Tape 5, August 26, 1998 and August 27, 1998

Lawrence Wollersheim and Jesse Prince

L:	OK So they deliberately moved the money so that they wouldn't have to pay the judgment.
J:	Right.
L:	Anything else on that?
J:	Also, in the banks at Liechtenstein. When the threat of the IRS was there, money was poured into - It was researched out to find a country that wouldn't be subject to US laws and Cyprus, Cyprus is what it was, and a lot of money was put in Cyprus. A staff money was put there and I mean, at that time, they were having like a civil war over there, killing and on and on. It was just madness!
L:	And they still put all the money into Cyprus because they felt the government could never get it.
J:	Right. Now, the details of that I do not know.
L:	Let me ask you a question. Say, David Miscavige and his top four people start to feel the heat and that they're gonna go to jail. Who controls those accounts? Do they control these hundreds of millions of dollars?
J:	Yes.
L:	Could they leave the country and take all Scientology's assets with them?
J:	Scientology's assets is spread far beyond the United States. As a matter of fact, I don't believe its major holdings are even in the United States.
L:	Is Scientology's major assets in stocks, bonds, and investments or is it in real estate, or is it about equal?
J:	I think the vast majority is cold, hard cash.
L:	Cold hard cash.
J:	Right. Money.
L:	Who knows how much money? Who are the people who know how much money is--
J:	In Scientology? Mark Ingber. Bill Price. Wendel Reynolds probably had a very good idea when he was the finance dictator. Um, Mike Jeager would have had a very good idea.
L:	So these people, obviously David Miscavige.
J:	Yeah, David Miscavige.
L:	Marty Rathbun, probably.
J:	Yeah.
L:	Would know the total amount of money. These are not people who know where these accounts are?
J:	Right. There's another lady. Maureen somebody.
L:	Are these accounts in the name of the Church of Scientology or could they be in other names?
J:	They could be in other names.
L:	So, Miscavige and these people could take off and the only people who would know where the money is --
J:	And just have the secret accounts and all the codes, yes.
L:	And nobody knows how --
J:	Maria Brigotti.
L:	Maria Brigotti.
J:	Another heavy duty player.
L:	But a few people know where all the money is.
J:	Yes.
L:	And they're the people controlling the money.
J:	Right.
L:	Are there any checks and balances, you know, outside of those people?
J:	None whatsoever.
L:	So, the government doesn't know. The Scientologists don't know. If there was a catastrophe and they were all killed, nobody would know where the money even was.
J:	They'd have to dig it up.
L:	If they were all in a plane accident, for example.
J:	The money could be traced but I think it would take a couple years, couple of years.
L:	You think they have hidden accounts?
J:	Yes!
L:	That they don't want anyone to know exist?
J:	Yes.
L:	And who would be the signatories on these?
J:	More than likely, Miscavige himself. Or his wife. You know, he uses people that are very close to him or that have acknowledged that he's some kind of strange diety, and he uses those people. And lawyers.
L:	So they probably have some lawyers that are shilling these accounts.
J:	Yeah.
L:	Have we finished all those things?
J:	Yes.
L:	Let me ask you a couple other things. How would you describe David Miscavige the person?
J:	A very scared individual, a very unsure individual. I've had, I mean, I've talked to him. He's, he's like this: either he's totally uncertain of himself or he's totally certain of evil and he's on a vendetta. When he's demonstrating power and making decisions and showing authority, he's certain. But just to talk to him in those moments when, you know, there's not reason to do all of that, he's just a very uncertain, unsure person. He wants to know what you think. "Well, what do you think about this or what do you think about that? Well, I was uncertain." I mean, it's amazing to see the spectrum of his character as a little, afraid, unsure person to a monster.
L:	Would you describe it as two different personalities?
J:	A few different personalities, yes. Multiple personalities.
L:	Would you say that he's mentally sound? I mean, when you look at it now?
J:	I think he needs medication.