| Author | Message | ||
     pureheart (pureheart) Member Username: pureheart Post Number: 87 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 205.157.244.33 |
Greetings Old Watchman, I am going in opposition to my principles by 'judging' and I have retyped this statement many times. I state the following with a soft heart but a firm stance. You identify all outside your contracted values 'cults' and you form a mob mentality with this web site. I have visited most of the threads within the Factnet site and I am dumbfounded. I can't envision you as a Christian organization endorsing the kind of smear and anti-Christian propaganda being stated in many of these threads. I have been trying to reach some of these folks you are manipulating to suggest I sense Jesus does not condone these debates when they comprise Christian against Christian. These folks are God's children and you have them at each others throat. Some of these souls may be risking their eternity by joining in and forsaking forgiveness; and you, my friend, bringing this together, you have created something you will one day regret. I fear for your salvation as much as any other here. If you are truly a man of God I beseech you and your colleagues to reconsider your broad attacks on the Body of Christ. I know you stated you do not care what others think of you. How do you think Jesus looks upon all of this? As long as God leads me I will continue to plant seeds of reason and pray for those souls deceived by your intolerance. I love you as a Christian brother but I pray for your wisdom to be charitable to others. In Christ, Pureheart (Message edited by pure-heart on October 31, 2005) | ||
| old_watchman (old_watchman) New member Username: old_watchman Post Number: 23 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 69.15.65.110 |
Pureheart, I am sorry I missed seeing this post before now. I did not mean to ignor you. Please do not hold me accountable for other threads. I only started this one. It is a public forum. It is where people come to find information about groups they may have a question about. It is a place where both sides can give their views on the life of the group. They can discuss teaching, the society of the community, all manner of subjects. It is the responsibility of the individuals participating to conduct themselves in an honorable, and considerate manner toward the other posters. Perhaps we have all failed on that point. Surely you know that there are doctrines that Christians hold as absolute truth. I must confess I do not know what you believe as a Christian. You have taken up for the Jehovah's Witnesses and I believe called them Chirstians going door to door leading people to God. That is an incredibly naive statement. It is not just naive, it is just wrong. Another point you make; you feel I am costing people their eternal souls. I do not believe that a born again child of God can lose their salvation. I was once a believer in what is called the Armenian position but after years of fretting over it I was able to get past my early doctrinal training and actually study what the Word teaches by going to the original Greek. I do respect the anquish of heart you are feeling and i do not take our opposing positions lightly. I wish it did not have to be this way. My heart toward God is as open as yours. I believe with countless other Chrisatians that there are absolutes in the faith and we must stand for those truths even if we must take a stand against a brother. | ||
| pureheart (pureheart) Member Username: pureheart Post Number: 95 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 205.157.244.33 |
Greetings Old Watchman, Although you ‘only started’ this thread I seem to remember your being a member of the Factnet organization. If you are part of this group and this group maintains, finances, supports and sponsors this site then you should be somewhat accountable for its content. Exactly the way we hold T.V. sponsors accountable for the content of the shows they support. You’re allowing free posting via the free speech argument is a consideration but when posters are allowed to blaspheme Jesus then the boundaries have been broken. Obviously there are doctrines that Christians hold as absolute truth. The problem is that different Christians have different views. Review Romans 14:5 …One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind….The whole chapter applies but for space considerations………… I have taken up for the Jehovah's Witnesses and called them Christians because I work with associates who are of that faith and I know their heart. I, like you, was raised in the Assembly of God church and was taught to ‘throw those JW’s off the porch’ if they came to our house. I still frown at many of their beliefs and ways but I leave that to our Lord. Thank God I have grown to understand the love of Jesus. We will just agree to disagree on ‘once saved, always saved’. I can quote scripture all day and so can you defending each position. I will use this simple analogy for one extra thought……Your belief gives that you can sin to your hearts delight and it will not matter, since at some point in your life you accepted Christ, you still make it. If you’re accurate and I’m mistaken, since we both have accepted Christ as our Lord and Savior, then we both win and we both get to Glory. However, if I’m right and you’re wrong, then you have a lot of answers to give and you might be in trouble. Just a thought to consider. I have a win -- win………...you have a win --Uh Oh. Please respond. I look forward to your thoughts. In Christ, Pureheart | ||
| old_watchman (old_watchman) New member Username: old_watchman Post Number: 25 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 69.15.65.110 |
Pureheart I would like to correct a couple of things you said. I had not even heard of Factnet until a couple of days before I started this thread. I have never posted on any other thread on this board. I have not contributed any finances to the board. I am sure the JWs you know are fine people. We do not beleive that people in counterfeit Christian groups are evil people because of their involvement in that group. We believe that the Watchtower is a counterfeit because they teach that Jesus was the first thing that Jehovah created and that he is not God. That is all you need to know about them to call them non-Christian. However, that is not all that makes them a cult of Christianity. I do not believed or have I or anyone in Watchman Fellowshipo taught or believed that you can accept Jesus and then spend the rest of your life sinning. That is obsurd! When Jesus gives you a new life he gives you a NEW LIFE. YOU ARE BORN AGAIN! YOU ARE A NEW CREATION. YOU WALK AFTER THE SPIRIT AND NOT AFTER THE FLESH! I may be a bit rough around the edges at times but I am easily convicted by the Holy Spirit when I mess up. (I guess that one leaves me open to a lot of shots on this board). So be it. I do appreciate the chance to share with you. I do not hate anyone in HH. If I hated them, believing that they do not teach the real Jesus or preach the real gospel, I would just keep silent and let them go into eternaity. Now, I know that many of the members of HH are born again Christians. They were solid Christians before they went into HH. Now, if I still believed the way I did back when I was in AG, I would be afraid for these folks because they have left their first love and backslidden and are in jeapordy of losing their salvation. But, that is no longer my belief. The Father never gives up on His prodigal children. God's best for you and yours. | ||
| pureheart (pureheart) Member Username: pureheart Post Number: 96 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 205.157.244.33 |
Greetings Old Watchman, There I go again. Writing without doing my homework. Too many ‘irons in the fire’. I assumed ‘Factnet’ and ‘Watchman Fellowship’ were one and the same or at least connected. You both are intolerant and fail to prescribe to the teaching of Jesus. (I know that statement should give us some ‘fodder to chew’) The secretive nature of the ‘Factnet’ site…..”due to the nature of our work and security concerns we do not give out our mailing address”……..leaves a lot to be imagined. My apologies. To attack a group like the JW’s or the HH’s is to attack its members. So to tell someone they are not a Christian because they belong to a certain group is like my telling you that you are not a Christian because you are an American. After all, America is not a Christian nation. So if you prescribe to be an American I will make a case that shows you are not a Christian. It gets deep but you need the understanding. I just hope you have a good explanation stored up for all the folks you meet in Glory to which you have written unconstructive thoughts and criticism. Have you thought about what your first words will be to Charles Russell or Blair Adams or Charles Parham? Of course, I'm not saying they will be there.....you are! In Christ, Pureheart P.S. I call ‘messing up’ ………………….SINNING!! (Message edited by pure-heart on October 31, 2005) | ||
| old_watchman (old_watchman) Junior Member Username: old_watchman Post Number: 26 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 69.15.65.110 |
I "mess up" every day. That is why I John I:9 is a promise I cherish. Go back and read what I really said. I said many people in HH (that is the one we are really talking about here) are Christians. They are going to Heaven because they were children of the Kingdom before they encountered HH. If someone knows nothing of Christ and salvation before joining HH only the merciful and sovereign work of the HOly Spirit circumventing the teachings of HH would lead them to salvation. HH theology will lead no one to the real Jesus and genuine salvation. When did I question the salvation of Charles Parham? Russell won't be there. I don't know Adam's testimaony only his theology. I do know his theology does not teach the Jesus or the gospel of the Bible. (Message edited by old_watchman on October 31, 2005) | ||
| pureheart (pureheart) Member Username: pureheart Post Number: 97 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 205.157.244.33 |
Greetings Old Watchman, …..”If someone knows nothing of Christ and salvation before joining HH”….. From what I’ve read here this is almost impossible since it takes years to ‘join’ if I understood correctly. So I still don’t understand why all the trouble to attack this and other groups of Christians when we are admonished to remember we are in a spiritual battle and we need to combine our efforts to attack the forces of evil. Especially today, Halloween, this is a day when Lucifer gets to impose influence on our kids more than any other day. I just get beside myself when I see all the opportunities we have to use resources to reach the lost instead of quarrelling with our brothers. I pray you have a blessed week. Pureheart | ||
| pureheart (pureheart) Member Username: pureheart Post Number: 98 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 205.157.244.33 |
Copied from the site…… http://www.skepticfiles.org/mys1/c005.htm Charles Taze Russell, born Feb. 16, 1852, was the founder of "Zion's Watch Tower Tract Society", who later became known as Jehovah's Witnesses. Russell lived in Pittsburg and was not educated beyond the seventh grade; he had no theological training, and knew neither Greek nor Hebrew. Russell’s church background was Scotch-Irish Presbyterian, although he became an agnostic early in life. Is it possible he accepted Jesus as his Lord and Savior before he went astray? And if he did, during his time in the Presbyterian faith, then according to the ‘once saved – always saved’ thought he will be right up there with the rest……... Just a thought………. Please remember I do not promote anything the JW believe but I leave the judgment of them to God. | ||
| old_watchman (old_watchman) Junior Member Username: old_watchman Post Number: 27 Registered: 3-2005 Posted From: 69.15.65.110 |
You are right. Anything is possible. I humbly acknowledge I "messed up" in my judgement. | ||
| dowen Advanced Member Username: dowen Post Number: 783 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 24.153.236.230 |
Here is a thread where the jackal burned himself. | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1474 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.205.163.50 |
he showed more humility that you do Dowen...you must bring your parents much shame if they taught you building christian character... | ||
| dowen Advanced Member Username: dowen Post Number: 790 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 24.153.236.230 |
Just another pitchfork jab. | ||
| missionary_lady Senior Member Username: missionary_lady Post Number: 1477 Registered: 9-2005 Posted From: 200.205.163.50 |
I would be so hurt if I had boys that used the language you use to older people...My boys would not talk to an elder person like you do no matter how much they disagreed... goes to show all that blab there really does not do much good for you are fruits of their labor... | ||
| dowen Advanced Member Username: dowen Post Number: 792 Registered: 4-2005 Posted From: 67.9.93.81 |
What "language" have I used ML? I called The Jackal what he is. You, who see yourself as the great and mighty "defender of Truth" have used far worse language than I ever dreamed of. It is ok for you to treat others the way you do, but not okay for me to follow your footsteps? You sound like the far-left elitest thugs of the American Democratic Party. "Do as we say, not as we do". Call it what you will, I call it hypocrisy. And don't think I am going to let you get distracted from the mesage that Prax has been so faithfully delivering to you. You address me, while all of Prax's points and admonitions go un-noted and disregarded. You need to deal with the sick demonic "death covenant" accusations you keep making. Soon. |
