My final goodbye here

Thread Last Poster Posts Pages Last Post Carman and lawsuits. baloney 1  1  9-27-07  1:43 am   Start New Thread

Author Message   wingsaglow Junior Member Username: wingsaglow Post Number: 30 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 71.213.141.244 Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 12:23 am:        I have stood up for many here, and no we are all not perfect. I will still always hope the best for Carman, and everyone else too. Even to a Zebra and others who have liked putting others down just for standing up for Carman. No we are all not babies in the Lord Geesh! and I sure don't worhsip the man at his feet like many others do. I do however like his music, and still will and ya all can't change my musical likes to even my dislikes. So without ever looking back here again. My you each find your own peace of mind instead of idle gossip.... to which new sin he committed on TV, but ahhh if the celebrity in question came to yer church ya all would not be just sittin there starin at yer Holy word Bible. You too would be sneaking those heavenly peaks right at her end zone, cause if ya didn't look ya just might not be a real man. Every man I have ever known as best friends even always enjoyed God's beautiful creations when they'd walk by even the pastors too lol... Go figure.......   zebra New member Username: zebra Post Number: 2 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.192.253.79 Posted on Monday, September 10, 2007 - 7:43 pm:        Wingsaglow: It is my hope that this is your final goodbye here. However, I know you will never read and respond to this post because you will never come back to Factnet. (smile) I must say that I have gotten a few chuckles from some of the things you have posted on Factnet. I really enjoyed the dreams you mentioned in some of your posts. They were very telling. I leave the following thought with you: " If you would spend more time judging yourself then you would have less time to judge others." Zebra   carle New member Username: carle Post Number: 3 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 172.135.22.121 Posted on Tuesday, September 11, 2007 - 5:15 pm:        Zebra I am soooo tired of your postings. All you do is put down C and all his supporters. I have known C for over twenty five years and he has helped me so much. I have supported him and his work for many years and will continue to do so. Why don't you go away. Leave the supporters of C alone. He had done many marvelous works for mankind and will continue to do so. He has given more to this world than any other person who has ever lived. So please, Crafty, 3J, V and I ask you to stop doing what you are doing.   zebra New member Username: zebra Post Number: 3 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.194.45.138 Posted on Wednesday, September 12, 2007 - 12:14 pm:        Carle: You stated in your above Post # 3 the following: " He has done many marvelous works for mankind and will continue to do so." "He has given more to this world than any other person who has ever lived." Please list some of the marvelous works he has done for mankind. You may use more than one posting to answer this question. (smile) _________________________________________________ Answer this for me. "What does a person from Texas and a person from California and a person from Tennessee and a person from Pennsylvania all have in common?" There can be more than one answer. Zebra   matt_hatter Intermediate Member Username: matt_hatter Post Number: 423 Registered: 5-2006 Posted From: 24.214.93.12 Posted on Wednesday, September 12, 2007 - 5:39 pm:        They all want to marry Carman???   zebra New member Username: zebra Post Number: 4 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.129.127.26 Posted on Wednesday, September 12, 2007 - 6:29 pm:        Matt_hatter: Excellent answer. Don't you agree girls? One of many. Your wisdom reaches beyond your years. Perhaps other answers will be forthcoming. Zebra   newlife New member Username: newlife Post Number: 1 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 67.72.98.94 Posted on Wednesday, September 12, 2007 - 7:17 pm:        oooh i wanna play tu...can i? OKAY, here's my question... What does a person from Mississippi have in common with Alabama, Tennesse, Florida, Michigan, California, and Washington State? http://www.visitmississippi.org/retire/columbus.htm   carle Junior Member Username: carle Post Number: 50 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 172.163.130.110 Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2007 - 11:31 pm:        Zebra STOP IT!!!!!!! You have said enough. I am soooo tired of your dumb... questions and statements. Why don't you try uplifting others rather than tearing them down? Why don't we see a little compassion in your statements rather than the garbage we see in them? I don't have time for this. It is getting very old and you should stop before it comes back to haunt you. So, for the sake of our sanity please go away. Carole   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 275 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.190.208.121 Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2007 - 10:52 pm:        Carle or Carole or whatever name you are going by now: I sense a bit of bitterness in your tone. Please try and get control of yourself. It's not good for one to get all bent out of shape. You might try spending a little more time uplifting others rather than tearing them down. But then it wouldn't be you would it? Why does MM and his Ministry bug you so much? Is it because you feel that MM is in competition with your leader. You should be praying for his Ministry rather than trying to tear it down. Why does Factnet bug you so much? Is it because it brings conviction to your heart? You should be praying for Factnet not sending in emails stating that you were praying that it would shut down. Also, not only you but the others in your gang from the paid-chat site. Conviction will always bring misery. That misery will remail until there is a repentance. Now go and consider these words. Zebra   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 276 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.162.166.34 Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 7:12 pm:        Carle: Perhaps some sort of answer can be found in what makes you tick in one of your earlier postings on Factnet. I believe you were posting under the name of "Rooted & Grounded" at the time. In one dated Oct. 24, 2004 you stated the following: "I grew up on Carman's music. I loved it because it reinforced what I heard all those years "under the pews." Maybe with a contemporary twist, but it still screamed Jesus. When I witnessed the Michael Jackson moonwalk imitation, heard him sing like Willie Nelson, or watched him do the Ricky Martin dance, all of those things are just signatures of Carman. None of them make me want to get my face reconstructed, wear my hair in a braid, or storm the stage like a hormonal teenager. I'm sorry, but I see way past all of that. Those things make me laugh, the words and music stir my heart. I'm quite certain they do the same thing for the majority of the people. All these years it's been about Jesus. He's never taken Jesus out, and I'm sure he never will. Carman's call is not yours or mine. I'm positive there is no decision made that is not done prayerfully. I don't have the resources nor the capability to do what he's done for the Lord. He's used his gifts and talents soley for the Lord, which cannot be said for many crossover artists that have spent much of their career atop a fence with one foot dangling on either side. Carman's real. His message is real. His message reaches down into the hearts and souls of every generation and denomination. That's good enough for me." Well, Carle, that's good enough for me. Zebra   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 277 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.192.73.229 Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 11:32 pm:        Carle: Perhaps you need to listen to some of your own words that you have posted in the past. On Oct. 20, 2004 you posted under the name Rooted & Grounded on Factnet. Below is a portion of what you posted: "Noone has the right to simply "shoot off their mouth" about things of which they have no knowledge, simply out of anger or because they feel "wronged." I think I could correctly say that anytime Carman or anyone else in authority admonished anyone for actions or words, it was required."... "The trouble is that anyone can say anything they want with no accountability. Yet, they want others to be accountable to them. I think the time has come for folks to close their mouths and bridle their tongues and allow God to be God once again." Well, Carle, that's good enough for me. Zebra   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 278 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.163.227.251 Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 7:17 pm:        Carle: On March 29, 2004, one Anonymous posted the following on Factnet concerning C. Carle, do you not agree with this posting? _________________________________________________ Author Message Anonymous (198.81.26.106) Posted on Monday, March 29, 2004 - 5:07 pm: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I am conviced that this ministry is a cult. Carman is a controller. He is very charismatic. But beyond that he is deceptive and manipulative. He message usually points to him rather that to Jesus. He is very selfish and self-centered. He seems to have a "savior complex." The "members only" chatroom is nearly 100% women. Most of them are wounded, on medications, in or from broken relationships. They are looking for Jesus, but they are buying/selling Carman. They are idolizing him and he is encouraging it. When "healthier" members leave, the management "spies" on them. The management contacts other members and inquires about any contact with the member(s) who have left. Carman's mother fabricated a lust relationship over Sean Connery who is married. Carman did not put an end to this. I believe that his mother did this in order to be "like one of the girls" in the chatroom. I believe Carman ministry is in stage 4/5 of the progressive stages of a cult. If anyone questions the acivity in the room there is quick manipulation and/or Carman's mother gets rid of the person bringing truth to light. _________________________________________________ Zebra   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 279 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.192.115.130 Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2007 - 1:01 am:        Carle: Another poster to Factnet by the name of Hooper4evr posted the following some days ago. Do you agree with what they said in their post? ________________________________________________ Zebra Why cant we all just get along. U seem to always be causing trouble for the girls from Cs site. Why. U keep asking questions what are you lookin for. I was a member of the Cs site a long time ago and I got a lot from it. The people was good to me and Im sorry I had to go. So leave the girls alone they haven't done anything to you. Hooper4evr _________________________________________________ Zebra   hooper4evr New member Username: hooper4evr Post Number: 4 Registered: 11-2006 Posted From: 172.164.32.193 Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2007 - 6:51 pm:        Zebra I don't understand you at all. U keep posting things and asking Carle what she thinks about posts. Why are U doing this. Has she said something that offends u. Or do u just like bothering people. Come clean now. Who are u and why are u doing what u do. The girls from the Cs site have been dedicated to Carman. They have supported him for a long time. What have they done to U. Tell us who u are and what u are up to. Hooper4evr   revelation New member Username: revelation Post Number: 12 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 72.187.188.222 Posted on Monday, September 24, 2007 - 1:18 am:        They have Jesus in common.   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 280 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.193.51.78 Posted on Monday, September 24, 2007 - 11:37 pm:        Revelation: Perhaps at times they do. Remember this short poem please: Patience with others is love Patience with self is hope Patience with God is faith _________________________________________________ Hooper4evr: In response to your quote in my post # 279, where you stated the following: "I was a member of the Cs site a long time ago and I got a lot from it." All I can say is yessss, you got a lot from it. Especially from a couple of the girls from the paid-chat site. (smile) In response to your post # 4, where you ask who I am. I will say the following: I am only a voice of one crying in the wilderness. Trying to warn those who would speak one way and live another. This always brings conviction to the persons heart. And conviction will bring unrest and misery. One cannot serve two masters. _________________________________________________ Carle: Taken from your post as Rooted & Grounded posted on Factnet Oct. 24, 2004, you stated the following concerning your leader: "All these years it's been about Jesus. He's never taken Jesus out, and I'm sure he never will." "I'm positive there is no decision made that is not done prayerfully." "He's used his gifts and talents soley for the Lord"... "Carman's real. His message is real." _________________________________________________ Well, Carle, that's good enough for me. Dream on! Zebra   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 4 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 72.254.156.189 Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:05 am:        should we, should he, be concerned that he has an absence of a normal ministerial sense of a certain kind of morality and spirituality compass - when it comes to the New Testament and how "God defines and mandates", (with His help and a lot of grace) that we are to live and to be an example. not to mention how to worship and bless Him and be His lights to the dark world we live in? didn't see the tbn program with beyonce's "pastor", but if carman is in fact advocating her in anyway he is being irresponsible or blind, even abusive to the minds and hearts of young people, that's for sure. he seems to know better than this, or he doesn't do his homework, or he and the people at tbn don't care about her lyrics, sexually charged and pornographic dancing and her obivious manipulation about loving and serving God, when she is serving herself. does that ring any bells? he seems to be very worldly and makes many excuses for it. the people he seems to be associated with do a great deal of charming. beyonce is not Christian in her life style, her product, influence and impact. she is offensive and defiling and is indulgent and self justifying. her motive is money and self aggrandizement. how can we know her motives? her life her words her impact. she says whatever she knows you need to hear and she is vibrantly self centered and insolent. she is a jezebel spirit, who knew the Lord as young girl, but does not keep His ways. is that too old fashioned for carman? to say, to believe, to "keep the ways of the Lord". what about the hbo question or showmax? should he give money to those defiling, pornographic, babylons, tv entities, culture changing, spirit darkening and at times damaging "ministries"? hopefully it isn't true and he would not open himself or his household or defile his wife when he marries with the violence and sexual deviance and darkness of those evil (too old fashioned again?) sources? seeing things on hbo that no man, or husband or child or teen, minister, NO ONE should ever see and hear is OK if fights or sports or movies are broadcast? and showmax. carman and others can't live without the boxing matches or the movies? these entities are spiritual gates and the practical reality of the full on and openly perverse pornography is reason enough to worship the Lord and protect your household and your own spirit, by denying yourself PLEASURES AND ENTERTAINMENT. where we spend our money, the money that God gives us, matters a great deal. does carman complain to the corp management at hotel chains that provide porno or hbo? is he that responsible and holy as a minister and now a representative of Christ on tbn and world wide tv? tbn likes to promote compromise with the manipulation of scripture, stating that God wants us to live an abundant life. True but... what 'is' the defintion of *abundance*? opened eyes, softened hearts, miraculous healings, wisdom, forgiveness, a sound mind, a rare spirit, salvation, anointings, opened doors for God given gifts and talents? strong marriage, fellowship, angels, love, peace that passes understanding, comfort in trouble, strength supernaturally that comes from the Holy Spirit, church and praise, excellence, counsel? or deliverance from generational inquity, and exposure and casting out of demonic trouble, healing of a broken heart, Jesus taking up a burden we cannot bear, life after death with Him? NOT immoral indulgence, or worldliness, or out of control with expenditures. self aggrandizing or defending the spiritual laziness,a rebellious lust of going to any movie? calling it all okay because "rules" were so strict or distorted in the past generation concerning them?   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 7 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 72.254.156.189 Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:18 am:        right? old fashioned and out dated? too strict? baloney.   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 281 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.136.123.241 Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 6:22 pm:        Baloney: Excellent posts. However, I did have a bit of difficulty following you in some places. Not because of the lack of truth in your posts but because of my lack of command of the English language. You are well written. Please continue to express the truth as you have. _________________________________________________ Bubbleburster, Rooted & Grounded, Carle: In your post dated, July 23, 2005, under the name BubbleBurster, you stated the following: "I do not make it my life's work to go preacher to preacher, ministry to ministry and pick apart what they are doing for the Lord. My job is to pray for them, to lift them up, the encourage them, and to stand behind them and support them. Not tear them apart out of ignorance." You could have fooled me. Some of the things you have said about certain ministers would make the hair stand up on your head. Below is one example of how you speak about certain ministries. You stated this in your posting under the name of Rooted & Grounded, dated Oct. 23, 2004. Note the following: Rooted & Grounded (141.158.80.109) Posted on Saturday, October 23, 2004 - 2:42 am: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Those of you that are posting at Bob's site, do what's right and call him on the carpet for the things he is posting. I may not be able to directly access the site, but unfortunately for Bob, people he thinks are his "friends," AREN'T, and I've read the posts. The new ones posted since Wednesday evening are a disgrace. A post from anonymous7, directed to Vada, is completely out of line and slanderous. I stand corrected in saying Bob "crosses the line" or is Ungodly in his actions. That's too mild. He has moved to all-time idiot status. You may not approve of that, but he is what he is and he needs to be stopped. He doesn't follow his own rules. He's a double-talking liar. I'd be ashamed to be his pastor or have any responsibility for him or his actions. No wonder they "hide" from any accountability where he's concerned. He's a pathetic excuse for a man. Grow up Bob!" ------------------------------------------------- Is this your definition of not picking apart other ministries, of encouragement, of standing behind them, of supporting them? You seem to have a forked tongue. Well, Carle, Bubbleburster, Rooted & Grounded, thats good enough for me. Zebra   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 113 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 8:00 am:        Baloney, you sound like one of those crack pots on here a while back, don't remeber the bodgie name, neither will I go back to look for it, just want to say that seeing you didn't see the segment when Beyonce was mentioned, you are not really qualified to make any commment. He wasn't promoting her, just talking to her pastor and said something like she is the biggest thing around at the moment then said in a shy boyinsh way to say hello to her and made a joke about her number, so really what you say hasn't got much weight. Also you know the world is getting entertained by ungodlies, so do you just sit back and criticise? How's that gonna win a soul? Why don't you get out there and do better than him and Beyonce then? Cause at the moment you sound like a washed out reporter.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 114 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 8:03 am:        Baloney, you sound like one of those crack pots on here a while back, don't remeber the bodgie name, neither will I go back to look for it, just want to say that seeing you didn't see the segment when Beyonce was mentioned, you are not really qualified to make any commment. He wasn't promoting her, just talking to her pastor and said something like she is the biggest thing around at the moment then said in a shy boyinsh way to say hello to her and made a joke about her number, so really what you say hasn't got much weight. Also you know the world is getting entertained by ungodlies, so do you just sit back and criticise? How's that gonna win a soul? Why don't you get out there and do better than him and Beyonce then? Cause at the moment you sound like a washed out reporter.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 115 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 8:27 am:        Just for the record, I never gyrate my hips to Beyonce music, nor would I be caught at one of her concerts. I did like to sing "to the left to the left" only I used to change the words and say "if I stole it please don't touch" cause the only thing I even bought was heroin, everything else was the old five finger discount. Those were the days I was living slightly, shall we say unholy? And you know it's like this this thread is serving an edifying purpose, I am sure you would be able to sleep well without slader and gossip, I know I can do without it, but I must admit, I can't resist the temptation of shining some light on all this.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 116 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 8:30 am:        Just for the record, I never gyrate my hips to Beyonce music, nor would I be caught at one of her concerts. I did like to sing "to the left to the left" only I used to change the words and say "if I stole it please don't touch" cause the only thing I even bought was heroin, everything else was the old five finger discount. Those were the days I was living slightly, shall we say unholy? I'd also change the other words cause never could work out the rest of the words she says in that song. Anyway there are some other songs in the world that have encouraged me from people who sing about their girlfriends or boyfriends but I think of Jesus when I sing them. And you know it's like this this thread is serving an edifying purpose, I am sure you would be able to sleep well without slader and gossip, I know I can do without it, but I must admit, I can't resist the temptation of shining some light on all this.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 117 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 8:32 am:        Just for the record, I never gyrate my hips to Beyonce music, nor would I be caught at one of her concerts. I did like to sing "to the left to the left" only I used to change the words and say "if I stole it please don't touch" cause the only thing I even bought was heroin, everything else was the old five finger discount. Those were the days I was living slightly, shall we say unholy? I'd also change the other words cause never could work out the rest of the words she says in that song. Anyway there are some other songs in the world that have encouraged me from people who sing about their girlfriends or boyfriends but I think of Jesus when I sing them. And you know it's not like this this thread is serving an edifying purpose, I am sure you would be able to sleep well without slader and gossip, I know I can do without it, but I must admit, I can't resist the temptation of shining some light on all this.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 118 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 9:03 am:        Robin Hood used to be my hero, I'd melt everytime I saw him, stealing from the rich and giving to the poor, still I fatasise about him, have you seen a tough guy in green with cute slippers on? Those days I never could work out why people pay for things, I used to think they were all idiots and blind, making people rich who don't deserve it. These rich people ripping people off and everyone falling for it and they do it in the daylight. Yes I am still loking for Robin Hood, if you see him can you tell him I am waiting for him? I know this is slightly off topic, but had to let you know what I think of this world   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 14 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 11:20 pm:        sorry qiulia, i am not a washed out reporter. carman is responsible for every minute he influences young people on tbn or elsewhere. God does not want any of us to defile others either out of just doing what jan tells someone to do, or whoever booked beyonce's "pastor" on tbn. accountability is not gossip and slander is something different than being frustrated and offended or even concerned about the promotion of what is ungodly and for selfish purposes. what godly purpose is there in promoting beyonce to the middle east or china on Christian funding and with an almost complete lack of reality about what she is doing and what she is like over 21? you seem to take an angry position on the wrong side of the facts. and you trust in the fiction. is everything carman does right, holy, responsible and is he incapable of error or compromise or as mentioned, jezebel witchcraft in his own life and spirit man? that would sound just a tad, no, more than a tad like you are thinking of carman in a cult psychology. do you know how to edit or delete posts? this thread is edifying if it's truthful and if God is respected. sorry we don't respect carman or randy white or jan or anyone in that group, no matter what level of popularity and success or how much money they have made OVER Jesus and His Word. are you going to defend carlton pearson or say it's gossip or slander to speak out about his dangerous narcissism and influence and to have a profound disagreement and to disrespect him fully for preaching that there is no Hell and for basing his life on his own mind and carnal or occult experience and fleecing of the flock of God and being a cult leader who is using gays and lesbians to validate himself? you know a creepy 40 year old man can be 'very comforting' to a young girl or boy of 12 and have an inappropriate emotional relationship with them, even if the comfort feels normal or needed at that time. just because something feels good doesn't mean it's right or Christian. do you think it's gossip/slander to say that these posts sound like a washed up reporter? is it wrong to defend the standards of Christ and the healthy, holy lives that we are called to live? baloney?   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 15 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 12:02 am:        how about champion carman and the lawsuit mentioned earlier? double triple dare ya to read first Corinthians chapter 6- which will additionally clarify beyonce. her "pastor" may want to read the Word of God in that chapter too. contact carman on his website or myspace and ask him the questions that are asked in the chapter. NIV is a good version. Amplified also. why is it that so many idealize and get angry when their imaginary projection that carman is always clean right and good and think that carman is incapable of wrong and is basically-apparently the modern age- Jesus? He is seated on the Right Hand of God, arose from the dead, is not anointing beyonce's songs and sex dance (oops did you think that was about carman or Jesus)and He is not subject to the whimsy and what seems like delusions of jan or carman. defending them for the right reason is perfectly fine. hating or scorning or rejecting anyone who doesn't share in the acceptance of compromises and unadmitted or denial of jezebel. why isn't it an issue for more people that employees are afraid of jan and know her as a person who is obstinant and who won't listen about her pagan purchases or who won't realize how controlling she is. she and her family justify everything she does and says. it's almost superstitious and it's a group dynamic, an illness systematically. why does she wear a costume? why is her costume highly sexualized in nature and association? why isn't she concerned with pagan images, mythological gods and occult symbols and an obvious distortion that creates an over the top garrish and obnoxious design of many mirrors and flying cupids saying they are depictions of angels because they are the children of people the artist knew. we don't care what jan says. we don't care what carman says. we care about what God says. and they are entrusted with the platform and influence and the money to promote His ways and His words, not a compromised, overly "relevant" fantasy world (decor and costume)-(carman's irresponsible distortions so he can be popular and successful)that celebrates people whose lives are not praiseworthy and whose lives do not reflect our Lord Jesus. privately, publically, either and both. no baloney. defend right from wrong! and the ways, the desires, the Will and Words of God... with grace and truthfulness. it is - a sin for Christians to listen to, watch and endorse beyonce. it is a deeper sin for leadership to promote her to the world and to ignore the sin in her life and "ministry". there is a bewitchment going on. jan's voice her costume and her "she can do no wrong" myth, or that she is perfect because she was healed is a bewitchment. God is perfect and what Jesus did during His life, authentic ministry and by His death and being raised from the dead, His miracles and authority over the devil and demons, "His perfection and love and grace" is why jan was healed. not hers. yes, she acknowledges and says that. she isn't a horrid disturbed gastly concupisent charlatain. but people believe that the miracle makes the person lily white and incapable of wrong or serious fault. and there are reasons why she would wear a costume and use her voice as mentioned and she charms. and they ARE promoting sin self, some false things and compromise on tbn and don't really want to hear about it apparently.   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 16 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 12:20 am:        can you estimate how many times per week carman jan even mark, paul, matt, laurie, so many in that tribe - the upper eschelon of Christian TV ask the Lord to show them if they are bewitched by anything or anyone, have any false doctrine in their souls or spectrum of influence or if they bewitch to accomplish their goals? is carman bewitched and doesn't know or doesn't care? is he typically bewitched by women and then believes he is victimized by them or God? is it a sin to ask that? who in his formative years was a bewitching person and so he trusts what is familiar. doesn't he see the bewitching countenance on beyonce or hear it spiritually in her voice, aside from the carnal, secular and obvious realities? can you ask Jim Jones that or David Koresh? or someone less sick, demonic and dangerous but who is controlling and intolerant of critical honest thinking? is it "evil" to refuse the truth about pagan statues or anything? should employees be "afraid". can she open up anonymous evaluations of her involvement, practices, beliefs as a "leader" program director and person who uses the money of others to buy expensive, pagan items? is it okay for her to junk up the Holy Land park? and then say how mean to say that, don't you know everything she does and thinks and buys is GOOD? intimidated employees. people who are clear on right from wrong, who hear from God and who see problems but can't speak out or will lose their jobs, be thought ill of or considered false? fearful Christian employees? were carman's ever? does God want people to fear us? does He want us to be intolerant of scrutiny or accountability? do leaders merit a higher level of that? jan's patterns of those exalted on tbn- was juanita bynum bewitched by bishop weeks? did michael english bewitch and then act the victim? did sandy patti bewitch the Body, her kids many others? when you are sorry, sincerely sorry then you can be forgiven that's true. is mary banks bewitching others spiritually? does carlton pearson bewitch nearly everytime he speaks and is bewitched? what is carman doing about it? tbn? yes, we know this is baloney. how wonderful that the Holy Land is being refinanced because we love going there. it's special and many aspects are pleasing to God where He is loved and reverenced and represented in some genuine authenticity. since carman was there at the Shofar Auditorium, (us too)last week did he have any problem with her "purely motivated-totally healthy" ideas and controls- oops creative planning? she is afterall "perfect in all her ways". is there anything wrong at or with tbn? carman? things that should be changed, repented for and done differently and for healthy and Biblical reasons? can anyone ask that and not be accused of being evil or hating the work of God?   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 17 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 12:54 am:        the cult feeling to these people is that you cannot correct or question them or - you/we/anyone who isn't complying are: abusing, slandering, a heresy hunter, demonic or a flake. can you imagine that there are people who actually believe that every motive, every word, every action of jan (and carman), are pure and without the slightest dynamic of anything off, or jezebel and that it's impossible for them to be in real clinical denial or narcissism or emotional incest and self aggrandizing, ego mania, spiritual distortions and that THAT is absolutely not possible. baloney. how DARE you!!!??? "they" are the dearest most sincerist most godly and greatest Christians that you can imagine. yes do "imagine". how DARE YOU again?! just look at all the good they have done and now they can't do anything off or wrong!! jezebel spirituality 'cannot' be in or around them. they are holy perfect accomplished and so many good things that we should and they should never allow the very thought of it. you are getting the dander of BIG men and women of God stirred up now you baloney spreader!!! where are these men and women of God, the famous ones of course who refuse to see any wrong in jan carman or anyone associated with tbn, even though the New Testament tells them to do otherwise, when it comes to things like beyonce and pagan statues that are an abuse and waste of donations and where are they on the costuming and what it means spiritually and mentally? silent because they get to preach for free and sell books? hey now-don't angrily misunderstand. don't slander us the posters speaking. how are you being Christ like towards us and living the standard you think we should? we support tbn, daystar and lesea and several other minstries. we own a very successful business and give generously. we enjoy Christian music and listen to good teachings throughout the week. we have gone to mark chirrona's church and to First Baptist and we have visited tbn studios around the country at differing times. SHOCK we have even worked on carman's concerts a while back. we don't "hate" jan or carman and we sincerely appreciate good creative soul winning life blessing ministry. those who are intolerant of truth about themselves usually qualify accountability as hate or rejection. a righteous, honest friend and mature leader tells you the truth and makes sure that the truth in influence is carefully upheld. "Search me and try me....show me....if there is any....wicked way within...me." not what "i" search and don't find, what the Holy Spirit searches and finds. and if "i" still don't see or believe it, am "i" bewitching myself and others? cult leaders hate those who won't get on the band wagon and just follow blindly with unfaltering bewitched loyalty and denial. baloney? "faithful are the wounds of a friend" -and- if- "you rebuke a wise man, he will love you more in the end than he did in the beginning". pray tell..."who" is allowed to rebuke, question, call into account, debate and challenge; tbn, carman and those who they endorse... whether God really does or not? the answer to that ques is literally in the Bible. mark and sheila perhaps our final goodbye   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 120 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 8:00 am:        Well I hope you are living a Holy life,cause all you seem to be doing is standing in judgement and I hope you realise that you will be judged with the same measure you have used. I don't idolise any of these people, I won't take back my words or delete my posts. You sound very angry and hurt and if you feel so strogly then perhaps you ought to pray for their souls. Frankly I only read some of your post because you repeat yourself and I find you boring and don't hear any power of love in your words either.   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 20 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 11:15 am:        thanks sweet girl. hmmmm. it's not unusual for people who have or raise legitimate standards to be thought of as judgmental. and all of us, sinners and saved by grace saints, judge. it isn't the right thing to do and we struggle with it. you-sound very angry and hurt in many of your posts.edit delete reflection was in regard to your posts being reposted several times. but if that is what floats your boat, as "you" sit in judgment of us and compromise on beyonce. not caring that leaders are wasting precious funds donated by people who can barely afford it on pagan sculptures, promoting immmoral celebrities and justifying it and white washing, defending all, calling "mean" anything that is exposing or corrective of themselves...then knock yourself out. of course we pray and of course we are accountable to live what we expect and hold up as a standard for others to live. power of love. that is an interesting statement. is it love to endorse an unclean defiling living art expression that heightens sexual arousal and that lies and compromises by justifying Biblically defined evil and immorality in the name of awwwh, let's love beyonce and brittany and everything and anything jan or paul condone in their flesh because they have a position and stewardship God gave to them? does carman love beyonce enough to correct her? not surprised that our posts are boring to you. we will be judged by the Eternal, Living Word. by God Who is a Just God and by the standards He mandates. loving children and loving marriage does not include endorsement and promotion of sex symbols and many other things and claiming that if jan has a hand in it, she is somehow the sanctifying force by simply putting something forward. yep we are angry and hurt by the bewitching, the compromise, the expenditures the personality driven exploitation of a platfom of influence over souls, who not only need to be prayed for, but impacted appropriately and responsibly. we'll let you go now and find something that is easier to hear and puts less pressure on you and isn't as boring.   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 21 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 11:42 am:        let's be in a group fantasy, you know kind of like a "cult within the Kingdom"?! we can wear silly wigs, talk like little girls, be very different at home in our private spaces than we perform act bewitch publically and let's never ever use words about ourselves like jezebel phony controlling narcissistic compromised bewitched bewitching with charm. and if famous performers who have some altruistic motives and their kids like us, then we must be venerated and never ever scrutinized or held to a standard. we are the new standard. carlton too. no....you all change... and dumb down "your" standards or we will guilt trip you and even pray curses against you saying you are 'of the devil', mean, and don't understand the amazing wonderfulness of us all. frankly, carman needs to repent and find the personal courage and reality to be iron that sharpens iron. frankly, he needs to cut the lies about his background and upbringing, and admit that he does a lot of spin, the real kind of spin we all resent, even calling what he has been doing for the past few years "taking a hiatus" in his press releases promoting the new album. and pretending he has never been married, and that his family was a gentle, functional, loving, no incest or damage, Christian, healthy home. frankly his photo with patty in the faux family shot, is disturbing on a couple of levels. one- he looks like he is repressing his feelings big time. his face accurately displays, reflects what is going on in his heart and it's 'man i wish this girl was mine and i have to resist it'. but that's okay, his feelings are more important and valid than the spirituality God commands us to. and he can be in a fantasy and lust and not call it either one. awwwh he hasn't been married, (yes he has) feel sorry for him afterall. a little adultery is okay as long as you don't have intercourse. what Jesus said isn't true about a man' heart and the 10 Commandments don't matter. what we feel matters... "frankly", is not something carman does in his own mind and life. he is far from frank. frankly the utter weirdness of him claiming his "mother's mantle" without being honest about what she is like spiritually or what bewitchment there may be in her relationship with him now that is distrubing. but not if he says so or no one really big and famous tells him any of this then it can't be true.   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 22 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 11:54 am:        frankly, jan needs to stop the doll make up it's a joke from pulpits, it's not normal, it's a lie and lying, it's sexual, it's kind of sick and it's a bad kind of crazy example and people feel sorry for her. frankly the controlling act of an ooey gooey personna and failure to be more open normally, to accountability about her choices and life style is not really godly or trustworthy. frankly, we are to judge all things, to judge ourselves first, and know that judgment begins in the House of God and He doesn't like the jezebel and immorality and wrong stewardship. ask Him yourself. jan is completely trustworthy and everything she designs decides and dictates is of God. it's so mean to say anything about her or to even look sideways away from the projected image she wants us to believe. carman's motives are pure pure pure and he is the epitomy of humility and honesty. he has no jezebel witchcraft in his own spirit and soul and all he says and does is holy and pleasing and very Christian. he doesn't have a mean or self serving or greedy or controlling bone in his body and he is just, well wonderful and like jan and others at the perfect and flawless infalliable truly holy, tbn he is completely trustworthy and to mention even the hint of sin is sheer blasphemy. don't you know he is superChristian and that he is so godly that your eyes water just from looking at him? he has no revenge or arrogance or dishonest charm and he would never be in denial of things that he shouldn't be so he can feel addictively happy. he hasn't dropped standards that he knows are real. grrrrrr don't you pick on him, you don't know how funny and sweet and Gospel advocating he is. have you seen his list of friends? do you bother to read or listen to his lyrics you jugdmental jerk? why...carman is the cleanest goodest most wonderful man on earth. amen. baloney.   baloney New member Username: baloney Post Number: 23 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 12:09 pm:        frankly, jan needs to stop the doll make up, it's a point of jokes from pulpits, it's not normal, it's a lie and lying, it's sexual, it's kind of sick and gross honestly, it's a bad kind of crazy example and people feel sorry for her. that's the truth. not malicious, just the truth. she can afford what do you think-the best make up consultants and designer in CA or Orlando? she has to be able to look like a woman of valor and love and professionalism with normal hair, calm and attractive make up and clothes and an attitude that is over powering. whatever she compensating for or whatever power she desires to have over others. LIAR BLASPHEMER HATER EVIL SPIRIT TBN BASHER!!! frankly, the controlling act of an ooey gooey personna and failure to be more open normally, to accountability about her choices and life style is not really godly or trustworthy. frankly, we are to 'judge all things', to judge ourselves first, to judge righteously, and know that judgment "begins in the House of God" and He doesn't like the jezebel and immorality and wrong stewardship. ask Him yourself. see any answsers in chapter 6? jan is completely trustworthy and everything she designs decides and dictates is of God. it's so mean to say anything about her or to even look sideways away from the projected image she wants us to believe. carman's motives are pure pure pure and he is the epitomy of humility and honesty. he has no jezebel witchcraft in his own spirit and soul and all he says and does is holy and pleasing and very Christian. he doesn't have a mean or self serving or greedy or controlling bone in his body and he is just, well wonderful and like jan and others at the perfect and flawless infalliable truly holy, tbn- he is completely trustworthy and to mention even the hint of sin is sheer blasphemy. don't you know he is superChristian and that he is so godly that your eyes water just from looking at him? he has no revenge or arrogance or dishonest charm, vanity, lust for power, manipulation, hate or dark thoughts and motives... and he would never be in denial of things that he shouldn't be so, he can feel addictively happy and maintain an 'image'. he doesn't have like 15 different forms of control and doesn't "know how to 'work' Christians and ministers". you know like he said he had to learn to do to avoid his mom's wrath as a kid? no not carman, he is the poster boy of health and honesty and has no, no way, not one abuse in his 'skill set'. he hasn't dropped standards that he knows are real. grrrrrr.....don't you pick on him, you don't know how funny and sweet and Gospel advocating he is. have you seen his list of friends? do you bother to read or listen to his lyrics you jugdmental jerk? why........carman is the cleanest- goodest- most *wonderful* man on earth. amen. oh yes let's not leave out that vital and marketable reality (now that he is starving to lose his paunchiness)he is "so handsome" and his counterpart jan now, is so beautiful what an image for tbn around the World.... and they both charm and spin and giggle and have the Body of Christ mesmerized and held captive. WHAT??????????SHUT UP. you couldn't be more wrong. sincerity is the blood in their veins and their hearts are more pure than any other breathing creature upon the face of the deep. no!!!! bewitch? control? spin? charm? overspend? motivated by vanity and greed? not soley the Gospel and all the standards that bring life, in the Gospel? No they don't you wacko!!! you don't understand just how special they really are and all that they do "FOR" God. they don't do anything for themselves. stop posting here you freak! you're just angry and you don't understand and you are probably a demon in disguise. baloney. (Message edited by baloney on September 27, 2007)   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 282 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.190.164.130 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 1:10 pm:        Baloney: Oh my!!!!!! You do have a way with words. I couldn't have said it better myself. (smile) However, you are heaping coals of fire on your head from those who believe that C is Gods gift to mankind. The girls from the paid-chat site will put a curse on you for the things you have said. Of course, they will not come to this site or other sites and say much of anything. They will discuss it among themselves and talk about what they thought about doing and what they should do. However, they never do it. They are cowards. If, by chance, they do come to this site or other sites they will post under several different names. I guess to try and not be responsible for what they have said. A couple of posters from the paid-chat site have used so many different names they could hardly keep up with them all. Here are but a few; Bubbleburster, Rooted & Grounded, Carle, Rahab11, Hopenluv1, Plainoleme, Anonymous 4, Anonymous 7, Lvn4Hm, Lipsnync, JabberJungleJoker, Beaconinthe night, even Carman. Yes, one of the girls registered as Carman on MM's site, I guess it was to protect him from others, (smile) There are a few more I do not recall at the moment. Yet, the very people who do this criticize others for doing it. Hypocrites!!! Please continue to post. I do enjoy reality from time to time. Zebra   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 121 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 6:51 pm:        I recall that Carman has actually confessed that he hasn't got heaven open, that he has lost the fire of God and that he thinks that God has abandoned him. I think that was humble. I think we all have a degree of selfish motive in what we do and say and are motivated by that to some degree. If you say or think you haven't then you are lying and the truth is not in you. I think that to die daily to that is something we alll ought to do and I think we should all confess our sins one to another as well. Just want to point out my name is Giulia, not quilia, just to get things straight. Sounds like you are very angry and have been hurt by these ministries, yet you say you support them, so that is kinda confusing because if I am gonna bag someone then I am actually not supporting them but putting them down instead. Even if my money is going there. Also in the Spirit and the Spirtual will judge even the angels, not the carnal, and I wonder whereyou come from. I am annoyed with much of the church myself. I think there is a lot of falseness around and a lot of lies, people are caring about monetray gain and defining this as prosperity, yet the Spirit is being neglected. People teach of positioning yourself for prosperity, how about positioning yourself for Spiritual prosperity, what really matters and the only thing that will last in the end? People push each other over, people pray and sing like they are Holy, but in reality they have been practicing the right face to pull to make em look Holy. FRrankly I am not able to find a pastor who I respect fully and look up to, so I look up to Jesus and He is my pastor and occassionaly He talks through others. I know Carman was truly touched by God (at one stage) and I know he had the fire of God, not the fire that is of the world that makes you shout and shake and scream, but the fire that purifies and makes Holy and cleanses from sin. So he is a true brother and even though he has lost his fire and Presence of God, I truly hope that he can get it back and I will keep praying that he does, and frankly I am concerned because to have the fire and loose it is the worst thing that could ever happen to a person, better a person never had it in the first place. I was in a similar situation where I had the fire and lost it. Now I have got it back. I am grateful and think it is a rare thing, but God is in charge here so no one else can make an opinion on this. I think Carman wants to find God again and truly wants him, I agree that he strayed, he agrees he has strayed, I still hope for him.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 122 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 7:31 pm:        I think Carman wants to find God again and truly wants him, I agree that he strayed, he agrees he has strayed, I still hope for him. I hope his soul can be lit up with goodness and find the sweetness of God's love. We are all part of the Body of Christ and I hope that if you break a leg you don't chop it off but nurture it back to health. We look after our bodies and so we should each other. There is too much biting and not enough love, love that will tell the world we are Christians, true ones not just pretend ones. I am glad that God's love is steadfast and strong, I am glad that His mercies last and last, I am glad He is not fickle like us, I am glad His hand is mighty to save and is not short. I am glad He has not given up on me and began to condemn me instead. I am glad He has opened heaven over me and wants that for all His children. And I know He is powerful enough to keep His word that the work He has began in us He will complete because He is faithful. Praise Him for His mercies and grace and that He didn't come to condemn, but to save that which was lost.   baloney Junior Member Username: baloney Post Number: 29 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 11:46 pm:        giulia, that's a good post and your appreciation for God shows through. didn't know that carman had strayed or felt he lost his fire. how did you come to that conclusion? being angry or hurt by ministry leaders for a myriad of reasons is not unreasonable or unloving, but speaks to "their" lack of love for the people they impact and the God they collect funds in the name of. stewardship must always be married to accountability. intelligent, discerning, sincere, loyal to God first and fearless, bold, balanced seasoned with love and unwilling to lie. in private aspects like boards, close friends who won't lie or practice enabling, spiritual authority figures, to God of course and His Word...and then to the public whom they serve and are supported by. "healthy authority" welcomes and is not threatened by and does not seek to control, true or false accountability. address it, ok, but denial and fear smacks of guilt and secrets and insecurity. i don't think carman "losing his fire" or being discouraged or feeling abandoned, is an acceptable excuse for any form of sin or compromise. so many scriptures show that. and can you "honestly" pity him, knowing all that he has had experienced,succeeded in, accumulated as an adult Christian. and all of the inestimatable help and fellowship and friends in ministry and accomplishments, awards, travels, and prayer, and family and fulfilled dreams, celebrity etc etc? he put himself into most of any of the wierd or hard things he has gone through. he should be glorifying God not garnering inordinate and dishonest attention for himself. baloney!!! you fiend nutjob! for carman in particular to act in any way as a despairing justified victim is repulsive and seriously unethical and unthankful. this life is full of trials and tribulations He says. and also, we are not comfortless or alone. considered-the possibility that he had a curse of trouble on his life for toubling anyone innocent or anointed?? baloney no way. not raising up multiple, billboards on behalf of any girls who are mad at him. just looking at the symptoms suspects and facts. bad character blames and acts the victim. and is entitled and greedy and manipulative. good character, healthy psychology, accepts responsibility and is thankful and contrite. where do they stand and anyone of us too? God is good and present even if we are either under an attack and cannot feel Him, or if we are dulled, or have become hardened by our own carnality, sin and selfish anger. don't see indication that carman feels he needs to find God again. am not sure why you said that. if he is not close to God and if he is unhappy it's going to be largely due to his own doings. if he can't hear the Lord and if he can't repent normally, then he should think twice about being in any public ministry. his "compass" about other people and also the responsibilities involved in being a Christian spokesman or leader, looks to be 'off'. if he doesn't care he's selfish and ahab. if he is defiant and justifies compromise, in the name of something he wants, he's jezebel to whatever degrees and measure. only God can understand that depth. if he doesn't want to think it's a possiblity, then he's setting himself up to be decieved some where by some one. baloney? it's not arbitrary anger and loose cannon - let's attack charismatic ministries. we are a part of them and thrive on them. like we said, speak the truth and people get upset project and curse for certain reasons. certain "character."   baloney Junior Member Username: baloney Post Number: 30 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 64.134.5.42 Posted on Friday, September 28, 2007 - 12:06 am:        you can support and be strengthened by ministries. and of course as adults- hold them to a standard of moral purity, integrity and Biblical practices. just as they should do towards others. yes, guilia it's true...praise Him for His mercies and grace. good word. don't give Him or His precious people growing in Him, (serving and creatively ministering or wanting to), any baloney. then- call it good fruit or healthy just because someone on tbn likes it, or 'someone' doesn't care about the real lives of the celebs they are irresponsibily and recklessly endorsing. if your body has an open wound and it can infect others, (borrowing from your analogy)mame and even kill you. or if you have a virus and are contageous- break out the antiseptic and the antibiotics! and don't stop the cleansing and the treatment until things are clean and clear and safe no matter how much the person hates the addressment or doesn't think they need it. who cares- if the sick person screams and rants when the needle with the medicine is headed towards their soft cushy skin. we stand on our comments beliefs and honest feedback or accountability, directed towards people who won't read their mail as the reports go, and who don't have the humility and the stability to process candid disagreement and genuine rebuke. God doesn't like sin being overlooked and promoted, and neither does He sit, waiting, crouched like an angry hindu tiger god, fuming and drooling to cast people into Sheol because they are dishonorable and don't want to admit it to themselves or others. He also isn't high on afghanistan opium so He doesn't pretend it isn't happening and He doesn't just let it go when souls are directed in the wrong way. you might like to look into scripture about teachers and their responsibility. and the outcome of misleading from God's perspective and what "He" condems or judges. carman and tbn should not protect carlton out of pity, piety or a former friendship. did you happen to see the msnbc program? did jan and carman and all of the staff at tbn write in to the network, sponsors and carlton expressing disagreement and noting the outrageous levels of narcissism and egomania on his part? anyone complain with balance about the manipulation of the presentation? that no "normal" attractive successful Christians were represented? or what Jesus and the Bible actually say about Hell? and homosexuality? or just shake their heads, think silent thoughts and let it all slip away and then buy new hair spray for the next tbn taping? they should protect the people of God who are vulnerable. and put God first, over a friendship. carefully honorably ethically. they might say that they have right? why are they doing so much stuff now that is white washed and void of normal New Testament standards? tbn is a pulpit to the world and they can't just fancy a popular person as a good guest who once had a Bible on their nightstand. or much, much worse. good night and guard your heart with all diligence. don't slip and fall on any greasy pieces of baloney you might not see lying around.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 123 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Friday, September 28, 2007 - 12:47 am:        Yes he said on his last TBN appearance when he was talking to Paula White that he hasn't seen heaven opened in a long time and even feels he has been abandoned by God. He has been alluding to this for some time when he gave the analogy of friends punching a hole through the ceiling for the sick man to get through. And I am sure he has also on some random occassion said it clearly. I watch TBN from time to time and sometimes I hear some good stuff on it. I don't like too much make up or wigs, but I have had some close dealings with actors and like to strip through the facade just to see what's underneath. Shall we say I like the bare facts and I also like to see the truth shine through the darkness, especially when the darkness is thick and cheesy. My mother and closer relatives keep telling me that some stuff is not my business and not my place to comment. I am learning that, perhaps there is a degree of truth in that and perhaps things wouldn't change much if I get someone to run for cover to avoid the shining of my little light and the devastation it would cause their darkness. I don't think Carman has been teaching anything wrong or bad. I think he is a bad space and I think that his judgement is sometimes obscured by shiny lights. I think that, like many people, he gravitates towards where the pull is, where the influence and power is and I think it is attractive to be able to communicate to such a large audience, and not only attractive but purpouseful. Also know he has connections and close ties with these people and they probably even got something over him. I think that it is very probable that he has offended one or two anointed people, but I don't think this is unforgivable.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 124 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Friday, September 28, 2007 - 12:59 am:        I don't think like him at all, I don't look up to the people he looks up to, and sometimes I even get shocked about some of these people, but I know we have the same Father and I know we are both Italians. I also know he probably wouldn't buy me a coffee with chocolates, nor spend any time with me, but that's okay. He probably even thinks he's above me, that's okay tooo. I am building my home on the rock and I rejoyce when i am rejected because so was Jesus. He gave a lot through his music and through some of the creative voice he gave some scripture. I thought it was brilliant what he did with simple stuff, not too fancy, simple but powerful. I don't think he deserves excommunication and darkness and I hope the best for him in a wife for him, perhaps that is much of his problem too. I also hope he gets his anointing back as I couldn't think of anything worse than to live in darkness with rejection from Christ. I think he has done much good works that will last the test of time and I think he needs to be loved, not condemned. I think that much of the position he came to be in was not anticipated and he had no idea of how to deal with it. I think it is hard sometimes to distinguish man's praise and Gods, especially when it is God's people doing the praise. Tough position to be in and requires extra compassion.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 125 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Friday, September 28, 2007 - 7:03 pm:        If you get hurt by someone and so slander them in order to hurt them back, are you not the same as the one who hurt you and the words you say about them are also true for you because of this reason. A Christian or a Christ One (there aren't many of these in the world) is different, they love and do good to those who hurt and despise them. In this way they are like God. Unfortunately the world has soiled many garments of Ones who were once clothed in white and many have turned to love the praise of man and be led once again by their primitive selves. Those that "love silver and not be satisfied with it, nor shall he that love abundance be satisfied with increase" (Ecc 5:10) Those who trade the incorruptible for the corruptible shall never be full. They will always labour for their mouths yet their bellies shall not be filled. But you know what? There is a river that flows from God's throne room and all who are washed in it hsall be made clean and one who once was clean and been soiled can become clean again Re 7:14. The blood on the mercy seat is still fresh even as it has been scince the beginning of time.   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 286 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.163.78.134 Posted on Saturday, September 29, 2007 - 6:20 pm:        Giulia: If you will permit me a comment or two concerning you posts, numbers; 123, 124, 125. 1."Yes he said on his last TBN appearance when he was talking to Paula White that he hasn't seen heaven opened in a long time and even feels he has been abandoned by God." Perhaps he has abandoned God. 2."I don't think Carman has been teaching anything wrong or bad. I think he is a bad space and I think that his judgement is sometimes obscured by shiny lights." Who, may I ask put him where he is? 3."I think that, like many people, he gravitates towards where the pull is, where the influence and power is and I think it is attractive to be able to communicate to such a large audience, and not only attractive but purpouseful." Let us excuse him then. He's only human, right? 4."Also know he has connections and close ties with these people and they probably even got something over him." Yo're getting hotter. 5." don't think like him at all, I don't look up to the people he looks up to, and sometimes I even get shocked about some of these people, but I know we have the same Father and I know we are both Italians." Do you mean earthly father or heavenly father? 6."I also hope he gets his anointing back as I couldn't think of anything worse than to live in darkness with rejection from Christ." Why would Christ reject him? 7."I think that much of the position he came to be in was not anticipated and he had no idea of how to deal with it." Doesn't the Holy Spirit guide us if we will allow him to? 8."I think it is hard sometimes to distinguish man's praise and Gods, especially when it is God's people doing the praise. Tough position to be in and requires extra compassion." NO!!!! It requires extra responsibility on his part. 9." Those who trade the incorruptible for the corruptible shall never be full. They will always labour for their mouths yet their bellies shall not be filled." Perhaps this is what the problem is for C?   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 126 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Saturday, September 29, 2007 - 6:45 pm:        Know what? I don't lay the boots in when someone's down, not in the flesh, not in the Spirit and neither intelectually "Who, may I ask put him where he is?" He certainly had a lot of help from "friends" "Let us excuse him then. He's only human, right?" not saying that, but if you want mercy, then you better give it! "Do you mean earthly father or heavenly father" Smartie!   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 287 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.193.36.254 Posted on Sunday, September 30, 2007 - 11:41 pm:        Giulia: In your above post # 126, you stated the following: "Know what? I don't lay the boots in when someone's down, not in the flesh, not in the Spirit and neither intelectually" Did you mean intellectually? (smile) Your intellect is showing as well as your blind support. It's always someone elses fault. Someone else caused it, not the choices made by an individual. That thought runs throughout the thinking of the girls from the paid-chat site. If your not a member of the paid-chat site you should become one. You would fit right in. But wait, you have to pay to be a member. Who could we blame that on? Has to be someone else making him charge a fee. But wait, it's called a donation, right. Zebra   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 132 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Monday, October 01, 2007 - 10:04 am:        How did you get that out of what I said? Go on explain cause sometimes I don't understand people. Not into chats and no I don't think I would fit in and yes I take responsibility for myself and others as well, how about you?   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 133 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Monday, October 01, 2007 - 10:20 am:        so are you saying those girls are being forced to pay? Geez that would be a shame. I don't really have a lot of time either besides socially I limp a little, never been good at surface talk, besides the man has got his hands full with all these women, hope he is paying some attention to his wife to be amongst it all. Hope he gets a preacher wife, not someone who just uses someone else's quotes with no understanding.   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 288 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.195.75.149 Posted on Monday, October 01, 2007 - 11:42 am:        Giulia: In answer to your question found in your post # 133, you ask the following: "are you saying those girls are being forced to pay?" The answer is YES!!!! If the girls want to be a part of the inner circle they have to be members of the paid-chat site. To be a member of that site they have to pay. Therefore, they are being forced to pay. I find you a bit difficult to understand at times. An example of this is found in your post # 132, where you stated the following; "...I take responsibility for myself and others as well, how about you?" My answer would be yes, I take responsibility for myself and no, I do not take responsibility for others. In your above posts you presented statements implying that C is not responsible and that others were responsible for his shortcomings. Please reread your earlier posts. Perhaps you will see where I'm coming from. Another example is found in your post # 133 where you stated the following; "hope he is paying some attention to his wife to be amongst it all. Hope he gets a preacher wife,..." You are saying that he has a wife and that you hoped he got a preachers wife, all in the same breath. Can you see where this is a bit confusing? I hope this cleared it up a bit for you. _________________________________________________ Attention!!! Girls from the paid-chat site: My question for you is this? What is the atomic number of mercury? Zebra   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 134 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Monday, October 01, 2007 - 4:33 pm:        So one minute you are criticising me for saying Carman has no responsibility and I am blaming others for his shortcomings, next minute you are doing the very same thing you accuse me of by saying the girls in the chat site are not responsible for their actions,hu? So which one is it? We are all responsible for our actions, or some of us are and the others not and allowed to be? I think people should take responsibility for themselves and are responsible for themselves. It is also obvious we humans are influenced by our surroundings too. I think when people help someone believe some lie, then they are responsible too, to an extent as we are called to bear each others burdens. If you read the post with understanding you will see a preacher wife and a preachers wife are two different things.   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 135 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Monday, October 01, 2007 - 4:36 pm:        So one minute you are criticising me for saying Carman has no responsibility and I am blaming others for his shortcomings, next minute you are doing the very same thing you accuse me of by saying the girls in the chat site are not responsible for their actions,hu? So which one is it? We are all responsible for our actions, or some of us are and the others not and allowed to be? I think people should take responsibility for themselves and are responsible for themselves. It is also obvious we humans are influenced by our surroundings too this is why we are exhorted to have fellowship with one another, because it is true that your fellowship influences you. I think when people help someone believe some lie, then they are responsible too, to an extent as we are called to bear each others burdens. If you read the post with understanding you will see a preacher wife and a preachers wife are two different things.   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 289 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.191.57.215 Posted on Monday, October 01, 2007 - 5:18 pm:        Giulia: I read your post # 134. and I must say you are difficult to understand. Perhaps it's the Italian blood. I point out one of your statements from the above mentioned post and ask you sincerely to tell me what you meant when you posted the following: "We are all responsible for our actions, or some of us are and the others not and allowed to be?" I am confused with this statement. Please clearify it for me. My question to you is this: Can a Preacher wife be a preachers wife? You stated in your above post # 135, that they were two different things. Thank you for your wonderful patience with me for I do have great difficulty following one with such ability as you possess in expressing themselves. By the way, do you read and or write in Italian? If so, perhaps I could understand you better if you posted in that language. Thank you. Zebra   carle Member Username: carle Post Number: 51 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 172.190.88.251 Posted on Monday, October 01, 2007 - 7:38 pm:        Z---bra I want to tell you off so bad. You have pushed me about as far as I am going to be pushed. This is my final warning. If you continue to bother me and the girls there will be consequences that will be great. We have done nothing to cause you to continue to presure us like you have. What is your problem? Why don't you go away. Things were going so well before you started butting into our business. Remember!!! This is our final warning. Carle   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 137 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Tuesday, October 02, 2007 - 6:23 am:        Zebra you remind me of the pharisees that tried to catch Jesus out of trivialities. If you don't understand me perhaps I shouldn't waste my time typing. Would you understand me when I have my boxing gloves on? My best combo is two jabs and a right cross, but i may change my mind at short notice and try a right cross and a rip and the come up with an uppercut to the chinny chin chin. Because I like dancing I may just dance you around a bit, think you're fit enough? I only run 5 kms every second day and on a rest day I go cycling, rekon you could keep up? Anytime anywhere let me know if you want to dance Oh and if you happen to be a male, then even better, more competition for me Praise God for His strength!   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 138 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Tuesday, October 02, 2007 - 6:37 am:        Tell you what I'll tie my right hand behind my back and just use my left, then we can talk preachers wives and preachers wife and we can talk responsibility for you and not for them (the girls in the chat site) because they are irresponsible right? Then we can talk anything else you want.   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 291 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.167.42.3 Posted on Tuesday, October 02, 2007 - 7:24 pm:        Giulia: I am so frightened I can hardly write. Please give me a moment to compose myself. Thank you. After reading your last two postings I must make a statement or two concerning you postings. 1. After reading some of your postings, perhaps you spent too much time working on the physical and you should have been working on you writing skills. 2. When one cannot express themselves with words they often turn to the physical. 3. I do believe you would fit very well in the inner circle of the paid-chat site. They too, speak much yet produce very little. 4. "Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall. Proverbs 16:18. Allow me to write the above scripture in the Italian language, perhaps you will be better able to understand it if written in your language. "Il goeth di orgoglio prima della distruzione, ed uno spirito altezzoso prima di una caduta. I proverbi 16:18." Zebra   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 139 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, October 03, 2007 - 7:49 am:        So you didn't answer my question about why you think Carman should be responsible and the girls are not responsible? Do you think you are above answering my questions? You ask answers for yours, yet don't answer mine, just try to trip me up instead, better try a little harder dear. Seems you think yourself above the girls in the chat site because you imply they are irresposible, yet you have a different standard for Carman. I thought you were a zebra? And you make accusations of pride when you are coming from precisely that place. You haven't even got the guts to say your real name and make a date with me. I like to play, get physical, you know lay hands on people. It says to do that in the bible. And dancing with someone, I only do that with people I bond with. "Il goeth di orgoglio" Hu? Il goeth di orgoglio? E cos a sarrebe precisamente? If you feel you need to put me down for my literacy skills, at least make sure you are without fault, hypocrite!   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 140 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, October 03, 2007 - 7:56 am:        O scusa insegniante, "sarebbe" si scrive cosi' corretto oe sbagliato? Beh, al meno mi paga lo stesso il governo anche se qualche parola non e perfetta   giulia Intermediate Member Username: giulia Post Number: 141 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 59.101.212.251 Posted on Wednesday, October 03, 2007 - 10:02 am:        A final observation and final goodbye, (as this is the title of this thread) is the fact you say in one breath that the chat girls are being exploited, then in the next breath you tell me I would fit in there and that I should join. How very Christian of you to want the best for me! sounds down right malicious to me, over and out as I think that was a TKO and you are no longer a challenge to me neither do I see a scerrick of light in you. I don't enjoy talking to pharisees, goood bye   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 292 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.165.62.151 Posted on Wednesday, October 03, 2007 - 11:29 am:        Giulia: It appears your Italian is not any better than your English. Please allow me to translate your Italian into English for those who read posts on Factnet. Warning!! It's a bit difficult to understand what is being said. _________________________________________________ In your above post # 139, you wrote: "Il goeth di orgoglio" Hu? Il goeth di orgoglio? E cos a sarrebe precisamente? English translation: "The goeth of pride" Hu? The goeth of pride? And cos to sarrebe precisely? _________________________________________________ In your above post # 140, you wrote: "O scusa insegniante, "sarebbe" si scrive cosi' corretto oe sbagliato?" English translation: Or it excuses insegniante, "has been" it is written things' correct wrong oe? _________________________________________________Also in your post # 140, you wrote: "Beh, al meno mi paga lo stesso il governo anche se qualche parola non e perfetta" English translation: Beh, to the except for me pays the same the government even if some word not and perfect _________________________________________________ I have two questions and a statement. The questions are the ones with the question marks. 1. Have you had any head injuries in the past? 2. In your above post # 141, what does the word "scerrick" mean? Thank you. 3. I must admit you are somewhat of a challenge to me. Zebra   carle Member Username: carle Post Number: 52 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 172.165.8.60 Posted on Thursday, October 04, 2007 - 1:14 pm:        Z-bra Let me try and explain something to you. I don't mean to be rude to you but the things you post here are very upsetting to me and my friends. I'm a single woman living in the same household with some of my family. I never left home. When I began listening to C's music it filled a void I had in my life. It took the place of reality and has for the past several years. Instead of me getting out like a normal person I stayed at home. I was afraid to face reality and what it might hold for me. This is one of the reasons that we girls of the paid chat site (as you call it) think so much alike. We are trying to live through someone else. We are afraid to face what life might bring us. We more or less hide ourselves from reality. We don't want any competition from anyone for C. He has become somewhat of an idol to us. That is why I have said some things I shouldn't have said against certain ministeries. I know it was wrong but I had to do it. We have to build up C even at the expense of others. Also when V was removed from her position it broke our hearts. We no longer had someone who was in constant contact with C. We no longer could get that inside information that we had received over the years. Then C became a Myspace person. He has allowed female after female to post things on his site. This is not the way it should be. We girls who have supported him for so long should be the only ones allowed to do that, so please backoff. We girls of the inner circle have enough to concern ourselves with without you adding to the weight. Carle   trsrinheaven Senior Member Username: trsrinheaven Post Number: 1239 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 71.194.182.119 Posted on Thursday, October 04, 2007 - 1:33 pm:        CARMAN IS GAY??? We need some answers from any of your Carman experts. First of all following a man or any human being(even a pastor or teacher) is both dangerous and sinful according to the Bible. Only God, Gods word(the Bible) and His Holy Spirit is the way we are to be led. Romans 8:14 Romans 12, John 14 "continue in my word you shall know the truth and the truth will set you free" " he the Holy Spirit will lead you and guide you into ALL truth" . Q: I have heard a number of people say for a number of years that CARMAN IS GAY. Q: Was Carman married one time just a short time ago for some ridiculous short time like a week or so? in Las Vegas to one of his friends ex wives then divorced? Q: Did Carman have a gay relationship with a well known minister who is married? Why has Carman who must be close to fifty years old by now never been married except this one recent time for a week or so?.. Are these just rumors? Anyone know anything????? Just trying to clear this up .....   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 293 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.165.107.231 Posted on Thursday, October 04, 2007 - 11:38 pm:        Carle: In your above post # 52, you stated the following, "Also when V was removed from her position it broke our hearts. We no longer had someone who was in constant contact with C. We no longer could get that inside information that we had received over the years." Allow me to (slightly correct) your above statement. Yes, V was removed from her position. Yes, V is no longer in constant contact with C. However, she continues to tap into some of the workings of C and she continues to share information with the inner circle. She couldn't possibly let it go completely. She has to an extent, the same problem that some of the girls from the paid-chat site has. She has a case of Carmonia. It is very difficult to be overcome. Zebra   carle Member Username: carle Post Number: 53 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 172.136.246.46 Posted on Friday, October 05, 2007 - 9:30 pm:        Z-bra How could you possibly know these things? Are you one of the inner circle? The inner circle consist of only 4 girls. There's V, she is the oldest of the group. She just couldn't be spying for you could she? Then there's 3J, she is married and lives out West. I don't believe she is the spy. I must admit she is a little different than the rest of us but I can't accept her as the spy. Then we come to Crafty. She is single and a little strange at times but why would she be spying on us and giving you the information? Of course, there's me. I'm single and proud of it. I know I'm not spying on the inner circle and giving you the information. There has to be a resonable explanation for what is happening. We girls of the inner circle are at our wits end. We want to respond to you but we are afraid to. You always seem to be a step ahead of us. Please, I beg of you to explain to us who you are and why you do the things you do. Carle   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 294 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.132.248.140 Posted on Monday, October 08, 2007 - 8:29 pm:        Carle: In answer to your above question in your post # 53, as to who I am, my answer is as follows: 1. Who do you think I am? 2. Who do you want me to be? _________________________________________________ As to your above question in your post # 53 concerning, "Why I do the things I do?" my answer would be as follows: 1. "As many as are led by the Spirit, they are the children of God." _________________________________________________ Zebra   missykwan New member Username: missykwan Post Number: 3 Registered: 8-2007 Posted From: 75.118.55.162 Posted on Thursday, November 01, 2007 - 12:24 am:        CARLE SAYS: So please, Crafty, 3J, V and I ask you to stop doing what you are doing. I SAY: If you want me to STOP doing something, then I am obligated to KEEP doing it. K-Thanx-Bye   revelation New member Username: revelation Post Number: 17 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 97.96.182.25 Posted on Friday, November 02, 2007 - 11:06 pm:        For the "record" when we speak we must be sure it is the truth, We are told to speak the truth in love ...if we do not know what we are talking about it is better to be silent. Filling in the blanks with things that are not true is very damaging. I know I wouldn't like it.   missykwan New member Username: missykwan Post Number: 7 Registered: 8-2007 Posted From: 75.118.55.162 Posted on Saturday, November 03, 2007 - 1:49 am:        REVELATION: I just wanted to clarify just to make sure people understand what I'm saying. If Crafty, 3J or Vada want me to stop doing something, then I am obligated by my own conscious to keep doing it LULZ!!!   zebra Intermediate Member Username: zebra Post Number: 330 Registered: 7-2005 Posted From: 172.133.68.226 Posted on Thursday, November 29, 2007 - 6:27 pm:        Revelation: In your above post # 17, you stated the following: "For the "record" when we speak we must be sure it is the truth, We are told to speak the truth in love ...if we do not know what we are talking about it is better to be silent. Filling in the blanks with things that are not true is very damaging. I know I wouldn't like it." I couldn't agree more. I have spoken only the truth in the postings I have made on FactNet. I realize there are some who would disagree that I have spoken the truth. However, those "some" do not wish to hear the truth. They have their own agendas. __________________________________________________________________________________________________ Missykwan: My question to you is this: Have you ever heard any of the girls from the paid-chat site make the following statement: "Never criticize anyone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. Then you're a mile away.....and you have their shoes." This seems to be a favorite of the Clan.

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