| Author | Message | ||
     the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 53 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
I read in the paper that the state of Georgia has charged a couple with murder in the death of their child. The parents were vegans. They fed the child the same diet. That was all the information in the paper, I can not tell you anymore. Just curious what in the vegan diet is bad for children? I ask that because someone on the board claims to be vegan. Give me you expertize. For those who do not know, the vegan diet is religious fair in the Adventist Movement and Hinduism. | ||
| rachelengland Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 54 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 216.109.192.236 |
www.vrg.org/nutshell/vegan.htm Sandy, here is vegan in a nutshell. I am very sorry to hear this about the child..but many follow this diet/lifestyle with no complications-what one is lacking from not eating meat can easily be found in other foods. maybe they were really restricting her diet and we should probably have the newslink posted here so we can read it thoroughly before accusing them..R | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 56 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
No accusations intented. Nor is the article important, as far as I am concerned. I have no desire to try a capital case on this message board. I have read the site mention and several others. Unfortunately, many medical authorities are opposed to the vegan diet for children. My question is still why? Is there something missing in the diet a child needs? Iron? A vitiman or mineral? Perhaps, chicken soup is good for the child's soul? | ||
| friend New member Username: friend Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 66.162.203.195 |
Actually, after reading about this "vegan" couple, it was apparent they were like no vegans I know. My thought was that they were a bit mental. I grew up in an area with quite a number of Seventh-day Adventists. Many were vegan. They were the most healthy folks I've ever seen and none of their babies suffered any problems. Vegan does not equal crazy :-). | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 65 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Hello Friend: I agree with many exceptions. The claims of the Adventist Movement are based on Ellen White's claim to be inspired. Eating vegies will not get anyone into heaven. My second problem with the claims of the Adventist Movement is not limited to that movement. I, personally, do not care what an adult does. That person will pay his own debt at some point. The Jehovah's Witnesses refuse medical care to their children based on their false doctrine. The Adventist Movement is guilt of the same offence when they deny the child a healthy diet (you decide the meaning of healthy). When the child is old enough to make their own mistakes, then fine! Let them refuse medical treatment or eat a certain diet or wear long dresses, etc. Quoting: "Vegan does not equal crazy :-)." End quote. Why waste all those perfectly good steaks God created? Now admit it, it is crazy to eat rabbit food when there are perefectly good chickens to eight. hehehe | ||
| rachelengland Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 57 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 216.109.192.236 |
Though I agree with the idea that children should be left to decide at an age of accountabilty what they should eat(though most would prefer pizza and cookies if left to their own desires)..but if the vegan diet was sooo terrible for children than many would be dying and that is not the case. These people missed something, somewhere along the lines..I think that denying medical attention as Christian Scientists and many other religious fanatics do is much, much more dangerous than a child not eating meat. If one is following the vegan diet in a structured way all the necessary minerals and vitamins should be in place..R I am not a vegan btw...can't deny a chicken | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 69 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Hello Ms. rachelengland: Quoting: "can't deny a chicken>" End quote. Is that a fried chicken? A broiled chicken? or a baked chicken? or a bbq'd chicken? Were you talking about chicken, like chicken? or Did you mean chicken like chicken? On the serious side, forcing a child or anyone to follow our religious belief is dead wrong. I don't necessarily see the vegan diet as a religious practice. Hindus do not eat meat on the basis that animals are the highest form of life. You might be bbqing your great aunt Bessy, literally. The Adventist Movement does not eat meat because Ellen White, claiming inspiration, said the vegan diet was commanded in the Bible. I have not worked with the Christian Scientists. I do not know their believe system. I don't remember anything being mentioned on this couple's religious system. Though, I do stand open to correction. As I said, if you want to force your child to go to church, do so. But don't force that child to obey your religious practices for your sake. Take the child to church, give them the chance to see Christianity from both sides. They can make their own mind up. The same is true for these other religions. The truth will always prevail. Sorry for bloviating. | ||
| mcmstaff78 Member Username: mcmstaff78 Post Number: 51 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 208.61.5.114 |
TATM, do you have children? | ||
| rachelengland Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 59 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 216.109.192.236 |
No that is fine...I read somewhere many vegans feel that if Jesus were alive in this day and age He would be a vegetarian..it takes a lot of money to feed cows when the grain used could probably feed the poor-many things they say ATM make sense.. I really liked your last line there about forcing things upon children such as religion..you really should look into the Christian Science thing(I heard Doris Day and Mike Nesmith from the Monkees are both into this-they are dead set against medical intervention-Mary Baker Eddy founded this movement). We had some Seventh Day adventist in the family..they are a healthy bunch... | ||
| arron Member Username: arron Post Number: 70 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.119.34.187 |
JESUS ATE MEAT AT THE PASSOVER i am sure HE ate meat during HIS LIFE. TO SAY ONE CANT EANT MEAT IS LIKE SAYING ONE CANT BE SAVED | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 74 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Mr. mcmstaff78: Yes two. | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 75 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Ms. rachelengland: Tom Cruise is probably the best known CS in Hollywood. Mary Baker Eddy had a vision in 1868 (memory?). God showed her the way to health through science. The origin name was the Church of Christ, Science. The group was affiliated with the Church of Christ founded by Alexander Campbell. Now you know everything I know or think I know about it. The Adventist Movement actually gave us the health club. The health crazy that took place around the turn of the twentieth century was caused by Ellen White. Much of what medical science knows about diet came from that movement. Ellen White founded the Adventist Movement on a vision. She claims God told her the world would come to an end in 1841. After many more dates and many more failures, she changed the vision. Now the religion claims Michael, the archangel, ascended to the throne at the right hand of God. SDA, Evangel Adventist and the Branch Davidian (David Koresh) all deny the deity of Jesus Christ. | ||
| mcmstaff78 Member Username: mcmstaff78 Post Number: 52 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 208.61.5.114 |
Did (do) you make them go to school? Do you make them do their homework? Did (do) you make them clean their room? Did you teach them common courtesies and then enforce their behavior? | ||
| trainedobserver Member Username: trainedobserver Post Number: 52 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 198.49.119.13 |
"Tom Cruise is probably the best known CS in Hollywood." Whoops! Tom Cruise is a Scientologist not a Christian Scientist. | ||
| rachelengland Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 61 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 216.109.192.236 |
I think Cruise is a scientologist..they too are pretty much dead set against medical intervention..it's all about the power of the mind-he claims to have overcome his dyslexia thru this movement... Thanks for the information on the Adventists- I never knew much about them(gives me something to look into)..the relatives I had, that were involved in this Church -which worships on Saturday were very far removed, though many of the things I was taught as a child sound quite similar to their beliefs on health... I don't know- is there a perfect faith to follow..? | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 77 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Ms. rachelengland It is my understanding that the two are one and the same . . . Christian Science and Scientology. As far as Saturday worship goes, I attended a church named Seventh Day Baptist. On the funny side, it was located in Lost Creek, WV. A bad omen? Quoting: "I don't know- is there a perfect faith to follow..?" End quote. Yes! Biblical Christianity. | ||
| rachelengland Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 63 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 216.109.192.236 |
I think they may have some similar beliefs but the founders(hubbard and Eddy) definitely have differences about the origin of man..You better check it out since you seem to enjoy studying cults Biblical Christianity...so many translate the Bible to fit their own denomination and agenda..so that is a tough one.if I followed Biblical Christianity I would be wearing a long skirt and covering my head.. | ||
| trainedobserver Member Username: trainedobserver Post Number: 55 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 198.49.119.15 |
"It is my understanding that the two are one and the same . . . Christian Science and Scientology." Well you're wrong. You seem to know about as much about this topic as you do humanism. There is a cure for it though, it is called honest study. | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 79 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Ms. rachelengland: I would say you are right. The reason I don't deal with either group is I know nothing about them. You are wrong. Biblical Christianity has nothing to do with wearing long dresses and covering your head. Like many errors introduced into the church, works were a way for the Romans to earn their way into heaven. Many cyears ago, a Roman priest wrote a thesis on sin and the confessional. The Roman church assigns a given value to each sin, thirteen Hail Marys, for example. Each good work is assigned a value. If in the finally accounting, your good works exceeds your sin debt, you may go direct to heaven. If not, you go to purgatory to earn more points. or You/your family has two possible choices. 1. Pay a priest to pray you out of purgatory or 2. Buy an indulgence from the pope(an indulgence is a get out of hell free card). Anyway, God does not have a dress code. Allow me to back track for a moment. John Wesley came to Georgia Colony Company Incorporated as primate of the Church of England for the expressed purpose of working out his salvation among the red men(Native Americians). The false doctrine of works based salvation is part of many religions, not just the Roman church. | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 80 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Mr. Trainedobserver: As I said in another thread, if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. You are acting like a spoiled child. | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 83 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Here is another twist, though off subject. Brattleboro, VT has no ordinance against public nudity. Several elderly people have been spotted in downtown dressed in the all-together. | ||
| trainedobserver Member Username: trainedobserver Post Number: 59 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 198.49.119.15 |
"As I said in another thread, if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. You are acting like a spoiled child." If you think that I am intimidated by your demonstrated lack of knowledge of subject matter and honesty ... you are delusional. Smoke some more of that crack. | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 89 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Mr. Trainedobserver: Thank you for your suggestion. | ||
| rachelengland Intermediate Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 104 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 216.109.192.236 |
"Here is another twist, though off subject. Brattleboro, VT has no ordinance against public nudity. Several elderly people have been spotted in downtown dressed in the all-together" tatm LOL...it is pretty fuuny some of the old laws that are still in books atm.. On the note of vegans however..meat today I am sure is not as pure in it's substance as it was in the times of Christ..so many hormones being fed to cattle and poultry...anyway-do they have many cows in the middle east  | ||
| the_apostolic_truth_ministries Intermediate Member Username: the_apostolic_truth_ministries Post Number: 128 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 12.208.12.98 |
Ms. Rachelengland: Do they have many cattle in the middle east? Yes, among Hindus cattle are most sacred life form. The Jew is not allowed by law to eat pork, so cattle are the preferred meat source. Muslims still practice animal sacrifices, so cattle are quiet popular in the middle east. hehehe on the funny side, now that you mention old laws. The state of Mississippi still allows animals to be butched at home. So many Muslims in the U.S. travel to Mississippi to perform their animal sacrifices. Is that funny? or Sick? Eh? | ||
| rachelengland Intermediate Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 111 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 216.109.192.236 |
TATM...to me it is not very appealing  But then again I am not a muslim..R | ||
| fatherofaking Intermediate Member Username: fatherofaking Post Number: 129 Registered: 8-2005 Posted From: 71.161.88.202 |
So many Muslims in the U.S. travel to Mississippi to perform their animal sacrifices. Is that funny? or Sick? Eh? where do you get this stuff? | ||
| ezekiel_37 Junior Member Username: ezekiel_37 Post Number: 29 Registered: 8-2005 Posted From: 64.231.172.158 |
rachel said, Biblical Christianity...so many translate the Bible to fit their own denomination and agenda..so that is a tough one.if I followed Biblical Christianity I would be wearing a long skirt and covering my head.. Not if you were taught properly. When that was written, men wore skirts!!!!!! There were no pants!!!!! and the covering is Christ, not a hat!!!!! (the end of the chapter points this out). It also tells us why we need Christ as our covering....because of the ANGELS...(fallen angels are prophecy-ed to come back during the tribulation) in His service c | ||
| yaakov2 Member Username: yaakov2 Post Number: 51 Registered: 1-2006 Posted From: 66.192.99.67 |
TATM I couldn't find anything online in Mississippi law. Perhaps, you meant Minnesota? http://www.animallaw.info/statutes/stusmnst31_59_592.htm
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| bana New member Username: bana Post Number: 7 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 220.101.159.251 |
I have a close friend who is a vegetarian (not vegan) and is also a minister in the Baptist church. She gave me an explanation of the Adventist's vegetarian views. It stems from the the story of the fall of Adam and Eve in Genesis (as I don't have access to a bible at the moment, I'll paraphrase). Basically it rests on the commandment that God gave them when they were expelled, in that he told them they could us the animals. The Adventists read this as "man" was a vegetarian before he sinned and equate eating meat with the results of the original sin. My pastor friend, believes this interpretation is unscriptual. She is a vegetarian through a lifestyle choice, not due to her Christianity. | ||
| rachelengland Intermediate Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 145 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 4.159.113.68 |
Well bana of course she thinks it's wrong-she's a Baptist and she certainly isn't going to agree with the "scriptural" ideas of a a Seventh Day Adventist... But you know what, that idea about Adam and Eve being vegetarians before the fall sounds know stranger to me than any of the other crazy things I have heard about creation... Go figure.. I wish good health and long life to all! | ||
| rachelengland Intermediate Member Username: rachelengland Post Number: 146 Registered: 5-2005 Posted From: 4.159.113.68 |
darn-it..I spelled know stranger- when it should of been NO stranger..what the heck is going on with the edit options around here... | ||
| still_small_voice Intermediate Member Username: still_small_voice Post Number: 340 Registered: 11-2006 Posted From: 207.200.116.135 |
This thread inspired me so much I am going to eat a cheesburger tomorrow in celebration. | ||
| bana New member Username: bana Post Number: 9 Registered: 6-2007 Posted From: 220.101.159.251 |
rachelengland, In Australia, there are two types of Baptist churches, one is your "Independent Baptists" (with a southern US fundamentalist origin,)and the Baptist Union (derived from the UK Baptists) and considered moderate in a similar vein to the Uniting Church of Australia (c.f. United Church of Canada). My friend is not a Fundamentalist Baptist, but a Baptist Union minister. So she is therefore a member of the moderate main stream of Christianity. (how many fundie Baptists do you know that have female pastors?) Me. I was baptised as a Methodist, which makes me a member of the Uniting Church of Australia. Although I attend "low" Anglican (ie Epscopalian) and Baptist Union churches as is my wont. When I lived in Canada, I attended Baptist (not independent fundies) and United Church of Canada churches. BTW, in Australia, "low" Anglican is similar to main stream protestants. "High" Anglican is the "incense, bells and smells" of the original UK Anglican church. rachelengland, I hope this clarifies this for you. Brother in Christ, Bana |
