| Author | Message | ||
     seekingglory Junior Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 42 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.135.208 |
The covenant to become a member of HH is a death covenant. No other expression fits. They expect you to forsake your spouse, your kids, your family, your friends, your life and your conscious to serve them and their directives. HH uses the covenant a member signs as a means of control. They compare it to a marriage covenant because in biblical terms and conditions marriage is forever. But the bible speaks of this covenant in relation to a husband and wife relationship and NOT about joining a church. But HH uses it because it is an opportune way to bond you to them and their group. Once you sign it, they have their hooks in you and you are then warned that you cannot leave without dire consequences. If 50 people leave and one of them has a terrible event shortly afterward, that particular event is broadcast to the remaining members to show what happens when you leave. They hide the fact that the other 49 are very happy and doing well in other churches. It is evil to treat people this way. It is evil to use this as a controlling tactic. If they really had the Holy Spirit guiding them they would not need this ‘contract’ to hold and control people. Virtually every church in the world operates without this tactic but a controlling group that desires to manipulate people must have some unorthodox way of having power over the members. Some members might leave but HH has found ways to tie people to them so leaving is extremely difficult. And they castigate those that leave by making all remaining members ignore and stay away from the ones that leave. Bottom line........... You must relinquish the ownership of your immortal soul to become a part of them. They own you. But then, after reading all these threads surely everyone has come to this conclusion. A sick bunch of leaders with a wicked way of treating people. | ||
| dowen Advanced Member Username: dowen Post Number: 743 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 67.9.93.81 |
Yep, you see the "light" gloryseeker. HH is full of a bunch of wicked, evil people who are either deceived or engaged in deceiving others. They are scoundrels, and deserving of your tirade against them. You, and a small hand-full of others, have been enlightened and see the Truth. Hip hip hooray! The only problem with your "enlightendness" is it is based upon lies. You read that correctly, I am calling you out, and calling you a liar. You may be sincerely deceived in your lie, but it is still a lie. Lets look at some things you said. "They expect you to forsake your spouse, your kids, your family, your friends, your life and your conscious to serve them and their directives." No, they don't. This is a flagrant lie, and you should be ashamed of yourself for propagating it. [Jesus did have something to say about those unwilling to forsake kin, home, etc., if I remember correctly] "If 50 people leave and one of them has a terrible event shortly afterward, that particular event is broadcast to the remaining members to show what happens when you leave. They hide the fact that the other 49 are very happy and doing well in other churches. It is evil to treat people this way. It is evil to use this as a controlling tactic." My my my. You are truly painting yourself in a corner here "gloryseeker"! I have NEVER been in a Church that didn't use the sins of others as an example for it's members. How many times have the sin's of King David been used as sermon illustrations? How many times? Are you willing to call virtually every Church 'evil'? Are you? I hope not! "You must relinquish the ownership of your immortal soul to become a part of them." This quote is from the pit of Hell and from the mouth of Satan. Just like any 'good' lie, it has an element of Truth, but it is a flagrant lie all the same. The only wicked one here, is you gloryseeker. (Message edited by dowen on October 16, 2006) | ||
| truth_hunter Intermediate Member Username: truth_hunter Post Number: 303 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 66.55.230.165 |
No Dowen, being deceived doesn't make you evil or wicked. But because you believe the HH leaders lies about SG,ML and myself, that is the way you now see the truth. Daniel, you double talk in your next paragraph. You basically say that HH doesn't expect you to forsake, spouse, kids etc. to serve them, but then you say that they would be justified if they did. Let me tell a few real quick stories to make a point . 1. I meet a man who was raised in an arab country, he came to know God, and his family disowned him and told him unless he returned to Islam he was dead to them. He loved God more than his families acceptance and is a strong christian to this day. Thus follow the teachings of Christ. 2. I am a man who left a religion as well to follow God, my family within this religion has told me the same thing, unless I return and submit to the leadership of HH they will have nothing to do with me. What's the difference Daniel? SG has not lied, Daniel, GL told me my wife was not to be my friend, that I was not supposed to discuss questions that I had with her. I was hardly ever home, my wife was in constant tears because I spent so much time serving "the body". My wife thought she had it bad until she began talking to other young wives who had husbands in the music ministry and found out when their husbands found them crying they were told to be quiet and be thankful that their husband was serving day and night and anymore discussion would not be tolerated . GL said he lost all his boys because he had neglected them to minister to the other young people. My parents were told that they could forget my education so that I could farm, and that God would teach me everything I need to know through my service to the body. Friends? Daniel do you not question when you go to one of your friends brother's wedding, and your friend is not invited? Daniel, every friend that I ever had that was deemed by HH leadership to be a possible stumbling block for me, I was forbidden to talk with. I could go on, but my point is, GS is telling the whole truth. He/She is cutting through all the technical and religious mumbo jumbo and stating the cold hard facts. | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 632 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 24.193.219.212 |
Hi Folks, Daniel, please consider this. There is no dialog, no discussion, with the couple of folks whose asp tongues insist on the poison of 'death convenant' .. 'pacto de muerte'. They are only showing themselves as bound in inquity and wickedness. Daniel, till they forsake the brujeria lingo I would suggest to you that you simply point out their bondage, dust off cyberfeet, and move on (even if to others here). Just a suggestion. Having shared on the two threads I will be off the forum for a bit. Shalom in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, Praxaluh | ||
| truth_hunter Intermediate Member Username: truth_hunter Post Number: 304 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 66.55.230.165 |
 Run away PRAX! You can't answer the questions, and you refuse to face the reality that HH is no different than any other pagan religion. Go ahead condemn me in your mind thinking that that will make me and my questions, facts and desire to expose the truth go away. Not gonna happen. Condemn me to hell you who think you are God. Prax this is the prime difference between you and I, while I condemn the doctrine of HH, I do not judge the peoples hearts. You on the other hand judge my heart! You say I am wicked and full of iniquity, this is true, I am! But I am a servant of Christ Jesus and so I strive to put that man behind me. How can you judge me like that? Did God show you? Did He reveal to you that I am a liar? I have no fear of you or your words, I know in my heart, soul and conscience that I speak the truth, I speak from my own experience, before God I tell no lies. I unlike UG, ML, and most others here did not come to HH as an adult but grew up with their teachings, I gave my life to follow them, I became a candidate for leadership! I was groomed by the top leaders. I had one of the most desired positions in that group, I worked in the PR department and this is where the lies became to much for me to bear. I could no longer accept the justifications for lying. I couldn't accept the fake and staged interviews that were portrayed as "one take" from the heart sharing. What a joke! LOL one time we had a church wide prayer meeting for Blair, who we were told was so sick that he couldn't get out of bed! ooooo so terrible. We prayed for hours, when I saw some of the elders leave and go in the back offices. I decided to follow only to find them in the back with Blair! Not only was he not sick in bed, but he was watching a video of old funny propaganda films and laughing his head off! And in the very next room was his church praying that he wouldn't die in bed! What a liar! Were you there for that PRAX? Dowen, how bout you? I don't think so! Were either of you told that your Grandmother had committed the unpardonable sin because she called HW a snake and liar? We're either of you prophesied to in front of 100+ people that you were Judas, taken outside and have your pastor lay down on the ground and beg God not to strike you dead, only to later basically say he was faking, and trying in his flesh to scare you into submission? How about being told that you didn't need to read your bible or pray about their ministry to you? Were you told like me to just accept it as God? You two are defending a great and evil doctrine, that is holding so many of wonderful and well meaning people in bondage. | ||
| seekingglory Junior Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 43 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.133.4 |
Daniel...Daniel....Daniel....my...my...my...tsk...tsk...tsk... You call it a lie but all inside the community know it’s the truth. I know it hurts for people to expose the truth about some place you admire. You have your reasons for not belonging. No problem. Your choice. But that speaks volumes. It sends a message because you once were there, you left and you will NOT be a part of it or subject your wife and kids to it. Yet you sit on the outside and defend their behavior. Hypocrite! You know you will not relinquish your freedom from the bondage you see inside the compound. So you keep on writing retorts. Your attitude comes out in your words. It helps us make the point. We keep writing because others must know before they too are hooked into the scam. | ||
| seekingglory Junior Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 44 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.133.4 |
Prax said.........There is no dialog, no discussion, with the couple of folks whose asp tongues insist on the poison of 'death convenant' .. 'pacto de muerte'. SG replies......We have no death pact. We speak of facts through experience with this church. There is nothing to discuss when we present plain solid facts that cannot be discussed away. You, Prax, on the other hand have no legitimate reply other than to discount the poster and use terms trying to confuse the reader. You, Prax, are a charlatan. Prax said............They are only showing themselves as bound in inquity and wickedness. SG replies...........Now you belittle yourself by calling us names. Sad sad................ Prax said...................Daniel, till they forsake the brujeria lingo I would suggest to you that you simply point out their bondage, dust off cyberfeet, and move on (even if to others here). Just a suggestion. SG replies................That’s right Daniel; move on to some discussion where you have a chance. When we present cold hard experiences that we lived through, or are currently living through, you have no viable reply. So you scream liar in frustration..... Childish. P.S............ Prax, are you illiterate or what? ‘convenant’ is spelled covenant and ‘inquity’ is spelled inequity and ‘cyberfeet’ is cyber feet; two words. If you’re going to try to dazzle folks with the unusual words and phrases to distract from the discussion at least spell the words correctly. | ||
| dowen Advanced Member Username: dowen Post Number: 745 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 24.153.236.133 |
Gloryseeker, Gloryseeker Gloryseeker. Tsk...tsk...tsk...my...my...my. After reading your post's, a few things came to mind. First, something funny. You lash out at Prax by branding him a "Charlatan", but two lines later make this pious statement, (speaking to Prax) "Now you belittle yourself by calling us names. Sad sad................" What is so sad Mr. Aspiring-to-Glory? Your hypocrisy maybe? You said; "You call it a lie but all inside the community know it’s the truth." ALL? Really? Have you personally spoken with all 900+ members of HH? Do you know them all? In my estimation it would be "glorious" to know all the members of HH well enough to make a statement like that. But oh wait, you are still seeking glory. Next, you said; "You have your reasons for not belonging. No problem. Your choice. But that speaks volumes. It sends a message because you once were there, you left and you will NOT be a part of it or subject your wife and kids to it." Here you go again making foolhardy statements that are impossible to defend. Who are you to say that I will "NOT" be a part of anything? Do you know me that well? I don't believe I have ever uttered anything even close to what you accuse me of. Next you claim; "Yet you sit on the outside and defend their behavior. Hypocrite! You know you will not relinquish your freedom from the bondage you see inside the compound." First of all, there is no "compound". You like that word because it conjures up images of the Davidians. Just a typical sick ploy of the disaffected. Then you again claim that I will not relinquish my freedom. I again beg of you, who are you to say what I will or won't do with my life? You are nothing more than a hooded, would be executioner, hacking wildly at HH. If you wish to further discuss anything with me, you must remove your hood. I prefer to look in the eye of those who attack me. If you refuse, I bid you farewell on your quest for glory. I am sure it will be difficult with that hood and all, but maybe you can get some of the other disaffected to help you find Glory. Oh, wait. Where are your so called friends? Let's see; Under Grace is busily resting, Old Watchman is out watching for cults to add to his list, Truth Hunter is gone hunting for evil at HH and Missionary Lady has already found Glory. (and is now too busy boasting about it to help you find it) If I were you, I think I'd be seeking out some new friends instead of glory... Peace, DOwen. (Message edited by dowen on October 18, 2006) | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1368 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 172.162.254.126 |
I spoke to many of them..the matter rests that many see what they have got into but it is too late...most would not want to split the family and that is what happens if you leave... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 635 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 24.193.219.212 |
S-G. Thanks for the spelling corrections. You are wrong on cyberfeet though. An ad hoc compound word is fine as a single word, with a dash, or as two words. Far more important is that you are still bound in iniquity in the world of 'death covenant' - 'pacto de muerto' .. the brujeria lingo that Mrs. Alvear has tried to bring to this forum. Remember this is the lingo that T-H tried to sluff off as -- "small and insignificant... stupid technicality" However you have shown again that you are bound in inquity and cannot shake the poison asp tongue. This has always been the principle wickedness of Mrs. Alvear's presentation here and you are supporting the evil tongue a new round of excuses to go with some previous attempts of others now properly cast aside. The simple truth is that everyone knows that you are making an accusation of a pact with the deceiver, in English and even more so in the Latin languages. To put it bluntly, you are trying to paint a picture of a suicide death-cult, making you a party to a brazen lie. And this is a very, very sick smear attempt of two or three people here. People currently bound in iniquity, who need to forego such wickedness and then .. if they have even an ounce of integrity .. apologize to the forum and HH. Yours in Jesus name, Praxaluh | ||
| seekingglory Junior Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 48 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.133.4 |
Prax said.........” To put it bluntly, you are trying to paint a picture of a suicide death-cult, making you a party to a brazen lie.” S-G says.......Au contraire mon ami, the covenant is designed and written to obligate one to this particular church without recourse. It, being compared to the marriage vows, is ‘till death do us part’. Because it is ugly in its own right, you try to attach it to some separate thought to hide its reality. Triste | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1386 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 172.133.116.192 |
My mom said I had to come under HH authority to be saved...strange that I was saved before I even knew HH...and continue to be saved after parting ways with them...they have brainwashed my mom...but not me...they do not influence my eternal destiny... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 638 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 24.193.219.212 |
S_G, if you want to say that there is a 'covenant till death do us part' or a 'lifetime covenant' involved .. then we can note that you have dropped the 'pacto de muerte' brazen lie. However you and Mrs. Alvear instead have insisted upon continuing to use the very sick brujeria lingo - a phrase that you try to justify in this thread. Any time it comes forth on this forum you can expect that I will expose and counter the deep and sick lie. This lingo has in fact exposed clearly the horrid arrogance and dishonesty of the three posters that have used and defended the usage. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| truth_hunter Intermediate Member Username: truth_hunter Post Number: 308 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 66.55.230.165 |
Say's you Prax! And who are you? You have no authority on any of the topics here, you base your ideas on memories of a bygone era. You have no knowledge of truth, but rely on your image of spirituality to exalt yourself above all here and proclaim your wisdom. The Covenant with Homestead Is a death covenant in american terms, plain and simple no greek of latin required. | ||
| common_sense Advanced Member Username: common_sense Post Number: 933 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 69.238.88.91 |
I seriously doubt that ANYONE connected the discussion of the HH "death covenant" with this "pacto de muerte" until Prax made it an issue. Whether deliberate or otherwise, it has served the purpose of distracting these threads from the real issues: 1) Is the HH covenant biblical?, and 2) Has HH added to the gospel, making it no gospel at all? | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 639 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 24.193.219.212 |
Hi Folks, And again we can see the abject deep evil in the words of truth_hunter above. Even he cannot let go of the brujeria phrase that he tried once to brush off as .. "small and insignificant... stupid technicality" What a brazen lie that was... The evil phrase has been a major part of the Mrs. Alvear presentation for months and the minions of the hardened disaffected have joined her in the wickedness. And socalled 'common sense' .. the very reason I made this an issue was precisely because of the deep evil in the phrase. (I let it go by for a long time without note giving it a chance to be dealt with simply by folks hearing from the Lord Jesus and being convicted in their hearts.) There is simply no point discussing other aspects of covenant with folks bound in such iniquity and whose tongues are poison. There are lines that any person seeking to be a child of God must draw. Integrity first. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| common_sense Advanced Member Username: common_sense Post Number: 934 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 69.238.88.91 |
There are lines that any person seeking to be a child of God must draw. Couldn't agree more! And that line starts with holding true to the gospel of Jesus Christ. 6I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— 7which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned! Galatians 6 | ||
| seekingglory Junior Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 49 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.133.4 |
Prax said............”Any time it comes forth on this forum you can expect that I will expose and counter the deep and sick lie. This lingo has in fact exposed clearly the horrid arrogance and dishonesty of the three posters that have used and defended the usage.” S-G says....... That I too will expose and counter the deep and sick lie you present when you try to negate the hurt and pain this church has brought forth on so many souls. Your lingo has in fact exposed clearly the horrid arrogance and dishonesty you represent by posting counter to any and all thoughts and attempting to trump the other posters. You have found a cheering squad for your gibberish and you delight in the applause. You suggest a more direct communication with HH instead of this board. Well, that took place prior to anyone leaving and as always they are right and anyone questioning them is wrong. So this is the only venue available that lets us vent and suggest to the world that all isn’t what it seems out there and anyone looking should take an extra look before committing to something they will later regret. | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1388 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 24.158.212.174 |
no use in trying to talk to HH we tried...they are always right...tunnel vision makes it impossible for them to see... They cannot even begin to understand the pain they have caused because they think they are doing the Lord a service... | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1389 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 24.158.212.174 |
no use in trying to talk to HH we tried...they are always right...tunnel vision makes it impossible for them to see... They cannot even begin to understand the pain they have caused because they think they are doing the Lord a service... | ||
| truth_hunter Intermediate Member Username: truth_hunter Post Number: 314 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 66.55.230.165 |
Bump  | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 758 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Thank you for the bump showing that not only Mrs. Alvear and T-H use the vile sick blasphemy-lie but also socalled 'Seeking_Glory'. This I had not remembered. And of course they all get the shill support of 'Forever_His'. ('Whose' are they? If one is a slave to defending a vile lying blasphemy.) The virulent oppositionalists actually want to continue using the vile lie. Amazing. They flaunt their utter lack of integrity, under the banner of Alvear and T_H. Now, there may be others here at a good distance from HH with some honesty, 2 or 3 who post come to mind as possibilities, however this core group, the gang of 4, is truly very sick. They all brazenly lie outright by accusing with their pet demonic-lying phrase. There is a deep and very dark spiritual sickness in that group. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1502 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.96.153 |
It is easy for Prax to stand back and call us liars as he does not even belong to HH or even plan on joining...I would say he gets a kick out of defending whatever...just to be on the other side for purpose of trying to play a game. He would not sign the vow...so his life is empty and void of really knowing what hh is like at the present other than what they want him to know... Of course they will tell him all their virtures...like they told Daniel they gave me a missionary offering... Prax must love abortion and killing for they told me to kill the baby...and he seems to think it is ok to kill a mission work...thousands of people...destroy my family... I think Praz needs to know the REAL truth about many things...and someday he will... Whatever he says about me does not bother me for I know I am telling nothing but the truth...HH and Prax and many more people in this world are much smarter than me in book knowledge but I do know I am telling the truth in plain simple English... and I am out of the backlands am in the state of Rio Grade do Norte tonight...hope to be home within two days...we have had great results on this missionary trip. | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1503 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.96.153 |
and my vow "to death do us part...is to my husband...and to God...not some sick group of some governing body... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 759 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Mrs. Alvear, your twisting about the ministry given to you - to equate that counsel with the murder of abortion - is quite similar to your 'death covenant' vile blasphemy. Now I can understand that it is more personal for you, as the question of how to be knit together with HH along with your desire to still maintain a type of personal status quo with the Brazil ministry was very much a difficult spiritual struggle for you - and the heart of God really would have needed to touch that whole issue. Oh, the wonderful glories when God's will is manifest. So I can look past a bit that particular bit of verbal junque. Simply noting it for the forum as confused, a comment coming from a realm of bitterness that clouds both rational and spiritual speech, and then go on. Unlike your vile 'death covenant' blasphemy I do not expect that others will pick up this refrain. Although with the gang of four I rule little out, Holy Spirit restraint and integrity in speech has been demonstrated to be out the window by their rush to their own 'death covenant' judgment. Shalom, Praxaluh (Message edited by praxaluh on December 19, 2006) | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1504 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.65.184 |
I have twisted nothing...our home and churches are open to all to examine... I have a personal call of God to Brazil so yes to protect the work is a personal call that God gave me...he warned me about HH...and I left... I am not confused and have no bitterness toward hh...only thankfulness that God saved us from much more than we realized at that moment... Your judging is silly...I do not even know "the gang of four". I saw Jermy when he was a member of HH and to my knowledge have never spoken personally to him...I seen the Crow family at hh and do not remember ever exchanging any talk with them... You are a wandering star...a cloud that holds no water...In fact you are making yourself a joke to readers...all your "knowledge" about a place you will not belong to that preaches a doctrine that you do not agree with... I have no reason to lie...I gain nothing and EVEN if I did I still would not lie...I am a missionary and a minister of God's word. If hh had been what I was told it was I would not be on this board warning others of the dangers of their authority doctrine. Have you forgotten I have their (HH) papers that teach all that junk? | ||
| dowen Advanced Member Username: dowen Post Number: 805 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 67.9.93.81 |
"...like they told Daniel they gave me a missionary offering..." What do you mean by this? | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1505 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.65.184 |
written by seeking glory: Do you agree with this Prax????????????????????????????????? The covenant to become a member of HH is a death covenant. No other expression fits. They expect you to forsake your spouse, your kids, your family, your friends, your life and your conscious to serve them and their directives. HH uses the covenant a member signs as a means of control. They compare it to a marriage covenant because in biblical terms and conditions marriage is forever. But the bible speaks of this covenant in relation to a husband and wife relationship and NOT about joining a church. But HH uses it because it is an opportune way to bond you to them and their group. Once you sign it, they have their hooks in you and you are then warned that you cannot leave without dire consequences. If 50 people leave and one of them has a terrible event shortly afterward, that particular event is broadcast to the remaining members to show what happens when you leave. They hide the fact that the other 49 are very happy and doing well in other churches. It is evil to treat people this way. It is evil to use this as a controlling tactic. If they really had the Holy Spirit guiding them they would not need this ‘contract’ to hold and control people. Virtually every church in the world operates without this tactic but a controlling group that desires to manipulate people must have some unorthodox way of having power over the members. Some members might leave but HH has found ways to tie people to them so leaving is extremely difficult. And they castigate those that leave by making all remaining members ignore and stay away from the ones that leave. Bottom line........... You must relinquish the ownership of your immortal soul to become a part of them. They own you. But then, after reading all these threads surely everyone has come to this conclusion. A sick bunch of leaders with a wicked way of treating people | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1506 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.65.184 |
Now Prax to deny this is to lie...think twice before you lie... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 760 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Why do you folks speak such vile words ? You are so sick that you actually now refute your own earlier words .. now you gleefully admit that you use the sick brujeria suicide-murder occult phrase simply to smear HH. All your earlier vapid excuses go out the window. You are brazen liars about this demonic pet phrase of yours time and again on this forum, Mrs. Alvear and 'Seeking_Glory'. And your shill Forever_His and your partner-in-lies 'Truth_Hunter'. Brazen liars .. about its usage and meaning and purpose in English and in Portuguese. Mrs. Alvear, you lied outright on this forum claiming that to you the phrase was like a marriage covenant. Oh, it is just a common usage in Latin cultures, you smugly mumbled time and again on the forum, while the others pretended that they believed this was the truth. And you lied about getting this phrase from HH when you actually learned its usage because it is common in the dark brujeria world of suicide and murder and the occult and often is mentioned even in media. You even know you are liars and fabricators, you know 100% that your goal is to lie up and down to make Christian community look like witchcraft, murder and suicide. You folks truly are sick. Including any who talk glibly about how they really mean no harm and respect so much the motives and intentions of HH, and they support you in your blatant lying. Not one of the posting oppositionalists has shown a shred of integrity in the face of your demonic 'death covenant' assault. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 376 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.81 |
Upon taking first communion in Homestead Heritage; "PLEDGE OF ALLEGANCE I hereby pledge from a clear conscience and in the fear of God, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and adjure any higher allegiance and fidelity to any potentate, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen, including myself;...... Testing Your Confession of Commitment | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1508 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.119.254 |
When people stand for truth there will always be a Prax around..but truth stands...I have told no lies...and what is posted will stand up in court...and that is where it will go...Whether to man's court I do not know but it will go to God's court...and all your big words, Prax do not scare God in the least for He is truth...full truth...all truth... God is kind and does not bully people around and neither does He ask us to do that. I represent His set of laws not hh made up temple patterns and laws...your words are still empty for you are not a member and will not be a member...go join and that way you can sign the covenant...you know if it is so good you should be our example by signing it....of course you would have to get off the net, get rid of your books and magazines, change your doctrine and watch blair stomp out of services when things doesn't go his way..but of course you wouldn't mind that would you since he has God's latest revelation and Jesus got upset in the temple so blair is jesus in the flesh so he can stomp out of a service and just leave the poor people bewildered....and whispering among themselves...have you forgot I saw him do just that...and cut off his wife when she tried to reason with him in front of the "church"... No wonder his disciples scream, point fingers in people's faces...they had someone to learn jit from... No, Prax blair adams is not Moses leading people OUT he is leading people into his made up bondage... This is no personal attack on Blair Adams...but on a doctrine that came from the pits of hell...a doctrine like Charles Russell...a doctrine like William Branham... Did you know that I knew Branham? A man that exalted himself as god...I have debated hundreds of his followers...when man becomes a god to a people...GOD moves out for He shares his glory with no man.. | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 762 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
F_H emphasis, again quoting HH, "and entirely renounce and adjure any higher allegiance and fidelity to any potentate.. including myself" Wow. Isn't it terrible that we are to put God fully ahead of myself? Is that not the very essence of the teaching of the Bible and the Lord Jesus Christ ? Mark 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. Luke 9:22-24 Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day. And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: but whosoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it. Maybe this is why F-H shills for the 'death covenant' blasphemy of the gang of four. It appears she finds dying to oneself to be an alien concept, so she encourages and excuses the blasphemy of the others with similar confusions and struggles. 1Co 15:31 I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 384 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.8 |
I agree that we should put God before ourselves, but that is NOT what this vow is saying, nor is it how it is applied in HH. F_H emphasis, again quoting HH, "and entirely renounce and adjure any higher allegiance and fidelity to any potentate.. including myself" Wow. Isn't it terrible that we are to put God fully ahead of myself? So, does HH leadership, ordinances, and the church = God? In HH it does. In HH you put the words from those in authority over the rights and wrongs you know deep in your conscience. You don't just put them "above" your conscience, you "renounce" it completely as a way to know God's will and what is right and wrong. Upon taking first communion in Homestead Heritage; "PLEDGE OF ALLEGANCE I hereby pledge from a clear conscience and in the fear of God, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and adjure any higher allegiance and fidelity to any potentate, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen, including myself; that I will support and seek out every truth to defend the Word of God and the ordinances of His community against all enemies, external and internal; that I will bear unto death true faith and allegiance to the Head and true loyalty to the members of this community; ...Testing Your Confession of Commitment The vow just stated that the person is "absolutely and entirely renounces and adjures" any "allegiance and fidelity" to the country, state, and local government etc...and even his own conscience. *Fidelity: Faithfulness; adherence to right; careful and exact observance of duty, or discharge of obligations. Especially: (a)Adherence to a person or party to which one is bound; loyalty This is vow heavy... This puts the person's loyalty and allegiance to the community and its laws above the laws of the land, and even the persons own conscience. "The Head" speaks to them through the "proper channel" of those in authority and even the Bible is only accepted as it is interpreted by Blair Adams. In HH I was taught that the greatest weapon the enemy had against us was to get us to question their authority: This sets aside the conscience. I was also taught that if the one in authority told me to do something wrong, (including my husband,) my place wasn't to question, it was to submit. If I was faithful in my place of submission then God would be faithful to me even it they were wrong. What in the vow, may I ask, sets limits??? The literature and the laws of HH are ever changing, "growing brighter." Even David Koresh/Howell and Jim Jones did not start out lunatics. Can you not see where the personal conscience is set aside and all of this is not only wrong but dangerous, no matter how "good" of a person BA may currently be. Can you not see the abuses that are possible? (Message edited by foreverhis on December 20, 2006) | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 385 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.8 |
HH's “How Do You Know?” From page 82 Someone who refuses to submit to God's definition of truth expressed in the authority of tangible human flesh simply desires to manipulate the truth to correspond to his own desires. He resists any truth that would represent a given beyond his own mind, and so he denies any tangible authority that would testify to the absoluteness of truth. Such a person cannot hear God's voice in human flesh, for he desires to leave truth in the abstract, relativist realm of his own mind.... From pages 94 & 95 A prospective member must trust the Spirit to give him the perfect doctrinal interpretation of God's Word, but he must also remember that because of both his limited function and his carnal nature, that interpretation will not necessarily or even normally originate through the individual himself. Paul said in Romans, ''Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God,'' but "how shall they hear without a Preacher and how can they preach unless they are sent?" (Rom. 10:17, 14-15, NKJV). So if the Spirit leads a prospective member into covenant relationship with a Christian fellowship, he must trust that God plans to reveal His truth to him through them.... | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 386 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.8 |
The Bible says: 24 Let what you heard from the beginning abide in you. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, then you will abide in the Son and in the Father. 25 And this is what he has promised us, eternal life. 26 I write this to you about those who would deceive you; 27 but the anointing which you received from him abides in you, and you have no need that any one should teach you; as his anointing teaches you about everything, and is true, and is no lie, just as it has taught you, abide in him. 1 John 2:24-27 | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 766 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Hi Folks, F_H, rarely have I seen as great a hypocrite. When your comrades blatantly lie and blaspheme with- 'death covenant' '(leader) as God' or come out with absurdities like the recent abortion junque accusation - you are 100% shill, only there excusing and encouraging every word of their lies. Sick. Yet when it comes to HH you take out a super-word-parsing machine, electron-microscope-ready, you even deceptively add your own critical phrase to attack. You even fight against the basic teaching of the Bible (denial of self before God) and you always misrepresent. You emphasize solid, substantive words like - "absolutely and entirely renounce and adjure..." etc. which is the historic wording in the United States citizenship naturalization proceedings. Do you act with such bold abhorrence against the same phrases there ? You add your own phrases about 'conscience', putting in your own words, conclusions, claims as a substitute. In fact you lie blatantly, since the words above specifically require a 'clear conscience', not to forgo conscience ! And for those really trying to learn, conscience has been defined deeply as "man’s co-knowledge with God or God’s joint knowledge with man" (Quoted in an article "Conscience: the professional and the personal".) And I believe this is akin to the HH teaching, understanding and usage. Therefore to claim that HH says you should put anything before your 'co-knowledge with God' is cynical and simply a lie. However from one who defends and thereby encourages the blasphemies above, this is to be expected. Now we could go over nuances in all this (eg. what should you do if you change your views and come to disagree on fundamental doctrines - or you sincerely and truly believe that you are being instructed to sin against God). However I cannot deign to go over every aspect of an intense and fascinating discussion - (this forum is the wrong place anyway) when the person giving the misinformation supports the most heinous horrific blasphemies without even a mild blanch. Yours in Jesus holy name, Praxaluh | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 387 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.50 |
HH's "Jesus in the flesh" provides and becomes your knowledge of God. In HH they call it salvation. It is a foundation of their doctrine. Many times while in HH, I saw and heard things my conscience screamed as wrong. I even did things myself, like not being honest when answering visitors and families questions, and shunning my friends who left. I sat through meetings where people were ridiculed when I should have walked out, or at least spoke in their defense afterward. I participated in the sham meeting for Beverly McCord. I sat there and listened to a brother testify he prays curses on a family who left and didn't say anything to him. I sat by while a group leader told a brother, who had just gave his testimony about how Jesus saved Him, that he "didn't even know Jesus" until he came to HH. I didn't go to the police when I heard about KB and the lie... My conscience was pricked at first, but the doubt casting would kick in and the whole "honor the brothers" "they are anointed and know God's will," "who am I to know what is right?" thought process would quiet my conscience. Eventually it replaced it altogether. They became my conscience. If they said it was right or wrong, then it was. "man’s co-knowledge with God or God’s joint knowledge with man" (Quoted in an article "Conscience: the professional and the personal".) And I believe this is akin to the HH teaching, understanding and usage. Yes, and they are Jesus, God, in the flesh. God's[?] knowledge is what they feed you. They say your carnal nature often keeps it from coming directly from God. If you can hear your conscience, and it contradicts the elders, you question your conscience, never them. The Lord knows I am telling the truth. | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1509 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.80.29 |
yes we know you are...people are listening and people are reading... | ||
| dowen Advanced Member Username: dowen Post Number: 808 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 67.9.93.81 |
FH, The Lord knows you are a liar. He knows your heart, and while I can only make observations based upon your postings here, He knows it's darkness. I just returned home from work, and in my mailbox was a Christmas card from two of the poor poor little lost abused lambs you and ML continually harp upon. I looked at their picture, and into their eyes, and saw a young couple I love dearly, a young couple with their lives ahead of them. A young couple joyfully expecting their first child. A young couple in love with Jesus, and in love with each other. A young couple who thankfully know little of your vile despicable lies about them and their parents here on FN. My heart broke for them when I realized that if you and your brood of vipers and jackals have your way, their innocent child will be born into a world where people think his/her grandparents and in-laws are evil cult leaders, bent on controlling his/her parent's lives. A community that, if you have your way, will view him/her as a nazi child. Robin, your actions are an outrage. Your motivation is pure evil, disguised as good. Tell me, have you even considered the consequences of your actions here? Have you ever once lowered yourself enough to think about the lives of the most innocent of innocent that your vile deeds are effecting? Have you? I think not. Think about the mothers who must shop for Christmas gifts this month, and face a community who, if you have your way, thinks that they are married to men who are nazis. Think about the babes who are destined to grow up knowing that somewhere on the web you have called their fathers devils and cult leaders. If nothing else will touch your icy heart, then just know that your disgusting and blasphemous lies are only hurting the most defenseless of all. Mothers, children and babies. If your purpose in writing the nonsense that you do is to hurt this group of innocents, then blaze ahead. And my God have Mercy on your Soul. (Message edited by dowen on December 20, 2006) | ||
| dowen Advanced Member Username: dowen Post Number: 809 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 67.9.93.81 |
Janice, Just last night I held a little four month old baby in my arms, and looked into her sparkling blue innocent eyes, and was in awe of the miracle of life. And then, while overcome with love for this little child, I remembered that you had the audacity to call her young father a nazi. Not only her father, but her grandparents as well. This innocent child, who's reputation and family you have smeared, looked at me, smiled, and for a moment, all the world seemed to stand still. But only for a moment, for as soon as her smile faded, the dark memory of your treachery floated before me, and try as I might, I could not push from my mind the knowledge that you have condemned her from the day she was born. No matter how hard I tried, I could not push the truth from my mind that even as I was holding her, you were busy erecting stakes to burn her family at. The realization that even as I held this precious child in my arms, you and your minions were busily slandering her mother and father was almost more than I could handle. How dare you Janice Alvear. Every great deed you have ever accomplished for The Cross is tainted and stained by your continued blasphemy on this board. May God have Mercy on you. | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 768 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Forever_His, You have proven that you defend blasphemous lies today. Sadly, you even put this little post on a reopened thread trying to 'support' the sick, straightforward and poisonous lie of 'death covenant'. Another attempt to support and spread the sick blasphemy, a Hitler-level 'big lie'. (Normally I would not bring the nazis into the forum, the point here is that Hitler understood and honed the concept of the 'big lie' ... a lie so brazen and full that its very super-falsity can be flipped by hearers to believability .. it is that concept that fits perfectly here). For the 'death covenant' big lie you have been the chief shill, excuser, apologist. Ironically trying to use Alvear's supposed cultural and language ignorance and awkwardness and confusion (itself feigned since she blatantly lies about the phrase's meaning in Portuguese and makes it clear that she uses the phrase precisely because it is an ugly smear). We see as above the phrase is common among the virulent oppos, USA or southlands. With the three sick forum ranters, (Alvear, 'Seeking_Glory', and 'Truth_Hunter' who all speak and support and bump the blasphemy-lie) your crafty excuses and hand-waving and diversions fill out the gang of four. All this blasphemy-support done while you (unlike the others) have a cover-story of your respect for the HH motives and intentions. Meant to try to give you some credibility since the others are a bit transparent in vitriol and confusion. Folks can see a bit more easily their base of operations. And when Mrs. Alvear straightforward lied today in her '(leader) as GOD' accusation, your thunderous silence again supports and encourages yet another sick, blatant, blasphemous lie. So when you turn around and try to relate events from a few years ago, having seen you do all sorts of twisting and misrepresentation and spinning on this forum (I tend to emphasize the real sickos that you support, the defining issues, a more subtle twisting is your forte on the less glaring issues) we can never take anything you share at face. Now when you come back after having taken an integrity stance opposing blatant blasphemous lies , spoken out of malice and deception and designed only to smear and fear, then some words you share as above about events at a meeting a few years backs or a talk you had might be a worthwhile start to discussion. (Although they should be shared on a clean forum or venue, not one tinged and singed daily by blasphemy.) Till that fundamental integrity stance is taken (which we have seen you cannot do because for you spiritual politics rules over truth) you simply have no standing. Shalom, Praxaluh (Message edited by praxaluh on December 21, 2006) | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 389 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.143 |
I have never called them devils or Nazis. As far as what I have said: The truth, when it is an ugly truth, hurts innocent people. Why am I responsible for a father’s beliefs and actions? Many men have come out of the fellowship with the weight of knowing they, the spiritual leaders of their home, had their family in a cult. I have heard these men's hearts. They knew that God had forgiven them, but it was harder to forgive themselves. They had the responsibility to search God's Word for the truth and to stand up for it. In the end that is what they did. Many of us mothers, especially me, had a big part of our families getting involved with HH to begin with. We were looking for the security of a Christian community to raise our children in. In the end, we left HH for our children. I remember when DJ stood outside the gate of HH with his accusations. It really hurt me. In the days before they moved out of the area I felt for his family. God broke through to my conscience and we went, with out clearance, to help him load the truck. I expected to see a hard bitter man. Instead I saw a humbled man who deeply loved the Lord. It had a profound effect on me. You talk about hurting. There are people in HH who hurt for reasons due to the shaming by and fear of men in HH. There are a single sisters who cry at night, because it is getting past their child bearing years, and they have not been married due to the doctrines and pride of HH. There is no one to share this with without fear. They are made to feel guilty for their sadness. They are told that they have received the blessing of singleness. There are many young ladies who will never have the joy of holding their own child. That is a blessing they will be denied because of HH and their fathers. They will hold babies, because these single sisters are called upon to do the nursery and help moms, but many will never hold their own. They will help with showers and weddings, but live with the fear that they might never be chosen as a bride. We can rejoice that the young lady you described in your post didn't end up as one of the others. I think about another young lady, my daughter, who was free to marry a Christian outside of the Church we attend. She will have her first child soon. I can only wonder if she would have this joy had we still been in HH. (Message edited by foreverhis on December 21, 2006) | ||
| common_sense Advanced Member Username: common_sense Post Number: 957 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 67.125.107.25 |
dowen & prax, You're fooling no one but yourselves with your diatribes. | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 769 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Forever_His, The depths you will go to accuse is amazing. You will try to dredge up any argument. In every way, you want to point an accusatory finger at the beautiful Christian community. Rather than speak with respect and honor, holding on to what you received, you seek to undermine and fight. Perhaps a cover for your own struggles. As one who defends the blasphemy on this forum - 'death covenant' '(leader) as God' There should be no surprise that you look at every issue with glasses against HH on firm and tight. In your para-multi-church, no-real-doctrine worlds, there are many ladies who, in recent times, have never had the blessing of being moms. Also fellows as dads. The reasons are varied and mixed. On top of that they also don't even have a real and true community at their side, a people of God, the sons and daughter of Zion, giving strength and wisdom, sustenance and direction and, if and when needed, helps, care, a hug and prayer. When this is occurring outside HH, and is truly a difficult situation, without the community of God - F_H makes no comment. Similarly there are tons of folks, even in 'Christian' environments, going in and out of marriages in a revolving-door fashion. With believers, sorta-believers and non-believers. Since this is happening in her preferred multi-church-no-real-doctrine-or-community environment - Silence about this from F_H. Then there are marriages and families sans love and dedication and vision, children wild and undisciplined, husbands and wives barely managing together, and no strong community, counsel or ministry to help bring the situation on track. Many are families in name only, in all these environments that you are putting forth as the alternative. About this deep problem, F_H is silent. And far too frequently there is overt sin, even adultery. As in the recent sick scandals among a number of the evangelical leaders. A festering underneath a blithe exterior of Christian family. Bluntly, even pornography & homosexuality. About this, F_H again only has silence. And in too many of the marriages in the multi-church environments the marriage is one of 'necessity' the timings are out of order. (If they occur at all.) Under various buffetings, media, peer, flesh, lack of Godly company and counsel (1 Cor 15:33) the order is backward. And too many of these families, not surprisingly, fracture into loneliness and separation. Single moms become a norm even in 'Christian' circles. F_H does not discuss this problem. And often in these multi-para-church environments, we have 'Christian' leaders building empires, enriching themselves in a 'crystal cathedral' manner (multi-millions are wasted) with their appearances and book empires. While their marriages dissolve even as they stray to temptations. Secretaries become new trophy wives, and the Christian leader or charismatic speaker or singer-songwriter can still be galumping along rolling in the appearances and fees in conferences and ministry. We see F_H again silent. And today the media, 'Christian' and secular, is exposing such scandals, even among the evangelical leaders. And in the often-lifeless pews such sins mentioned above and others like gambling and drug-dependency and business dishonesty and various corruptions are festering. Often destroying individuals and families. Again, F_H is silent. (continues) | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 770 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
1 Peter 1:5-9 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations: That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ: Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory: Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls. Nahhh, let's try to attack HH instead, where all this is essentially unknown, where honesty and righteousness and holiness prevails, and the various sicknesses of the society do not come to control and bind the brothers and sisters. And when such sin tries to sneak in a foothold strong and vibrant ministry comes forth, bringing forth repentance and cleansing. Oh, that this would be true throughout the 'Christian' world ! And at HH, as you hint at only, those same ladies that you try to paint here as victims, would rise in one voice in a righteous holy objection and Godly rebuke to your attempt to use them for your poltical purposes. They are stalwarts, strong in the Lord Jesus, full of fire and purpose and mercy and service in the Holy Spirit. They are filled with love and heart in the Lord Jesus Christ each and every day, they are fulfilled as women of God. In a sense that is the greatest shame of your newest assault. You would probably even accuse Paul (1 Corinthians 7:8, 7:32) in a similar manner if that would help you attack the Christian community. Beautiful women in the Lord Jesus Christ, you are seeking to distort in your attack for your own purposes of rebellion. As as you are one who defends and encourages the sick blasphemy-lies on this forum, we should not be surprised that you have found another low. Let us finish with the mind of God from his word, contrasted to the 'counsel' and 'wisdom' of 'Forever-His'. Isiah 54:1-5 Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith the LORD. Enlarge the place of thy tent, and let them stretch forth the curtains of thine habitations: spare not, lengthen thy cords, and strengthen thy stakes; For thou shalt break forth on the right hand and on the left; and thy seed shall inherit the Gentiles, and make the desolate cities to be inhabited. Fear not; for thou shalt not be ashamed: neither be thou confounded; for thou shalt not be put to shame: for thou shalt forget the shame of thy youth, and shalt not remember the reproach of thy widowhood any more. For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 390 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.138 |
1. So, are you saying that it is God's will that these sisters never marry? 2. Are you saying that it is God's willthey are not permitted to marry Christian men outside of HH? Yes Prax, the world is full of problems. That doesn't give elders the right to ban sisters from marriage to Godly men outside of their circle of authority; leaving them single for a life time if it is not their wish to be single. Worse wrongs do not make lesser wrongs right! Among all that is wrong in the world, there ARE also beautiful marriages and families. There are good Christian men outside of HH who are dedicated to the Lord and serving Him with their whole hearts. Who God has set free is free indeed. For elders to bind them under this law of men and keep them from receiving the blessing and happiness that God might want for them has no Biblical standing. Whether or not these sisters marry should be between God and the sisters and maybe her father. (And, no, the elders should not get to play God's role in this.) Again: Worse wrongs do not make lesser wrongs right. | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 391 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 69.176.48.179 |
Rather than speak with respect and honor, holding on to what you received, you seek to undermine and fight. Undermining and fighting deception and abusive and dangerous doctrines of men by exposing those deceptions and doctrines... FH | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 771 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
F-H, Noticing your 'response', I would say that even the manner you ask your supposed 'questions' is exactly in the mode of a serpent. No heart for God, simply a 'hath God said' temptress. Sad. One must wonder if you were an instigator with such demonic trickery even in your days with the people of God at HH. The apostle Paul dealt with many like you - Romans 8:26-28 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God. And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. Paul shares Godly wisdom while you spew venom. And I don't play 20 questions with a supporter of vile blasphemy. If and when you and other oppos get right about gross blasphemy, lies with a fiery stench like - 'death covenant' '(leader) as GOD' that would be an indication that you have regained a level of integrity for a real dialog, rather than the hissing that has now overtaken you. Similarly to the misnamed 'Common_sense'. Simply because there are a half-dozen or so folks here like F_H and you who post who could care less about brazen lies and blasphemies -- please don't deceive yourself. Any true Christian, anyone seeking more from the Lord Jesus Christ, can tell a blasphemy lie from the Holy Spirit truth. And you and the gang of four are bound in deception in these blasphemy lies, with one Herod-handler in the background. And I will point this out patiently each and every day, by the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ. It is only a reasonable service. To those who are concerned 'why, who' about these things - any readers here know I proved my mettle on the forum ten-fold, with a deep and strong willingness to dialog respectfully -- until these folks fell into a blasphemy darkness akin to the encompassing snarling and sneering dogs of Psalm 22 - with 'death covenant' and '(leader as GOD)'. Psalm 22:16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet. Anyone who has spent any time with HH .. a few hours or a few years, knows that Alvear brazenly lied with her new one - the '(leader) as GOD' rancid accusation. As she has done repeatedly with the other venomous lie. Silence from your gang here, no Godly correction and reproof, no help to Mrs. Alvear, no heart for God, no integrity. Zilch. These type of lies are not minor, they are not shading -- and they are not matters of perception, such lies are matters of perdition. Your in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, Praxaluh (Message edited by praxaluh on December 21, 2006) | ||
| seekingglory Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 68 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Prax, you are All Hat, No Cattle. | ||
| seekingglory Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 69 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
And your a poor excuse for a christian. | ||
| seekingglory Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 70 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
But you would make a great elder at HH. Your just like 'em. Think your above all others. Sick!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! | ||
| seekingglory Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 71 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Calling people dogs, liers, gangs... Bet Jesus is real proud of you. | ||
| seekingglory Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 72 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Satan could quote scripture too. As he attacked others. You post, he laughs. | ||
| seekingglory Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 73 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Your arrogant tirade isn't worth responding to. You think that you have all the answers. Your what we call 'Catfish' All mouth....No brains | ||
| seekingglory Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 74 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
But keep posting Prax. You just get deeper in your hole each day. And you keep proving our point. | ||
| not_scared New member Username: not_scared Post Number: 5 Registered: 6-2006 Posted From: 166.165.178.104 |
prax, i must say that you do remind me ever so much of the eldership in waco. why is that? | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 772 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Thank you n_s for a very nice compliment. Very much appreciated. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 774 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
S_G, I notice in your series of posts some concern that at times I do not write very respectfully of the oppo group here. And this is true. My view changed on this recently for reasons I made very clear. However when there is a smidgen of integrity, when you forsake proclaiming sick blasphemy-lies as in the very first post in this thread, then your concern might be legitimate. Then we would be dealing with folks perhaps capable of edifying dialog, not simply acting as sneering Psalms 22 dogs full of demonic vitriol snarling 'death covenant'. S_G, you should be able to see that you made a mistake above, enough has been patiently gone over line by line. And then you can make proper amends, and counsel the originator of the sick phrase here to do likewise. It would be good for the forum, and very good for you, and much appreciated by me. After that would occur, sincerely, earnestly, if I then spoke harshly toward you there could be a legit protestation. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1511 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.63.55 |
so I lied? Prove it....you have not proved one time anything I have said to be a lie... | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1616 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.6.111 |
Holed up in a Texas fortress, David Koresh and his followers fervently believe he is Christ -- and till death do them part... (local newspaper) got it Prax...till death do us part... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 794 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
What your point is .. who knows. It does look like you flunk elementary logic. However what should be clearer to the oppos here is how sick you are in your consuming animus towards HH. Simply sick. Every chance you get you try to smear HH as Jim Jones, Moonies, Vernon Howell or whatever. At times I try to avoid repeating some of your sick actual words. Yet even many of your comrades know that this is wrong on your part .. occasionally they might even say a tiny word of couched concern about your warped view. Yet none really have the integrity to speak up and separate from lies and renounce your blasphemies. You are their defacto leader after all, so when you lie and blaspheme in vitriol, or when you try to paint a strong, sincere Christian community as Jim Jones and others, it most be covered up and excused. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1619 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.16.161 |
SO GLAD YOU HAVE EXCUSED OUT OUR WORRY...BUT OTHERS HAVE NOT...SO WE CONTINUE OUR STAND... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 797 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Exactly ! Thanks for proving out my sharing. Mrs. Alvear lets us know that she will continue to spew blasphemous lies until some oppositionalists take an integrity stance. Yet folks with a 'sweet front' like 'Forever_His', two-faced, will not speak a single word against her continuing abominations. Others like 'Seeking_Glory' actually join in spewing blasphemy lies. So .. there are none righteous among them even on the simplest, clearest integrity matter. There tongues are - "a fire, a world of iniquity" (James 3:6) Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| seekingglory Intermediate Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 103 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Prax, I have found you a new name. It is ‘cult-hugger’. You have so many names on so many boards I thought you needed another one. You claim to be Jesus by determining which prayers make it to heaven and which ones don’t. Then you claim to be King of this board by thinking you set the standards by which all others must comply. You are so full of yourself you must be busting at the seams....LOL...ROF.. Well, cult-hugger, you should advertise your services. Anybody have a cult they want defended. We have a ‘cult-hugger’ at your services. He used to go by Prax or King or Jesus but now he is ‘cult-hugger’. He will defend your cult with all he has and call anyone in disagreement liars and all kinds of evil names. He can spew forth many despicable words to defend your cult so give him a call. | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 802 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
'Seeking_Glory', no need to spam with dup posts on different threads to try to divert from honestly dealing with, eliminating, cleansing, the sick blasphemous lies that you and Mrs. Alvear have favored, spewed and spread. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| seekingglory Intermediate Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 104 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Prax or aka Cult-hugger. You have shown again that you are bound in inequity and cannot shake the poison asp tongue You’re very, very sick smear attempt of two or three people here And again we can see the abject deep evil in the words of Prax You flaunt your utter lack of integrity There is a deep and very dark spiritual sickness in you You, Prax, truly are sick You do all sorts of twisting and misrepresentation and spinning on this forum (I tend to emphasize the real sickos, HH, that you support, the defining issues, a more subtle twisting is your forte on the less glaring issues) we can never take anything you share at face. Until you take a fundamental integrity stance (which we have seen you cannot do because, for you, spiritual politics rules over truth) you simply have no standing. There should be no surprise that you look at every issue with glasses promoting HH on firm and tight. Rarely have I seen as dumb a post as some of yours Your spirit of false accusation seems to be at work full-time. Sadly, your one skill here is many accusations I have no problem watching your little attempted mocking and hand-waving and blusters and shotgun and buckshot accusations and all on the forum Of course you make your case with your normal tiresome barrage of accusation and confusion and parsing. Actually your problem is that you say too much Your various statement/judging attempts simply falls to the ground as more accusatory arrogance You simply enjoy being an accuser. There is something dark at work. Never a retraction or apology for even the vilest words The hour is late; for each and every one of us. It is vital that we are right before our holy God, the Lord Jesus Christ. Prax, please try to take a step forward in Jesus. The vial words you speak are your own condemnation Prax continues with his consuming sickness. Every reader here who has been involved with HH knows that Prax is seeking to deceive Prax, you speak just like the Pharisees, you are a hypocrite. Prax, you are in such bondage that hypocrisies and lies blithely roll off your tongue. Your actions on this forum show your walk with God disintegrated to the level of slanderer (1 Timothy 1:11) and a backbiter and inventor of evil things. (Romans 1:30). The verse that now fits Prax is - Colossians 3:8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth. Something has gone very wrong with your tongue and your heart. You should hang your head in shame.. More importantly seek Godly sorrow and repentance. Prax, did you lose all holiness and integrity when you left HH? Is this why you left HH? The allure of dark forces and blasphemous demonic lies? I certainly hope not but the question is asked based on what we see here. You are so deceptive and cunning in your sin. The trick of the deceiver is not to over-accuse, but instead to be crafty and cunning in language Your whole approach is truly sickening, and all of this just to support a abusive cult. Is this an example of how far you have fallen away from hearing from God? | ||
| seekingglory Intermediate Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 105 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Cont........... And everybody here knows how ugly and sick this is, maybe not Prax, even when he is throwing out diversions and smokescreens. Even if he wants to rah-rah the vile words because of his defense of HH, he still knows it is sick and ungodly. Everyone knows Prax is trying hard to give the impression that HH is a safe sweet place. He is trying to give that impression here, and he wants to poison those who will listen to real life testimonies. And he has blatantly lied time and again trying to spread his poison. I will be honest with you, I am now wary of your airs of sincerity and sobriety as they have failed miserably in the past. By your statements and actions you have given yourself a reputation for sounding coy and sweet and carrying a concealed malice. P.S. Prax, or Cult-hugger, the above are all your words; just pointed back at you. And they fit you well. Prax you’re just a sick sick man in dire need of Jesus. Satan has got a strong hold on you. Find a church and get help. SOON | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 803 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Thanks S_G.. Those words you quote above are exactly, precisely the right words to describe those who daily blaspheme with lies like - 'death covenant' and '(leader) as a GOD' and 'kill babies'. When the blasphemy sickness stops from Mrs. Alvear, yourself and others, the words describing the sickness will then be finished, completed, and no longer needful and proper. And I look forward to that day. Lord Jesus, open their eyes. It could be upon us quickly, as soon as a few oppositionalists show some integrity and seek to restrain tongues that blaspheme. Waiting patiently. Shalom, Praxaluh (Message edited by praxaluh on January 02, 2007) | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 411 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.192 |
Prax, ... the above are all your words; just pointed back at you.... Whew, SG, I honestly was about to say something to you. I was worrying as I was reading that maybe you fell into the same wallow of condemning. As I was reading, I was thinking, "SG was in HH long enough to pick up on the "you scumbag" dialog. My heart was breaking that it had effected you enough, and became apart of you enough, that you could spout it so well. Whew, I thank God that those words did not originate in YOUR heart! Reader, I want you to know that this type of condemnation is the norm from those in authority over you in HH; Leaders to members, husbands to wives, parents to children. Some young men are told they have a murderous spirit wishing to kill their fathers so they can have perverted relationships with their own mothers. Some young women are accused of being _hor_s if they walk wrong or men look at them wrong. If a woman has a concern against her husband she is a man hater and a lesbian. If you don't submit well enough you have committed the sin of witchcraft and rebellion against God. If a man doesn't have his wife and children broken into immediate and unquestioning obedience then he is a passive effeminate. On and on it goes. I have always chosen NOT to use the "term death covenant" and I have repeatedly said that using Praxes definition of the phase does not properly describe HH. Yet, according to Prax, because I will not rebuke my elder for using the phrase with her own given definition, I have committed the unpardonable sin of Blasphemy. I am going to Hell. Condemnation from the accuser of brethren; I am use to it. God has given me victory over it. I wish that the two mothers of HH, (that were so distraught and without hope of pleasing God that they sought to commit suicide and take their children with them,) had never met up with this kind of condemnation. My guess is those children would still be alive. This is why I do not condemn the members of HH. This is why I do not stand against them. I stand against the doctrines and the verbal, spiritual, and physiological abuse it brings. I have received MANY e-mails from new posters here on this board, (and I received another one yesterday,) that say they can't handle the condemnation. So Prax it is working like it works in HH; keeping some of the opposition quiet. But it is NOT going to work on me. After seven years of hearing people treated this way... I am calloused to it. Praise God. May He shield the hearts of the other posters and members in HH like He has mine. Prax, if you think a reader, who is not use to this sort of bludgeoning is going to be impressed by it, you are wrong. I am willing to bet they are skipping over your posts knowing they will be more of the same. The dark spirit that a person feels when reading them is too much to take. That is why I didn't recognize the words that SG quoted; because I don't read your posts like that anymore. Please take to heart what SG is trying to show you. Please, everyone here, remember our fight is not against flesh and blood, but against principalities and darkness. Stop the name calling and the personal putdowns. With sincere love, Forever His | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 808 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Amazing... 'Forever_His' still defends the Alvear 'death covenant' blasphemy, even today, even after some folks had woken up in her camp. 'Forever_his' knows 100% that there is no excuse for this vile blasphemy. Mrs. Alvear's own words have shown the sick background of her usage, that she is trying to imply murder and death in covenant, precisely the brujeria and suicide and assasination and murder and witchcraft sense of the phrase, something everyone here knows. And Alvear's other backhand 'explanations' (that this is normative language in her culture for a marriage covenant and that it is HH usage) have been exposed as simply tissues of lies. Carefully and accurately exposed. Yet 'Forever_His' still gives Mrs. Alvear the 'wink' and the 'nod' that the sick, vile, lying blasphemy is okay by her. 'Go for it, hatchet-woman, I'll be the nice front-woman shill for ya.' Forever_his has consistently taken this 'defender of vile blasphemy' stance. F_H also refuses to say a word about the other blasphemies from Alvear, the 'killing babies' sickness or the '(leader) as a GOD' lie. Sad. Integrity first. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1638 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.92.146 |
God knows the truth....that is the most important thing | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 414 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 69.176.48.179 |
F_H also refuses to say a word about the other blasphemies from Alvear, the 'killing babies' sickness or the '(leader) as a GOD' lie. I think IF the "Killing of Babies" if referring what they said to her, it probably should be used in context. IF she is talking about the children that have been killed by their HH mothers, she should probably use that in context too. As far as the leader (s) as God comment, I have expressed my view on this line of thinking many times. Listen, I am not a moderator of this forum nor am I a thought police. You have taken that upon yourself. You are not going to force me into too... I especially have no obligation to police this sister. She is more mature in Jesus than I am, and I do not feel comfortable rebuking an elder on your whims. She has many respected elders over her who are more qualified. I am responsible for my posts and she is responsible for hers. If I feel led to comment on one of her post I will. You aren't my God, and you aren't my conscience either. I had enough of that in HH. If you are a brother coming in love I thank you for you opinion and concern. I have considered it and you can drop it now. My conscience is clear before God. | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1639 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.119.112 |
I have mentioned over and over and Prax just tries to change my words...or maybe I do not express myself well... However...You may look back over from post one until now I have said that HH leaders told me to kill the baby...refering to the work in Brazil. Prax paints me as a proud some type person the whole truth is I knelt before them (HH leaders)and wept in the cabin and begged God if I were wrong for protecting the Brazil work for Him to show me...I could not let a group of men who know nothing about missions tear down what it took a life time of sweat and blood to raise up... My husband was there he told me we needed to get away as fast as we could from that cult and never return. And why kill my baby? (Brazil work) what did my baby do to have to die at their hands? 10 thousand redeemed...washed in the blood...why kill them? if he speaks of the murders that took place at HH then he must speak to the first one that told it...I only repeated what I found out to be truth...I do not think a religion of God pressures people to the point they kill their children...spiritual or natural... Prax reminds me of a bull locked in a cage...fights but doesn't even know what or why he is fighting...If HH was worth fighting for he would be there...and if he believe Jesus in the flesh doctrine he would be there for who would not like to see Jesus in the flesh?He doesn't believe that junk...He likes to debate...look at the other sites he writes on... | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1640 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.119.112 |
Tonight an old Catholic man walked in our church during the call if anyone wanted to become a believer he raised his hand and came to the front and asked to say something... "Sunday", he begin was the frist time I have ever been to a believer's church...I came bent over and very sick but sometime in the service my pain left and I straighted up...my back pain was gone...I have come back again to night to say I have been to worship the gods but help did not come, I went to the witchdoctor and he only took my money but when I asked for relief from my pain among the believers I have been without pain for three days now... So tonight another lost sheep came into the fold...heaven rejoices...hell tremebles at her loss... I am overjoyed that one of God's lost lambes is safe... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 812 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
'Forever_his' - you are the main oppositionalist who has actually tried to make excuses and defenses and smokescreens for the Alvear anti-HH blasphemies and most especially the vile 'death covenant' blasphemy. You took upon that role of shill for the acrid viper words. And when the multiple lies and contradictions and horrid motives on this d.c. blasphemy were exposed and laid bare .. you just went into a cutesy monkey-no-see denial silence. This makes you the accomplice, and culpable. Reading her posts Alvear has made it clear that she will want to continue in such sick blasphemies everywhere she can - as long as she doesn't get a lot of flak from oppo comrades. And that means you, her blasphemy defender, more than anybody. Alvear will continue on Factnet, in private, in public, with Brazilians who will think HH is a brujeria cult or naive church people who will gasp in horror at the murderous implications of a 'death covenant'. Folks are not dumb like you pretend to be. Stop playing stupid. The blood of her flaming-tongue sickness is on your hands 'Forever_his'. You have totally abandoned your own conscience before God and the very real spiritual need of Mrs. Alvear - all for the mess of a porridge of politics. More especially since you put try to put forth the phoney front of a measured sweetness - while 'winking' and 'nodding' to Alvear that you have no objection if she continues to be the hatchet-woman spewing the poison asp blasphemy. You will be the junior supporting the elder of vile blasphemy. And God sees through your transparent sham game 'Forever_his'. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1641 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.119.112 |
Prax you have given your weird definitions for the death covenant... Since I was asked to refrase to death do us part...that is what I have used...to death do us part to me seems the same expression...but I have been in Brazil for 40 years it must be soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo different to you... MY mom said death is the only reason she would leave HH...Why? Because she made a vow that if she leaves there she divorces God...and her only hope back to God would be to come back into her covenant... How can we make a covenant like this to some man or men??? Our covenant is to "GOD and to Him alone...He shares that glory with no other man...Of course my mom believes what they say is Jesus talking to her... Do you not know that is dangerous? You are so smart to be so dense...YOU KNOW better for you would not make a covenant like this...why do you try to get others to? Do you get a good feeling when people drive their cars into deep rivers and death is certain? You give me the creeps...I cannot imagine a God fearing man say some of the things you do...much less give the advice you give when you YOURself do not obey your own ramblings...lol | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 815 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Hi Folks, The only 'creeps' is simple, that Mrs. Alvear continues still with her vile blasphemy lie-phrase. Alvear, "weird definitions for the death covenant" Alvear continues in this sickness with the defacto full support of Forever_His, and some of the other oppositionals. Sincere thanks to Under_Grace who on Tuesday had the candor and probity to ask for the end of this usage. May his earnest request be received fully and quickly. Shalom, Praxaluh PS. We have discussed on other threads the root core reason why a person would stay wedded to such an acrid blasphemy. How it could happen that one's tongue could be so unrestrained. There really is an underlying unspiritual component involved here that folks might want to consider. None of us should want ever to be in this type of place. (Message edited by praxaluh on January 04, 2007) | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1644 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.2.14 |
A covenant unto death made to some mortal man concerning your soul is dangersous...and fear of breaking it is more dangerous...and not knowing the doctrine when you make it is almost cruel...and the cold reality none do for it is everchanging as the light keeps shinning brighter and brighter on their pathways...same thing the JW say...wonder who has the brightest light? (Message edited by Missionary_lady on January 04, 2007) | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 416 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 69.176.48.179 |
Under_Grace who on Tuesday had the candor and probity to ask for the end of this usage. I second the motion. Let’s move on. The dear Sister has already stated that she isn't using the phrase any more!!!!!! I think makes everyone. If everyone has agreed not to use the phrase again why do you go on and on.... If we agree to do it your way... and you still run on at the mouth/fingers  ... why should we even try? So PLEASE acknowlege that we have made peace and let's find something else to debate. Prax I am sorry I ever offend you to the point of frenzy. Your feelings do matter to me. If I can get my full point across in a less offensive way, I will try from now on. OK? I will try to be a peace maker as long as I don't have to compromise the truth any. No guarantees on my perfection... but I WILL try. As a mother of eight I should be use to mediating. | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1645 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.2.14 |
Yes, I agree lets move on without compromising our stand... | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 418 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.126 |
Dear Sister, When you type an unbroken long chain of letters or symbols, the width of the thread is stretched to fit it. This makes it difficult to read the thread. Just thought I would let you know. God bless you, FH | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 821 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Hi Folks, F_H "The dear Sister has already stated that she isn't using the phrase any more!!!!!!" Please F_H. Where ? Even in the first post where Alvear sort of indicates that she is/will/has rephrased she still used the vile words as her sick truth - just two hours before your post: "Prax you have given your weird definitions for the death covenant.." You didn't read that, F_H ? Look above. She also was either confused or lied by saying that - ".that is what I have used..." when she has been posting and reposting the sickness most every day. So we don't have any surety that she is really even stopping here on forum. Look, if the forum finally does really gets cleansed of this sickness, that is excellent. The sickness is so imbued in Mrs. Alvear she will use it everywhere else she can get away with it, including to those in Brazil who she will try to poison. She cannot even acknowledge before God that her tongue has been wrong. She is willing maybe to stop here because, with much effort, it was exposed. A tactical move. It is very sad that Mrs. Alvear doesn't have the integrity to really end the vile speech completely, everywhere, and the fuller integrity to apologize for the offense these last months before God. Now, if the forum itself is cleansed of lies and blasphemies, such as 'death covenant' and 'killing babies' and '(leader) as a GOD' that is fine. Clearly, such will improve the forum immensely. And of course the need for me to counteract the sickness will be obviated. That is common sense. I have no desire to speak about an offense on the forum if the offense isn't there. Until recently hardly anybody would take a stand, not even a mild one. we agree to do it your way... and you still run on at the mouth/fingers ... why should we even try? Simply put, it never should have a situation of 'my way'. This was simple integrity. Simple honesty before God. There was never anything complicated about this. If you don't 'try' to stem blasphemy lies you don't hurt me, you destroy your own walk with God. So PLEASE acknowlege that we have made peace and let's find something else to debate. Well, I haven't seen it happen yet since Alvear angled to repeat the same blasphemy lie just two posts ago. However if it comes to pass - Thank you Lord Jesus for cleansing this forum. At least this forum will not have the stench, even if it is still carried off to Brazil and various travels and other venues. Prax I am sorry I ever offend you to the point of frenzy. Your feelings do matter to me. If I can get my full point across in a less offensive way, I will try from now on. OK? Ok. There was no frenzy. There was an uncompromising conviction that I must act fully and completely and resolutely to bring an abomination to an end on this forum. If a good result is finally upon us, we can all rejoice. And if everyone speaks in a less offensive way as a result, you, me, this one, the other, that is also most excellent. We shall see, I will be happy to try to give everybody the benefit of some doubt in a time of transition. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1646 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.94.123 |
lol | ||
| seekingglory Intermediate Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 108 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Cult Hugger aka Prax, First, the covenant ML is referring to is a covenant between people of a community and has NOTHING to do with GOD. If you leave the community, you break the covenant; therefore the covenant is ONLY with the community. If the covenant was with GOD then one could maintain the covenant as long as one stayed in the Body of Christ. As a result the term blasphemy does not even apply here. The term blasphemy means, ‘The defamation of the name of God’. ML is not referring to GOD, she is referring to this community and their pact, deal, treaty, contract, agreement, amalgamation and union WITH EACH OTHER. (Now I know that some of the HH leaders THINK they are Jesus but I assure you they are not.) | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1649 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.121.173 |
that is true I have never been against a covenant with God. We all have made a covenant with God. I hope to never break my covenant. I have always and everyone knows this been against making a covenant with some man made organization...until death do us part...even in marriage we make a covenant but there are legal reasons that a convenant can be broken, marriages can be anuled. Sometimes things are not what they seem to be...I know one person that "thought" he married a women...in the bed it was something else...that may be far out but as a minister and missionary we have dwelt with lots of situations. Sadly people make covenants with what they see...it sometimes is different when reality sets in... I say if you made a covenant with some man made cult or even what could be a church it can be broken... I think God gives us common sence and guidance by His Holy Spirit and it is HIS SPIRIT not some proof copies of some man made ideals that should lead us and guide us. | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 822 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Not surprisingly, even after seekingglory says he will not use the vile 'death covenant' blasphemy he tries to play sophistry games. F_H, I told you, this is a deep spiritual principality of bondage upon these people that you have been supporting. Very deep. They are in a place where they simply cannot restrain their flaming tongues, as we saw last night with Alvear. Bitterness consumes them and any attempt at moderation and warmth and respect cannot be tolerated. That is the root, the core of the matter. A deep and ugly rebellion against God, which manifests in the continued usage of the BLASPHEMY of taking a marriage-type Christian community covenant and lying to the world as if it were a brujeria or Jim Jones or assassins or suicide-pact 'death covenant'. Yet still trying to find ways to defend and excuse the sickness. blasphemy impious utterance or action concerning God or sacred things. irreverent behavior toward anything held sacred, priceless Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1650 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.121.173 |
If HH and their covenants are so sacred please by all means go there and be subject to them... | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1651 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.121.173 |
and by the way there are more ways than one to assassin a person...there are dead living people..and not talking about people that are dead to pleasures of this world...their whole lives are dead....they have no chioce, can not make decisions, all they know is follow orders. They are brainwashed...the living dead... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 824 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Alvear, "assassin a person..dead living people ...lives are dead... the living dead..." Yet again .. more of the exact same type of sick blasphemy from Mrs. Alvear. (This is the problem with only a tactical limited restraint as opposed to a real Holy Spirit inspired repentance-cleansing.) Here is Bible sharing for the oppositionals. 1 Corinthians 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: I have implored you to deal with this, suggesting you make every effort privately and every clear statement publicly. The blood of these blasphemies is on the hands of the silent, the willfully mute. Shalom, Praxaluh PS. And let this act as additional proof, as if any were needed, of the actual motivation behind the vile d.c. phrase. (Message edited by praxaluh on January 05, 2007) | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1653 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.41.253 |
and the blood of the destroyed at HH is on whose hands? | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1654 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.41.253 |
I will warn people what awaits them...if they listen to you and go..then time will tell it's story... | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 419 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.156 |
Hi Prax, Hear my voice ok... Right now I am calm and collected, speaking softly with love. I am not being sarcastic or taking any sides. Between you and me... I am trying to understand your passion on this. I understand your love for the people in HH. You won't believe me, but I would guess that I love the people just as much, if not even more than you do. And that is the best reason for such passion. That passion I understand... What I don't understand is your passion for the HH covenant itself. Help me understand it. Do you believe, as BA suggests in his writings, that it *IS* THE New Covenant spoken of in the Word of God? Sincerly FH | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 826 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Hi F_H, Please consider. One is not even in a position to talk about covenant views - appreciation, questions, concerns, commitment, scriptural discussion, biblical precedent and more - all which ways - unless one clears the air (or the 'playing field' if you will) of the smog and sludge first. To discuss beautiful Bible and community issues (whatever ones view ultimately of covenant within HH) is not possible where an environment of mud and gunk has been laid and is tended by the oppo ground crew. Pearls are not to be cast into slime. When and where the atmosphere is sensible, sanctified, with a nice degree of holiness, with respect for HH from the main sharers - no matter how wide the gaps and differences, even if the doctrinal divide is a mile wide - then such deep discussion and sharing could be appropriate. However the last few days have confirmed that this is unlikely to ever be possible on Factnet, for the reasons I have shared above, by what we have seen falsely passing as peace, and more. May your weekend be peaceful and joyful in the Lord Jesus. Shalom, Praxaluh | ||
| pilgrim16 New member Username: pilgrim16 Post Number: 3 Registered: 1-2007 Posted From: 72.183.96.81 |
prax, are you saying that HH does nothing that cannot be defended rationally? | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1657 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.91.123 |
Prax is left without a choice..so he quitely signs off for the weekend...lol | ||
| seekingglory Intermediate Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 111 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
Prax cannot answer F_H question. He cops out! Figures...... | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1659 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.91.123 |
Never can he or Daniel answer a question...They resort to name calling. This is very sad for they are trying to uplift something God hates. In their hearts they know God is not in favor of mistreating His lambs but ties to HH is greater than truth to them and that is so sad....for Daniel I could see it but am surprized that Prax holds up things he knows are wrong. I just cannot do it even though I have friends at HH. I cannot agree with gross error for friendship...Guess I have been a missionary too long. I love truth... | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 828 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Hi Pilgrim, Greetings. May you be a pilgrim who does make progress. Please feel free to read back the archives, noting my posts, to answer your comment. (On second thought, reading the archives has its pluses and minuses.) I have commented in depth on tons of specific stuff, 'rationally', logically, conceptually, you name it. . Gone through word-parsings and Pharisee argumentation and slanted remembrances and sought to straighten them out point-to-point. In some cases, like the 1 John and 2 John verses, I seem to be the only person interested in the scripture verse exegesis. In another case we had a hearty discussion about Bible verses around a number of issues, including the claims against oneness and the efficacy of water baptism. Maybe I can find the threads. In general, if I don't know something or am seeking God more or awaiting his timing and searching and wisdom, I hold fast to those two special words .. 'I dunno'. The dunno realms may well be my widest and greatest expertise. I realize you are a bit new here and have kept your own background and views aside. That is your privilege, simply understand that we have little idea what are your personal angles. My view on the forum as a whole really changed a lot a little while ago and I have explained in quite some depth why. So when certain folks here bark to me to 'jump', nope, I really don't ask them how high. While with others I bend over backwards to hear every word and give a full response, maybe even on forum. By the grace of the Holy Spirit I would like every word to be instant in season. My email is praxeus@bigfoot.com for any who sincerely want to sound me out, or share with me their sense of things, without the noise and agenda of the forum here. At this time the forum is essentially worthless for those really trying to learn and discern. Shalom, Praxaluh (Message edited by praxaluh on January 06, 2007) | ||
| foreverhis Intermediate Member Username: foreverhis Post Number: 431 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 12.162.187.116 |
ME: Prax, Do you believe, as BA suggests in his writings, that it *IS* THE New Covenant spoken of in the Word of God? I asked this because I WAS preparing to TRY to figure this out and hopefully mediate a little. It would help to know why you call their actions blasphemy. The next question I was going to ask is what your definition for blasphemy is. I just don't see what you are seeing, and I really want to help. If you can convince me that it is GOD being blasphemed, I will say more to them out of concern for their own well being. By the way S_G, I appreciate your views, but I am sorry that you have resorted to name calling. It seems below you. It's your right, your freedom... but I was just hoping we wouldn't slip to that level. I think you made your point, and the name might very well fit, but it isn't helpful to instigate. Just submitting my opinion... I hope there are no hard feelings. FH | ||
| pilgrim16 New member Username: pilgrim16 Post Number: 4 Registered: 1-2007 Posted From: 72.183.96.81 |
I know you have rationally defended HH; but my question was if you believe they do things that cannot be rationally defended? its a simple yes or no question. I know that a person could defend another's right to do things that that person does not personally agree with. Doctrinal things for example. But moral things are different. one cannot defend another person's right to do something immoral. maybe you feel the line separating the two things is too unclear: the other people here feel that the line is extremely clear and that HH has crossed it in several places. Just trying to clarify not attack you. } | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1661 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.40.187 |
I don't quite understand your question but let me ask you this. In the light that a church covers up for a father raping his child according to posters. A mother kills her babies because of pressure then the church instructs her to lie...Could we really say real men and women of God would do this? If you child was raped by your husband and your pastor found out, what would he do? Would your pastor instruct you to LIE that you were not a member of his church if you killed your babies? In the light of scores of criminal and other type offences that have been posted here and not by me but by others would you say a GOD FEARING Leader would do such things? People do not post criminal activity on a board like this knowing some have families involved there and the consequences that could follow without it being true. Some could say I don’t like HH because Of this or that and it be just a petty difference But when killing and rape is concerned and hidden I consider it very scary. I raised 11 children only one was my own birth child, besides them scores of other children have lived with us and even right now my home is always full. I have dealt with Children that have been raped, beaten, left out on the road to die…I know their fears….sitting up at night holding their little hands in mine. NO, a thousand times no. I cannot uphold a place where children are sent to their room for days, a place where people are mistreated in the name of crucifying the flesh. I just cannot do it…No matter what Prax calls me or what Daniel says I will not take up for wrong doing. | ||
| pilgrim16 New member Username: pilgrim16 Post Number: 5 Registered: 1-2007 Posted From: 72.183.96.81 |
my last post was a for prax. | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 829 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
Pilgrim16 ".. my question was if you believe they do things that cannot be rationally defended?" Fair enough. That wasn't clear above. No I haven't seen anything undefendable. Keep in mind that often I am asked to comment on one-sided presentations here, when I have experienced what sound like similar situations that I view very differently. So on a lot of things I would simply consider and reserve any type of conclusion comment, perhaps combined with a little hopefully thoughtful mini-explication. "its a simple yes or no question. I know that a person could defend another's right to do things that that person does not personally agree with. Doctrinal things for example. But moral things are different. one cannot defend another person's right to do something immoral." Yes, this is a reasonable distinction. "maybe you feel the line separating the two things is too unclear: the other people here feel that the line is extremely clear and that HH has crossed it in several places. Just trying to clarify not attack you." Your explanation is fine. The short answer is no, I have not seen HH cross moral lines. And many of the situations given that tinge here just don't appear substantive and fair. Now I can understand all sorts of folks sharing heartfelt questions or wonderment or concern on many different levels (I cannot think of any group in the world unsubject to consideration) however I consider their morality quotient to be top-notch. In fact it is high enough that I very much hesitate to put myself in the position of doing weighing. Matthew 7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Your doctrine/morality distinction is worthy of note. Since the oppositionalists tend to play both side of the fence, some rather bitterly trying to accuse on ethics and morals, others saying that the HH motives and sincerity are generally top-rate yet disagreeing on doctrine. That is one of the problems on the forum, one of the reason why I am reluctant to do a lot of back-and-forth banter, the mixing of destructive dissonances in approach. Shalom, Praxaluh (Message edited by praxaluh on January 06, 2007) | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1664 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.147.37.173 |
Prax is OFTEN asked to comment... Wonder who asks him???? | ||
| seekingglory Intermediate Member Username: seekingglory Post Number: 112 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 24.162.130.84 |
By the way S_G, I appreciate your views, but I am sorry that you have resorted to name calling. It seems below you. It's your right, your freedom... but I was just hoping we wouldn't slip to that level. I think you made your point, and the name might very well fit, but it isn't helpful to instigate. Just submitting my opinion... I hope there are no hard feelings. I concur and I express regret to Prax. Steven, please accept my apology. | ||
| praxaluh Advanced Member Username: praxaluh Post Number: 850 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 74.73.4.159 |
S_G, Apology accepted. You and Forever_his would do well to acknowledge that there was not a basis for the 'cult_hugger' stuff, humorous as it was, rather than simply withdrawing it for tactical purposes, with her rather typical backhanded 'and the name might very well fit'. In fact I am rather active in efforts against false doctrines like the Jehovah's Witnesses (eg. exposing the absurdities and inconsistencies of their tampering with the NT) or the new-age stuff in the 'emergent church' as discussed recently when the Doug Dean material was posted (note: Watchman Fellowship, Ken Blanchard connection there). And pseudo-messianic plagiarists and cultists (not my fav word, though) like James Trimm (given respectability by Watchman Fellowship) and 'Messianic' teacher Monte Judah (denier of Hebrews as scripture) or those from 'sacred name' movements who deny the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, falsely making all sorts of accusations against His name. In fact on the larger level (not my activities per se) I still appreciate today the Dave Hunt book 'The Seduction of Christianity' from years back that gave a lot of insight into how psychobabble and occultish practices can put on Christian garb, leading to the proliferation of cultism that we see today. One emphasis there was on sorcery practices (visualization techniques, inner healings, word of faith, affirmations and more) while Christian psychiatry and psychology has spawned another group of cultist teachings, as discussed by Martin & Deidre Bobgan (Psychoheresy Awareness Ministries). Since I have a reasonably decent track record in the realm of exposing false doctrines (cults, if you will) I was sort of getting a real from your former accusation. And I will let my record stand for itself. If you want to drop the topic at this point that is fine by me without any tinge. No response needed. As indicated above, apology fully accepted with thanks. Shalom, Praxaluh PS. The apology that is really, really needed is the one to the forum and to HH for d.c. | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1687 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 201.57.69.188 |
getting real? about time... |
