 71.206.41.250 |
Hello Readers, It is so amazing to me how quickly we can speak about all the negative things we see. I have been to the Save the Seed Ministry and have seen 5 people come through the ministry with changed lives. To date, all of them are doing well. The wheat and the tare must grow together. The scriptures say (Matt 13:30) " Let the wheat and the tare grow together until the harvest time". Dr Shine has done what "The Church" has not done. He has attempted to help the sick and the shut-in, mostly, without the support of the church. Whenever we do good in Christ, it is always seen as evil. Because we have been a generation that lack wisdom and vision to view the Body of Christ as a whole and not in pieces. Jesus did warn us of the persecution that will come. You solidify the ministry that has taken place there through changed lives. I am not saying anyone of us is perfect but we should all strive towards perfection as Christ, Himself. Pray to the Lord of the harvest to watch over the work at hand. God will use only those who want to be used to His glory. Get your hands busy to not simply speak about what you do not like but make a difference in your hands working. Faith without works is dead. Beware of those that call Good Evil and Evil Good. You create an evil spin off of venomous poison that filtrates the Body of Christ as a whole! Use wisdom, the fear of the Lord, that is the beginning. Be slow to speak and quick to listen to the Holy Spirit bear witness to what the Father want to accomplish in the Earth in the last days. Grow up Body. If we continue on this path, we delay the manifestation of the sons of God. The enemy is having a field day. He is sitting back watching the church destroy itself. The very "church" that Jesus said the gates of Hell would not prevail against it. Shame on us. "Lord have mercy on us. Let not our enemy triumph over us in our lack of knowledge to know You, Your purpose in the earth and Your plan". In Jesus name I pray, Amen. |
